The regional fish snagging and littering problems have grown to intolerable levels! It's going on heavy on the Wind River springer fishery this season, and many other places too. It will be rediculous when the hords of coho salmon, and in many places the 'Nooks and steelies also, come in to meet the growing hords of lowlife snaggers in force. Hey_Yall posted the following suggestion thread on Ifish and I felt it important to get the word out as much as possible, and get input of solution suggestions from members. Thanks Mike. ... The thread:

THE REEL HEY_YALL
Chromer
Member # 341
posted 05-31-2001 10:22 am

Howdy. I've been toying around with this notion for quite some time after fishing some of the larger rivers here in Washington. I've noticed it has come up on the board lately. Well the notion would be a "volunteer" law enforcement net. Not the TIPS line, etc. but something I think would be much more effective. We fisherpeople could be deputized so to say: wear the game uniforms, the badge, and a walkie-talkie to radio in to directly to dispatch.
The people breaking the law usually won't break the law if someone of "authority" has the watchful eye. These lawless people could really feel the sting I think, especially if these "checkers" could issue certain citations, and have immediate access to backup.

Any other suggestions? I think this would be a great "interim" position for young career-minded individuals looking to get experience in law enforcement, retired people, or people in general who are fed up with the ways the resources are being raped.

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The opposite of Pro-gress is Con-gress.
all_4_the_chinookie@hotmail.com

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FishinMission
Ifish Forum Guide
Member # 706
posted 05-31-2001 10:35 am

I would prefer to stay anonymous. I like the "stealth" mode of reporting...although sometimes the gamies can't just show up with a phone call. Issuing citations would end the offenses (maybe) but could also get yourself hurt. Too bad people have to break the law.
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THE REEL HEY_YALL
Chromer
Member # 341
posted 05-31-2001 10:42 am

I like the anonymity as well, but the class usually doesn't cut up when the teacher is in the room. Plus, I would like them to see the face with the citation.
Yes, it could get someone hurt, but it would be just like striking an officer of the law when the uniform is on.

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The opposite of Pro-gress is Con-gress.
all_4_the_chinookie@hotmail.com

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DK
Chromer
Member # 524
posted 05-31-2001 10:58 am

good step in the right direction, but to much liability on the state to deputize any body without proper training, my suggestion is to see about getting a direct phone # for the warden of that area so people could call him direct, and if warranted he could could suggest a means of detaining or presueing evidence in convicting the person in question, you as a citizen have the right to up hold the law to what extent without getting in serious trouble i don"t know,

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fobbman
Chromer
Member # 145
posted 05-31-2001 11:20 am

I will be bringing my camcorder and still image camera with me on the 16th. Will be scanning the license plates so we have a record of all who is there and also make sure I get face shots of the offenders. Of course, I have a 40x optical zoom on the camcorder so I don't exactly have to be in their face to get a good shot...

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Artwo
Chromer
Member # 688
posted 05-31-2001 11:44 am

I wonder if a person can do a citizen arrest kind of thing. If you witness the act and have proof other than your word against their's I would think you could call the authorities and have the person placed under arrest or at least cited. You would probably have to be willing to testify against the person in court for a poaching offense I would think. I like the idea about filming violators and then following them and getting their license number. It might stop if the word gets out after some get busted. Just my thoughts.
JK


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THE REEL HEY_YALL
Chromer
Member # 341
posted 05-31-2001 12:08 pm

Of course these folks would have proper training. We had this thing in B'ham called the "Explorers" which were basically ride-along-one-day-be-an-officer types. They received uniforms, walkie-talkies, nightsticks, flashlights, the badge, ticketbooks, pepper spray, etc. They had the authority of a police officer, just couldn't carry heat.
A lot of people would want to carry heat, but think about it, this is for fishing, not hunting, so the number of people who are strapped will be less than those hunting.

I'm not talking about getting teenage kids out there doing it. Slow down and read folks and just think about it.

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The opposite of Pro-gress is Con-gress.

all_4_the_chinookie@hotmail.com


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The Steelhead King
Chromer
Member # 399
posted 05-31-2001 12:12 pm
Heh. Sorry Redneck, but that would be a suicide mission. Ain't gonna volunteer.
I will, however, keep on filming with the video camera.

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AuntyM
Chromer
Member # 820
posted 05-31-2001 12:32 pm

Hey Yall's idea is a good one. Sheriff's Departments around the state DO have trained volunteers in place. (not to be confused with Reserve Officers) They can staff a remote office, answer phones, assist with paperwork, do seat belt counts and check parking lots for handicapped parking violations. They take no action on their own.....but they do turn information (which they are properly trained to collect) over to Deputies to investigate as time allows. When you live in a community too cheap to pay for better Law Enforcement...you make do!
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Starr
Chromer
Member # 827
posted 05-31-2001 01:21 pm

On the upper Rogue river, which is a zoo this time of year, there is a volunteer group that distribute themseslves at the combat fishing areas. I don't know if they have been deputised, but they all wear a t-shirt that has a sherrif looking star on it, and every snagger can spot them instantly. Lots of times they will just sit on a rock and watch people fish. Just their pressance completly stops any illegal activity. They don't give out citations that I know of, but they do keep notes and take pictures. When someone catches a salmon, they stand right there to see where it is hooked. I saw one guy keep a questionably hooked fish and it wasn't 10 minutes later that a stater showed up and ticketed him. Nobody thought that that was coincedence, and the fear factor for those volunteers went up 1,000 points. I know a few fishermen that won't even fish holes where the checkers are.
It works extreemly well. We just need to get ahold of someone down there and see how they do it. Great idea Hey-Yall
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NO, my name is not Leadhead.


