I've been away (Hunting in Montana) and just wanted to know what the latest views are on hull designs. I'm looking at Alumaweld, Northriver, and Willie in a 20 ft sportjet. I know everyone has their preference but thought I'd ask anyway.

Thots?

Koffler, any other questions... 6 degree with the delta bottom, and forget the sportjet it's a waste of space and money.. The best sleds are those that run the shallowest, get out of the hole the quickest, and track the straightest with the most room inside possible... That's what kofflers all about. I've ran them all, willie, alumaweld, thor built. Actually the thor built is a close second and a bit less money..
Keith

Highlander,

All 3 brands you mentioned make excellant boats. I lean toward the Willie Predator sleds, but they are close. And as Keith mentioned, the Koffler's are pretty good too - as are Motion Marines and Wild Hairs and others. But with about a 10 degree V up front the boat will take chop and rapids smoother, corner a little better, and when tapered back to about 3 degrees at the transome area hull shoe (flat area at the rear of the hull near the jetpump intake) they go about as shallow as any V-sled with less front V. If you learn how to run a mild 'crescent' pattern thru real shallow rapids with the OB trimmed out a ways, after being on plane first, you can run these V's as shallow as the older flat bottom 20' sleds (in as little as 3" to 4" deep if there aren't too many rocks sticking out). >

As for the new Merc Sportjet IB/OB's, I have driven a friend's 20' Motion Marine several times with a 175 SJ in it and really liked the performance, and it's quieter. But I haven't spent a long time with one of these motors so I don't know how they are over the long run - although I haven't heard any talk of significant probs; and they have been out for some time now. The newer 240 SJ is overkill on power for sleds, in my opinion, and could be more dangerous and less durable. Maybe they'd be fine on a 24' Duckworth up the Snake River though? The 175 has plenty of power! For comparison, the 200 hp OB's with pumps are rated at 140 hp with the preferable stainless steel 4 blade impellers. I'd love a 21' Predator with the 175 SJ in it. But I'd rather keep my older flat Alumiweld sled and buy a C5 Corvette, with the amount the new sleds are priced!

RT

I used to build jet boats for a very well known company in Seattle You have to ask your self will I be boomdogling if so go with sthd1 thoughts less vee the better it will track ( less spinning around when free drifting) and I like Koflers also. Having formed ribs on the bottom will also aid the drift. The more vee the easier it will take corners and have more stability on choppy water hope this helps.

Where are you running your boat? Shallowest, fastest, lightest, Best hole shot on the market. Theres your sportjet! The 175sj compares to a 200 o/b pump. Yet is 200 lbs lighter. Moves the weight balance forward 3 feet. Thus coming out of the hole flatter. Gives you 35 more usable horsepower. Compresses on the bottom to run shallower. Turns in 1/3 the turning radius. Basically smokes an outboard.
When buying remember who sill be there for you in the future. I work for a boat dealer and when you buy we offer 24 hr service on call. That means when your boat wont start at 5 in the morning in Clarkston. I put a mechanic in a truck sith a similar boat and if he can't fix yours on the spot we'll leave you with a boat for the day while we fix yours. Thats why you buy local. If you buy factory dirrect you should save from 12-15% or your wasting your money. Lots of good boats out there. Looks, Price, And the # of years in business are the key.

I went through the new sled decision this time last year. I went to the sportsman shows and boat show. The toughest thing i found is that there are a lot of good sleds and a few great ones. Someof the sled are great but thier price is not, I ended up buying a North River , quality, options and then price where the reasons why. I test drove 5 different brands and it was not an easy choice. I agree forget the sport jet if your going to carry a load. Good luck e-mail me if you want to talk further.

Ah, the beauty of an outboard. Last year on the Snake in my buddies sportjet we sucked up a bunch of weeds 6 miles upriver from camp. This was mid-Novemeber. Rocks-paper-scissors for who went over the side and dove down to clean out the grate after trying all the standard methods for doing it on the fly. Needless to say, we had to run back to camp to warm the loser up.

