Just a quick note to those three jet skiers on the Sky yesterday:

Just wanted to thank you for skiing over our plugs, running up and down a spawning side-channel, and in general, pissing us and about 6 bankies off.

And you wonder why jet skies are being banned.

Oh, and since I'm at it. Wholly crap! I really didn't notice how much bank errosion damage a large sled on the Sky really does! Truly amazing!

PS. "Large sled" as in those 22+' inboard, seats 8, Hell's Canyon runnin' MoFo's out there. Why the heck does anyone need that large of a sled on the Sky?????? Care to explain that one to me??????? I think it's a Short Man's complex thing.

"Oh, the Sultan's runnin' high today. Better take out Ol' Jumbo!". Give me a break.

[ 11-19-2001: Message edited by: parker ]

Parker you might want to talk to john Koenig about that!! He has a 22 foot Boulton..I doubt it is short man complex Johns about 6'4".
You might want to give him a call and tell him about your dislikes..

Parker,

Some guys do several different types of fishing. Not many of them can afford a new boat that perfectly matches the river size every time they go to a different fishery. Smaller sleds can toss a pretty good wake at shore too.

If you had just snagged the jetskiers and conked them on the head with a thermos, the sled wake wouldn't have bothered you so bad later.

K

No way! Well, if a GUIDE has a 22+ MonstoSled, and runs it up and down the Sky, then I guess it's all ok. Especially if it's John.


You're right Kevin. Fire off those 22+ Monstrosities up the Upper Sky, Nooch, Hump, and Satsop. If the fish die off, we'll just blame those damn indians! Oh, and I don't think even you would have wasted a perfectly good thermos on those jet ski pukes!

Besides, JOHN owns a 22' sled. It's all ok now.

[ 11-19-2001: Message edited by: parker ]

You said "why does anyone need a 22' sled around here"you didn't say just the Sky Parker.I dont agree with that... The cowlitz, skagit,lower Chehalis are all big enough rivers for a sled that size..There is places that can handle larger sleds and thats where they should be...I never said since it was John its ok you were the one raggin about it being short man complex..

Now the jet skies its a different story they have no place in a river!!

And yes I have seen 20+ footers on the nooch and satsop.In high water conditions!!But are they compairable size to the Cowlitz or Skagit?

[ 11-19-2001: Message edited by: The Reel Timber Man ]

Parker right on about the jet skies,right on about monster sleds.

TM - I went back and edited my original post to just the Sky.

Hey Centerpin - I believe I saw you just below two-bit. You were backtrolling near another sled. How did you guys do and what were you fishing for? Any steelies?

We saw one small nate steelhead cnr'd on Sunday. The guy got it on a Dick Nite while fishing for Coho.

Now I agree ya parker sleds of that size dont have any business on the Sky!!!!

Parker,
i don`t agree with the jet skiers running and down the river either, but I suriously doubt that they (the fellows who were jet skiing) are reading this board.

Yeah, I know. I was just griping. They were more annoying then anything else. The fish still kept on being caught after they zoomed away. Matter of fact, I don't think the woof woofs even cared!

Certainly can't gripe about the fishing! Any 20+ fish day is a good day!

Although intended as food for thought, this may come across as flame bait.

DISCLAIMER: I loathe jetskis but do own a 16' sled.

Why is it that jetskis don't belong on the Sky, but a jet sled (of some length, but less than 22')does? Admittedly, running up and down side channels where chum and maybe coho are actively spawning seems like a case of out-and-out wildlife harrassment.

But as far as a river is a navigable waterway, what makes one form of watercraft more right than another? Let's see, since a raft, driftboat, or sled are well suited to my intended activity, that is, fishing, they are appropriate watercraft for the river. And since jetskis seem to be operated by lunatics whose apparent intention is to harrass wildlife, fishermen, and render the river unfit for other uses, like fishing, jetskis are inappropriate.

I brought this up because I heard of a young man a few years ago, clad in his neoprene waders, zipping around the Snake River from drift to drift, where he'd park his jetski and then fish by wading from the bank. Seems like a jetski could be used as a "mini" jet sled by solo anglers, even if it's an unlikely application overall.