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FishheadJr.31
Chromer
Member # 404
posted 05-31-2001 07:51 pm

Hey Yall
Have you been eating paint chips again
I want to play. To many times I have seen people I my home river snag a fish and keep it and it just ticks me off to no end. I think it would be a great program and besides who doesnt like a good rumble here and there when the fishing slows
Do I get my own weapon too
O man just what the world needs another redneck with a gun
well thanks for letting me play
Jr. out

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Fishin is not a sport it is an art
That takes time to master


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BIGSTEW
Ifish Forum Guide
Member # 27
posted 05-31-2001 07:58 pm

Great idea Yall. Just wait until the coho run hits the Columbia tribs this fall....talk about pandemonium For the life of me I cannot figure out the why people act like this. It reminds me of going to Costco on a Saturday(something I don't do anymore)only 10x worse!We complain about tribal netting and rightly so but is this any better?
Stew
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Still the lesser of two evils


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RT
Chromer
Member # 4
posted 06-01-2001 12:03 am

I like the premise of your idea Mike. With the right management of such a program I think there's no doubt it would have a strong deterence affect; as with the Rogue River program. ... BTW 'Stew, since I have been among the most outspoken against Indian netting I want to remind that I am against them netting way over their lawful share; not against them getting their fair share. And I agree with you completely that intentional snaggers and property abusing litterheads are even worse lawbreakers than Indians who over-net, due to Gov. loopholes that enable it. The gillnets do likely take more native fish, but we need to get after all this crap going on also, or it's just going to continue to get unbearably worse and harder to stop later. I think that with likely tons of excess fish to become catfood this fall the WDFW & ODFW will too often look the other way when they are fully aware of heavy snagging going on in places such as the Cowlitz and the Clack. trib Eagle Creek. This definitely sends a very strong and wrong message that snagging isn't a big deal with so many fish around! When a warden makes a rare appearance a few are nabbed, but not nearly enough to even amount to a deterance. So ...
... what do the lawful sportfishers among us do to organize such voluntary watchdog groups; with violation reporting and visual deterance effects with camcorders for presence at various 'hot spots'? ....

Put on your ideas fishers. Mine is that you all should become involved by joining an accepted well known fishing advocacy organization called the Association of NW Steelheaders. (Even by filling out a form and sending in your $25 annual dues to help out if you don't have the time to attend). I suggest that 'Stew and Fishbait, or appropriate ANWS officials, introduce this subject to the heads of all the chapters via e-mail memos. Since this is such a widely respected organization I think they could get co-operation from regional game and fish law enforcement departments; particularly in the most snagger and trasher infested areas. They could print out proper guidelines for volunteers to work thru the NW Steelheaders to set up strategically placed watch stations manned by at least 2 people together, with at least one camera and working cell phone. And have a more effective hotline setup arranged for the undermanned enforcement officers to respond to as fast as situations allow. This kind of program would have a big snowballing clean-up effect of the whole region if handled via this established organization that wouldn't be taken as a vigilante group. In addition to the Rogue River example of how effective this can be, remember the Guardian Angel's strong detering affect on crime in N.Y. City., without any weapons? Some trouble occured for the Angels with the odd crack whacked gun toting hardcore criminals, but that's not what we would be facing here. This would be a much easier bunch to clean up if the state will allow us to do what they can't seem to afford to.

RT

I belong to a group in Wisconsin called the River Patrol. You get a hat that says "River Patrol" and there are metal signs posted on trees informing the public that the river is monitored by Conservation Officers and the "River Patrol". We were also given a platic laminated card with the cell number for the warden. If you observe a violation (snagging, over limit, treble hooks,etc.), you call the warden, identify yourself as a River Patrol member, and the warden will come to the river to issue a citation. The warden will ask you to quietly point out the person, and then he/she will do his job. You do not confront or get involved with the angler who had the violation. It is working pretty well, and there are several guys that will leave when a guy shows up to fish a hole with the River Patrol hat on. Last year, over 350 citations were issued in a 4 week period during the salmon run for a total dollar figure in excess of $14,000. All of this was on the Root River in Racine. One guy got busted for netting over 300 salmon at night. Ouch. Hope this helps

It really isn't that hard to get people to do the right thing. I have been harrassing snaggers and litter bugs for the last two years and when you do some *****ing in their face they get the idea. I have also been showing by example and have never walked out of the canyon, lower river , upper river , boat launch, parking lot, without every pocket, bag, net, backpack, full of the most foul and offending trash ever picked up. most people look at you and ask what you are doing and if you give them the straight **** and tell them to carry some out of there too they will and they will feel good about it and hopefully keep up the tradition. they say thet it only takes a few to ruin it for all of the rest. but if all of the rest would take an extra minute maybe the could convert the few.

Hawk, excellent thing dude!

There's been more added to this thread on ifish so I'll copy and paste some more responses over here.

RT- Thanks for copying this over here. I ran out of time yesterday to bring it over here as I getting ready to head out the door.

And to Danceswithfish - There's nothing wrong with paint chips and salsa when you are on a budget. Being a starving student on a budget, I figured you would know that :p :p :p

Basically its just sports fishing either your right or wrong whats with the politic's, welcome to the real world!!!

Being the "nark" I am. I'd love to see it. The warden in Forks is spread way too thin, and such a program would help tremendously.

For those that say "it's none of your business" ... BS! The rivers belong to everyone and I, for one of many, have a business centered around these rivers ... IT IS MY BUSINESS! Violations often directly influence my clients' fishing!