This year at the Huskie game in my Predator. Sucked up a bunch of milfoil while motoring in to pick up my friends off the dock. Used the kicker to pick them up and got out to the clean water. Tilted the outboard 150 jet up, cleaned out the milfoil, and we were on our way with everyone dry.

There are a number of things I like about each setup, but the extra space inside the boat and cleanout options far outway the positives to me of the sportjet.

I have a 19 ft northriver with a sportjet. It's my second sled, my first was an Almar lite with an outboard jet. I have to agree that the outboards are easier to clean out, and they do give more space in the boat. With my 19 footer, however, the space has not been an issue, fishing with up to 5 people in the boat. The Sportjet's engine house is pretty compact. Also, the swim platform over the pump gives you back space for a cooler that you don't get with an outboard, so I think the space issue is about a wash.

I have had problems with sucking weeds into the pump, and that is a serious problem. The boat loses about half of it's power, and you can't go fast enough to get on plane without cavitating and over revving the engine. I still had enough power to get around, and to trailer the boat. However, the only place I've had the weed problem is the hanford reach area, and the rivers I fish around here don't have weeds to speak of. You definitely don't want to run through weeds.

As to the other posters saying that the sportjet doesn't have power, however, I don't understand what they are talking about. My boat flies, as do the boats of the other folks that I know with the same power. I get up on plane in about two boat lengths, do about 45 mph top speed, cruise at 35 mph at 4000 rpm. When you push the throttle lever forward, it's liking setting the dial for a speed. The boat moves instantly, even with five people in it. This boat gets up much more immediately than any boat with an outboard I have seen.

The boat handles like it's on rails. I don't know how much is the boat and how much is the Sportjet, but I am much more confident in tight quarters than with my old boat.

I suspect that I could run 4 or 5 inches of water, but I avoid anything less than 10 inches deep. I don't think the risk is necessary, and I can get around on all the rivers I fish without taking that risk.

I also get much better fuel economy than I used to with my old 85 HP evinrude pump, though that was a pretty old boat.

I'm pretty happy with the Sportjet. Also with the North River.

I would agree with Silver Hilton. Currently my 2001 NR 19' sportster with the 175 sport jet has served me well. I have 80 hours on it have picked up some junk on the grate from time to time. All it has taken so far is to get all the speed you can, turn off the motor and the wake washes forward though the jet and up the boat and the junk comes off the suction. Granted I have not run it in any really serious weeds like at Tillamook Bay yet.
I like the layout with the windshield, top and such. I could see how you might go for an open tiller model depending on how you fish the most, it can be a little pain if you are freedrifting and always have to make the walk up to the helm to get the jet started at the end of your pass.

20FT.ALUMAWELD SUPER V LT. WITH OUTBOARD ENGINE don't mess with the rest.scott

If you are new to jetting you should add a stomp grate to any inboard. Or better yet stick with your outboard. Their fool proof. Yet there is truly no comparison to an inboard. I have never been fishing without a cooler for my lunch. Now it goes on the swimstep and I'm not tripping on it. What loss of space.

If you pitch bait or jigs normally, stay away from the windshield boats. If you pull plugs, have a family or think you might want to get out of the weather, go with a windshield and a full canvass top. I own a 20 ft. Boulton and I am very happy. Have yet to meet a jet boat that can outrun me, willingly run in 4 inch water and I can put the top up and turn on the heat during January snake river steelie trips. At 28 degrees the top is a welcome sight. I cannot, however, have four people pitching bait with any degree of comfort. The doghouse just takes up too much space. I have the Kodiak 350 package. If you go inboard, forget the sportjet. I have seen too many of them run poorly or fail completely. (8 in the last 20 months) On bigger water, Snake, Columbia etc. you will want the power of the V8. If you have to worry about fuel mileage, stick to a drift boat or bank stomping. Anyway, the advice is worth every penny you paid for it. If you would like to drive or ride on my boat, just say the word. I am happy to oblige.

Silver Hilton's take on the Sportjet is right on. I have a 175 Sportjet in a 19' TJ and it has no problem with a hole shot alone or with 5 people, handles very well, top speed 45+, small doghouse leaves plenty of room with the cooler on the swimdeck.