And by what criteria does one decide when a given jet sled length is too large for a given river? I think safety is a suitable criteria, but that's not very specific. I think it can get pretty dicey on rivers like the Satsop and Humptulips, where the "thread" in a shallow riffle around a river bend can be quite narrow, and a drift boat coming downstream has nowhere else to go, and a jet sled heading up stream on step also has nowhere else to go (if he slows, he grounds out), and the "thread" of the stream is too narrow for both boats to occupy the same space at the same time. Ever see that happen, or almost happen? Yet I believe the navigational rules of the road are that powerboats must yield to non-power boats.

Your thoughts?

Sincerely,

Salmo g.

There was a jet skier on the Snoqualmie on Saturday. He launched just below the cable hole and would actually run up past where no motors are allowed, up past Tokul Creek and back.

Remember Parker, it's not the jetski, it's the operator that's the problem.

More bank erosion than recent rain and flood?!

It is not illegal to run jet ski on sky is it? May be some of them need to be more courteous since we have to share the river.

Salmo,
I never really thought of using a jet-ski for a mini jet boat but sheez, it does kind of have warrant, he wouldn`t be much appreciated by many but really, a guy puts on a pair of neoprene waders and hops on a jet-ski to access his favorite fishing holes, that thing could get to places nothing else could. Hmmm,hope that doesn`t catch on..

Do they make an aluminum jet ski???

Jet Skiis on the Sky, big a$$ sleds on the Sky, whats new??? I severely dislike ANY sled on the Sky. Its a fairly small river for motor boats. Dont let fisherman dictate the water volume to run a sled, just get rid of them. The snohomish is fine if you want to race around.

Parker, i hope you gave those yuppie jet skiers a earful =)

fish on....

It sounds like this could all be solved. I guess I'll be bringing heat in the boat. My pet snake 357 colt python. Jetskis don't run so great with holes in em'. I seriously don't ever think I would have to shoot it. Just ask those jetskiers if they want any? Or just go fork's style on em' and pop every tire on that dam trailer. There are so many bodies of water to rip around on. Its a hot topic. Who should fish where? Most peolpe know the boundries and use common scence. The snake will talk the rest into making the right choice. I do agree about erosion problems from big sleds. Many times I've been on anchor fishin' k-fish and a big sled will go by, 5 minutes later I have to reel em' in to get all the crap off my line and plug. They wash the bank away! Until river banks naturally evolve to meet the neeed of sleds, they will keep eroding. Thats why I'm sort of a driftboat purist, we leave the river the same as it was. Very very little damage is done to the river. Plus if your a real man, ya row! Sleds are for washed up old farts with money that are too lazy. In my opinion all rivers should have motor bans except the snohomish, skagit, cow, lewis, chehalis, colombia.

I don't own a boat so I don't have boat bias here...but I don't see how sled wake could even remotely effect a river as much as the surge of rains we've had lately.

And am I the only one that's ever noticed how several trampled and destroyed some of the favorite bank fishing areas are?

As has already been stated, it's the operation of the sled that does or doesn't cause problems.

K

Parker,We were in 2bit at lunch time on sat,we were anchored pitching bait,later we were back trolling above thunderbird.fishing for anthing that would bite.

Okay, guys let me shed a little insight on this subject. Parker was fishing with me yesterday so I also got to witness the idiot jet skiers first hand. I'll explain:

The jet skiers were buzzing around the Monroe area and they were NOT fishing and I'm sure they were not fisherman by their actions. They were three of them total running in a pack and they had racing #'s on their stand up jetskis. They buzzed directly over my lines while I was plugging on anchor My lines were not more than 40 feet from my boat so you can get an idea of how close they came to me. They intentionally left the main channel to buzz around in a back channel/slough that had several bank fisherman around it and myself at the mouth in the main river. I've never seen suck a lack of respect by ANY boater......ever. I can't wait to see those idiots again so I can have a little *chat* with them about ethics

As far as the "Monster Sled" goes, that damn thing was not 22 feet long, as Parker stated, but more like 26' feet long! The wake off that thing was HUGE and I watched bank fisherman get soaked from it and it screwed us all up in my boat from 4 feet of rollers. I have learned to share the Sky with the sledders, but I'm sorry to say that this boat was just way too damn big for the area he was in. This boat was definately better suited for larger rivers.