I agree with windshield/no windshield post. My wife voted for the windshield (so did I)with canvas for protection from the weather, I also do not do much boondoggin.

If you go with the sportjet, get a stompgrate as mentioned earlier, clean out the intake and stay dry.

Good luck with your boat choice.

Doubletake

I just picked up my new 20' Alumaweld Super Vee 2oo HP Tiller from 3Rivers Marine. I worked with Dave Lee, Scott Weidman and Brian Nelson; they are all great guys to work with and awesome fisherman too. I looked at Thorebuilt, NR, Willie and chose Alumaweld because of design, reputation and longevity in the boat building business, and I know they will be there in the future if I have any Warranty issues. I have owned an inboard sled and Outboard sled also with a center console, and discovered inboard or outboard, if it has a steering wheel it is at least 10 times harder to control, especially at low speeds. Go talk to 3Rivers and take test drive with both inboard and outboard, my guess is you will choose the Outboard tiller.
Good Luck.

Highliner; If I had a dime for every time a V-8 jet boater bashed Sport-jets I might have the money to actually make the 6000$ step to get a "real" jetboat. Thats right, when I considered making the step to only a 20' North River Ranger, 350v8, Hamilton 212 it bumped the price up 6k! That and the overall floor/fishing space is less! Weighs 800# more! Then I figured that I really don't have any plans to do the toughest parts of the Snake, It was a no brainer. This boat cruises at 6gal/hour, is easy to tow, sits higher in the water off plane, it's a very versatile boat. If you just feel good just paying more be my guest. I'm afraid it just wasn't in my budget.

Sea People Manufacturing in Gold Beach Oregon!!!!
Dont get a ****ing sportjet. If you want an inboard, get a V-8 Or if you want an outboard get a Yamaha! Why by an outboard thats mounted inboard? Plus the sportjet was desinged for those little tupperware play boats that I refer to as Lake Lice!

To clarify my point, buy the best boat you can afford. You can see all the personal opinions you get from people on the subject and most of them assume your boating needs are the same as theirs. I got a ton of input from veteran fish hounds, some told me not to even consider getting a pump! The bigger v-8 jet boats are fine craft, I don't mean to bash them, might even own one one day.

Oh, Willierower you owe me a dime!

sportjets, have heard nothing but good about them. sounds like the "real deal".

WOW! This could be bigger than the Ford - Chevy debate.

I have decided on the Sport-jet because of my specific needs (everything from hunting muleys on the Snake River breaks to free drifting all 'sled-sized' rivers) but my real question was more directed toward hulls.

It's interesting to notice trends.... a couple years ago everyone on this board fished Alumaweld. If I am not mistaken it appears that Northriver may be gaining a slight foothold here.

I think I got my answer...........thanks to everyone that replied!

There's a guy in my area that has a 2001
20'x72" Alumaweld windshield model with the motor previously mentioned . He really likes it. I was impressed to hear it stays on plane down to 3200 rpm, considerably lower than mine (19'x66") at 3800 rpm . I have not ridden in it yet. Would like to check it out. Hi Boater long time no read. Thought you might chime in. :p

Ok fish hunter give your address and I will send you the dime. Even though I dont currently own a sled, Ive been in and around sleds since I was making pudding in my diaper So I think I might have an informed opinion on sportjets (yuck). I even went on a body search for someone who died because of a sportjet clogging up with debris.
You burn more fuel with a sportjet than you would with a V-8. V-8's last longer than a 2 stroke will. Less maintenance with a V-8, plus you can due the work yourself.
On top of all that, a V-8 has a lot more torgue and horse power. Horese power comes from RPMs, torque doesnt. There is no such thing as too much power in a jetboat, especially if you ever plan on using it on a river.
I can say all thatbecause Ive been in 2different sportjet powered boat and I am also running around in 2 V-8 powered boats quite often, 1 is a 21' totally Customweld and the other is a 21' North River Ranger. Both boats have Vortec 350's and Hamilton 212 pumps.
Ive also been in and ran many different outboard powered boats ranging from a 16 foot with a80 horse merc to a 21' Jetcraft powered by a 200 Yamaha Phase III. Out of all the boats the Jetcraft is the fastest at 58 mph with 3 people. It jumps out of the hole in about a boat length and 1/2. The only draw back is it drinks the fuel...... A Sportjet cannot push a 21' boat that fast. Nuff said.....

Looking back on the posts, I think it's a little amusing that no-one who is bashing the sportjets appears to have actually owned one. I would be prepared to believe that another motor/jet could be a better package, but haven't heard anyone actually offer any evidence.

So, if you're buying a boat, and don't want a package that is cheap, powerful and effective, by all means, don't buy a sportjet.

Now, that said, in the interest of full disclosure, let me tell you the one nit that Doubletake and I have both noticed. The Sportjets are a bit cold blooded. In particular, if you start them, and run them for about three minutes, and then shut them down for a minute, they get difficult to start, until you let them cool for 10 minutes. If you run them for five minutes, then no problem. It seems like the choke gets a bit twitchy as the engine gets just barely warm.

If I unload the boat, and then run upriver or downriver a mile, I never notice a problem. If I unload and run 500 yards and then idle for a minute, the engine wants to die.

This is only if the tempertature is cold, like 35 degrees. never happens in summer or fall.

That is my only ***** about the motor.

One of the other posters commented about how the North Rivers are more dominant. I can't speak for others, but when I compared the Alumaweld to the North River, the fit and finish on the North River, and the little touches, like side pockets and a warm water sink to wash egg slime off your hands, were just better thought out than the Alumaweld. I think both boats are solid, good fishing boats. I just liked the NR a touch better.

Now, Doubletake's boat (a custom weld?) is also a fine looking boat, but I think mine catches a few more fish... :-) Craig, your comments?

One further point, about the cold bloodedness. That is only true for me on the first start of the day. Once I make the first run, the motor is perfect for the rest of the day.

As to the body search comment in the previous post, I'd love to hear the logic chain that ties this to the motor. I don't care what the motor is - if your boat gets in trouble, it ain't the fault of the motor, it's the fault of the pilot.

Fish Hunter,
My new Koffler 20' x 72" has a 200 Merc with the oversize pump... Talk about torque and power, she runs a plane at about 3300 rpm's with 4 guys that total about 800 lbs, and top speed, well no thanks not necessary.
Grass Hopper- I've ran all but the sport jet, but know a couple of guys that have them and are scared to run the shallows on the lewis at 900 cfs, but what boats have you seen run 2-3"s of water that are 20' x 6'? And holeshots, the koffler comes out of the hole on plane and there is no A$$ drag and will come out of the in literally a 1/2 of a boat length.

Highliner-
It all depends on the fishery you want to fish, but the koffler, Alumaweld, Willie and Thor Built, will do any. If you want to fish small rivers, Columbia, Buoy 10, Ocean you can do it... Yes you take a little bit of a beating when on rougher water but they're solid they can handle it. As for room, I've never seen more in a boat as a koffler. I've got double rod racks 6" wide the length of the boat and the rods stay completely out of the way. There's two removable box seats and two other seats that are removable that mount to the deck. More or less you have a gutted out boat that is top notch for boondogging. You have a boat that will cover any fishing condition except if you want to sit under cover and out of the rain with a windshield. But if you want that then you want a boat with limited availability for fishing styles.

As mentioned before I've ran Alumawelds, Willies, Thor Builts, North Rivers and have caught hundreds upon hundreds of fish from sleds, so I hope you'd value the opinion. You know that you're as good as your equiptment allows you to be... As you can tell I'd like to beleive that the Koffler is the best and until I find something that does it all better then I'll go with it.
Keith

Its all in the desing folks. Most sportjets on the market come in 10 and 12 degree vees. Yout Alumaweld tiller comes in a 6. If you want to blow their performance away you shallow up the vee. Lighten your boat 200 lbs move the balance point 2 feet further forward and Call it a sportjet. I had Mike Boulton custom build me a 22'x72" 5 degree centerconsole sportjet. The boat did near 50 mph turned at full speed in its own length, floated empty in 5 inches of water, floated full in 7 inches of water, and boondogged with the kicker running in 9" of water. Now thats performance. It is now run by Johns Guide Service on the Skagit. You can't hav a boat that does everything well. But if you explain where you run your boat, how many people you like to fish, how you like to fish, and the little things that are important to you( power train warrenty, tops,heaters, ect.) you may get more help. Lots of CUSTOM boats out there.