I don't have a problem with jet skiers using their jet skis for transportation, but I do have a problem with idiots like the guys I saw yesterday so let's not turn this into a "they have a right to use the river too" thread. Jet skis, jet sleds, driftboats, and people on friggin' airmatresses can use the river all they want and it's their right.......but they do not have the right to come dangerously close to fisherman like the idiot jet skiers did yesterday.

It's really funny how much self serving attitudes erupt in these type of river use threads. I must agree with Salmo's reasoning; but I don't have to like jetskis buzzing around our fishing lines, and don't. I got it! I'll get my .44 out and shoot a hole in them. Grrr - ahheeute.

As for your brilliant self-serving post BK ... geeez, ya got all us old sled farts scared and our esteem damaged (assuming anyone over 40 is an old fart to you). NOT! Let me know when you'd like to have a radical class 5 rapid rowing contest for money, to your humiliation. Your young silly testosterone is leaking out your ears all over your mouth.


Parkeeeer brah, it's not even a full moon dude! BTW, as for the 20+ fish day ... old chums, cutts, smolts, jacks, boots, and fish on and right off don't count. Only landed bright silvers, Chinooks, and steelhead count.

RT

I gotta agree on this one. It was a 26fter atleast with a maroon stripe down it. Was the biggest sled I've seen on our sound river.

Tight lines

Kevin

Hey RT jet ski it two words not one, do I get the spinners?

All you guys talking about big boats on small rivers reminded me of something that happpened a year or two ago on the Clackamas. I think it was late winter (doesn't really matter), but this idiot decided to put his brand new 20' Bayliner in at Carver. Anyone who has been on this river already knows how bad of an idea this is. To top it off he decides to go downstream with it. Well I don't think I have to tell you what happened. We drifted by the next day and the boat was grounded a short distance below the the ramp. He tried to go through a riffle of a little more than a foot with bad results. I don't know how fast he was going, but he must have hit really hard. The prop was up at the top of the riffle and the back half of the boat was almost ripped off. Sheriff had to be called out to retrieve the idiot. I'm sure between the law, his insurance co. and the other boaters, he really got chewed out. Very expensive lesson.

So I guess sometimes there is justice out there for those morons.

Brad, that's a matter of nomenclature, not actual misspelling. Jetskis or jet skis are considered a recreational art, thus commonly used or localized names or spellings are recognized as acceptable.

www.dictionary.com

Besides, you spelled 'is' wrong.

[ 11-19-2001: Message edited by: RT i ]

LOL LOL

Hey RT, what if the guy was on a See-Duex, not a jet_ski? How would you properly present that nomenclature?

Better yet, what if the C'Du was 18' and the guy had a rod strapped to the side of it, then it would fit into Parker's slot limit he has set for the river...Course, you would want to mount a 7mm Magnum on the front for anyone that thinks they might want to brandish a weapon your way

Ban one form of boating on the water way and your going to be asking yourself a few years from now how it came about that all boats got banned from the river. If the guy is truly being dangerous, get his number off his craft and report him to the Sheriff. Sounds like he was close enough to read it.

I'm glad I missed the jetski and PT boat of a sled's antics.It would seem like the line of reason,at least according to us fisherman, was crossed.There is no excuse for the lack of consideration these moron jetski cowboys displayed.I guess consideration is a dying concept.

As far as the sled goes,there are limits to everything.Condemning all sleds,as some would, because of one thoughtless fool is unreasonable.

Considering bank erosion,some of you guys need to drive down to the Ben Howard Launch the next time we hit flood stage or close to it and see what mother nature does compared to a sled.It is an awesome sight.I'm definetly sceptical when it comes to the sled induced bank erosion theory.