Silver hilton, here is the explaination about the body search......
A guy takes his brother and his 13 yr, old nephew out on a river to hunt ducks on backwaters. This is the first time he takes his new sled on the river. It is a 19' Willie Predator powered by a 175 sportjet. on the way down rier to where they are going to hunt he sucks up some cra in the pump and losses all power. They shut down the engine and grab some paddle and paddle slowly to shore and clean out the pump. No biggie, They fire it back up and off they go. They hunt until about an hour before it gets to dark to make it home safely. What should have been a a 15 minute boat ride back to the ramp turned into a night of hell. Te pumped clogged up 3 different times on the run back upstream. The last time was about 1/2 mile from the ramp in a fairly swift section of river. As they were trying to paddle the boat to shore in the dark the boat hit a submerged log and it capsized. The 2 aduls who were at the back of the boat were thrown in the water. The 13 yr. old kid was sitting up front under the top was caught along with the dog. All 3 people were wearing their life jackets. The kid and the dog both drowned.
After the 2 adults made it to shore, the father searched for his kid while the uncle went to get help. The uncle knocked on the door of a friend of mine while I was on the phone with him. My friend told me to get over there and help.
The sheriff came and got the uncle and headed down to the river to find the fater while my friend and I got his outboard powered sled ready to go. The sheriffs department wouldnt risk putting their boat in the river at night. My frind and lauched the sled and ran down in the dark until we found th boat. then we searched down river about 2 miles and found nothing.
We returned up to the accident site. The sheriif decided it was best to try and recover the boat to see if the kid was still in it. The way the boat was sitting upside down pinned against the log we couldnt look inside. We used a tractor and some cable to yard the boat out of the river. The dog was still in it the boat, the kid was not. We spent the next 3 days looking for the kid. I drifted that same stretch of river 9 times in 3 days looking. On the 3rd day when the Army Corps of Enginees shut down the flow the kid was found 50 yards downstream of where the boat went down. Im sure glad Im not the one who found him, I would have had a hard time with that.
The guy who owned the boat ha rn that river over a 100 times before in his old outboard powered boat with any problems. The first time he uses the new boat in that river his nephew dies......

Thats why I dont like sportjets.

Grasshopper-
But in all the boats available, why would you want a center console? In my opinion it just gets in the way, and running a kicker in 9" of water I think your pushing it there. If the boat rides at 5" empty you only have 4" for the kicker to stick down... Now your really losing credibility, not good for a salesman. Personally I have a set of 10ft oars that run the length of the sled on the gunnels that I only put on in low, low water conditions in the summer. There's two advantages in the smaller holes. First you can run shallower to stay off the fish and second your all around quieter coming through the hole.
Keith

The "Osprey" is way cool!

the kicker doesnt need to be below the boat to troll forward. And I don't fish in reverse do you??? If you want the perfirmance of a S.J. you need a stearing wheel. Can't stay in the boat doing a 45mph 180 without something to hold on to. But if you drive a tiller you will never know that problem because they don't turn sharp. If all you so is fish nothing wrong with a tiller yet there isn't a tiller boat out that can follow my lead!!!

I had North River make my boat 78" wide. I think it makes a huge difference! More room is good when fully loaded. I use my boat for everything from fishing to family boating. I had Bently put a customized teak bracket and sun deck cusions for the back. It goes around the motor box and is pretty cool for laying out. Also, get a fish tray/organizer that fits over the motor box. I love this for holding bait/gear and cutting board for wrapping plugs. Also put in a spray down pump/hose for easy clean up. Just thought I'd share my favorite options....