#1 Mellow out and leave the frickin iron home. You draw it then your the one who is going to risk at least unlawful display....and your right to buy and possess firearms. I don't really care who you are but if I see it I'm hittin 911 on the cell phone and your not goin to appreciate the results even if your not charged. You see someone violating boating rules/laws then report it.By law boat operators are responsible for their wakes...get their boat # and description and call it in. Whatever you do just don't be stupid like the guy your pissed at! You want to use Forks techniques on these guys well I'm righteous with that...your risk. But you turn my water into a firing ground well thats a different story. Think about it what's the diff between that attitude and some punk drug distributing gangster defendin his street corner? I ain't pointin at anyone in this thread or others but get a frickin clue. Sorry if I offended some but hey frickin PEACE DUDES and maybe worry about fishin...sheeesh! Gooose

I don't think whining and sniveling here is going to accomplish a damn thing, what do you expect when you fish a very popular river near a major metropolitan area, in a few years we'll all be saying, " I remember the good ol days when you would only see a couple jet skiers a day on the river. If you don't like it, fish where they can't go, otherwise, deal with it.

Another fine post by our friend "B.K" he is the prime example of some people who shouldnt carry a pet snake!!! Get a grip dude..before you hurt someone or end up in jail!! Reminds me of the drinking and driving post in Forks a while back!

Wow, first off I never thought that post would be such a big deal and taken seriously. I can say I would NEVER threaten someone with a gun and I'm sorry if I got everybody all fired up. I was typing as if I were writing a fictional book. RT you know what I mean after all you write silly songs at 3 in the morn!

Also I don't take things too seriously on this board, especially your tips. The first few lines in my post was nothing more than a joke, if you knew me you'd know better. I may yell at a guy, but only if he's out of line, or flat out corks me. I would even go as far to say I'm a nice guy on the river. I think you should have another vicodin and a drink and chill out. Radical class 5 rowing war? How bout "radical" moto-X? Is the Viagra working because you seem to have some testosterone too. I was just venting, you on the other hand felt the need to take a stab at me.

[ 11-19-2001: Message edited by: BK ]

OK, that does it! ...

... Nah, jk. Enough silly? Peace.

OH, wait a sec first. BK, ya I'll **** *** ***** *** *** ** *** big time! ... Just like you, the rest of us were kidding with our posts too. It's all so obvious. No explainations needed. Peace. Out!

DELETED!!!

wow.I get upset when somebody wakes up earliar than me and beats me to the fishing hole.I have tried fishing over around the big city,just too many people.I think they wrote an arcticle about it,sts.By the way,for those of us that do know fishing edicut.you come down to a hole[I am talking the coast not the big city]don't be afraid to talk to the guy that beat you to it.I was fishing lower sol duc, on a big hole.Another fisherman came down made a couple of casts and left.If he would of look or came over and talked he would of left with a limit of fish.Ask the guy what his plan is!

wow.I get upset when somebody wakes up earliar than me and beats me to the fishing hole.I have tried fishing over around the big city,just too many people.I think they wrote an arcticle about it,sts.By the way,for those of us that do know fishing edicut.you come down to a hole[I am talking the coast not the big city]don't be afraid to talk to the guy that beat you to it.I was fishing lower sol duc sunday,with my wife, on a big hole.Another fisherman came down made a couple of casts and left.If he would of look or came over and talked he would of left with a limit of fish.Ask the guy what his plan is!

Are there ducks hanging out on the Sky? I don't know where this happened, but this morning, Paul Harvey reported a story about a jet skier cruising along at about 55 mph. He hit a duck and died of blunt force trauma to the head. Don't know if the duck lived or not.

Thought about closing the thread, but there is an interesting point here that I thought was important to be open to discussion:

For those wondering how a boat wake damages opposed to high waters, I'd strongly suggest contacting Alaska State Parks and ask for data on their studies that have been done on the Kenai and the effects on juvenille fish rearing habitat. There are significant differences in the effect of waves coming at an angle perpendicular to the bank versus being submerged.

I'm sad to report that the duck didn't make it!

http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGAVBQFT9UC.html

Poor duck!

Parker

Ditto on the Deleted!

Gooose

When a river gets real high sure it pushes everything out. But what about when rivers are at average or low levels? Naturally waves don't break the river bank during this time period.

i have duck hunted for many many years and I learned something new today. 10-15 lbs duck!? I am not sure about Florida but in WA we call it goose (a big Canadian honker). A bird that big can even bring down a 737.

Bank fishermen can also cause extensive damage to the banks. In Alaska (Russian river for example) they have blocked bank access to many parts of the river to save the vegetation. Locally in Sky, they have also put protective nets over parts of the river banks. There is always a middle ground where everyone can be happy and the nature be preserved as well.

[ 11-20-2001: Message edited by: UltimateFeashKacher ]

[ 11-20-2001: Message edited by: UltimateFeashKacher ]

We cannot fish without making an impact on the rivers and fish. We've talked about sled wake and bankies walking and wading. Might as well mention that driftboaters often slash oars into shallow redds, drop anchors on them, and during low water they get out and scrape them long distances over shallows. And many more times of dritboats than sleds. We all impact the rivers - period! Then along comes mother nature with a big flood and does more damage in a few days than fishermen did all season; or longer.

All that doesn't mean any user group should stay away from the rivers. They are always in a constant state of change anyway. Just try to keep your own impact to a minimum, and quit trying to eliminate other user groups with BS.

In the floods of early '96, whole rivers sections were completely changed. They had new banks, new holes, and in many cases entire multi-mile long sections were completely moved into new channels; and different depths in the rest of the old channels. And more bank erosion than fishers made in the previous decade. While rivers all over the northwest had big impacts that Feb. '96, two that I regularly fish have been very different rivers ever since - the Clackamas and the Wilson .... until the next big flood.

RT

That new dictionary works pretty well doesn`t it RT?.

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!
Its been awhile since I've surfed my way back here to check things out.
TOOOO FUNNY!!!!!!
Parker, YER KILLIN' ME HERE!!!!!!! HAHAHAHA You too BK,...BANG!!BANG!! HAHAHAHA (piss runnin' down leg)
RT,..Great Job Brah!!!

Hey Parker and Kid It'll be a fun Spring with Robbo and I runnin our sleds around together, hehehe Remember we know the Sauk extrememly well.
Sleds have been around for a long time boys, get used to them. Back in the 60's when the rivers were not all shallow and silted up; Cause' they were still floatin' log booms down the rivers,..they were runnin' sleds with props up rivers like the Sauk and upper Skagit.

TOOOOOOOOO FUNNY!!!!!!!!!!
Sites changed quite a bit here,.. how do Ya use these "Instant Graemlins", "Instant UBB CODE"??
OK Got the Graemlins thing now.
Tight Lines!!!!!! BANG!! BANG!! BK

Hey John - did they used to run sleds that far up on the Sauk? Up past the Sauk River Steelhead Ranch (I can only guess you know where Justin's property is) Wholly cow!!!! I can't even imagine that.

Pray that they have a spring season on the Sky. If not, the Skagit/Sauk is gonna get awfully packed full of people come Feb 1.

Looking forward to seeing you and COD out on the Sauk this year!

[ 11-21-2001: Message edited by: parker ]

hmmm parker-it will probably get some pressure now

rainy', I don't know how to use a spell check on the BBs. I use it for Windows Works, etc. Is erosion spelled with 2 r's or what? I'd look it up but I'm about out the door for the coast.

Good to see ya back here Johnny c. 'Johnny Be Good'

Have a good T-day guys.

[ 11-21-2001: Message edited by: RT i ]

Wasn't this what you were supose to tell John... Parker.



Instead all I seen was an arss kissin post!! (pun intended)

[ 11-21-2001: Message edited by: The Reel Timber Man ]

. And many more times of dritboats than sleds. We all impact the rivers - period! Then along comes mother nature with a big flood and does more damage

Me and my dritboat need them spinners..fp