OH !
now I see we should blame it all on the Indians if we don't kill them they will.


all I'm saying is whatever numbers they are useing are way to low or we would not have a problem because there would be enough fish to spawn to keep the fisherys open.

one outher comment, maybe we in the north sound rivers affected the survival of those eggs and smolts by adversely affecting the health of there mom's and dad's.

what we need is prenatal care for expectant steelhead.

I have no idea how anyone can snag or fatally hook 1/4 of their fish using spoons or spinners. Fished from the usual downstream approach they seem like the least snag-o-genic method to me (aside from float and jig).

Plunker,
Sounds like sour grapes to me, maybe you should try 1/0 instead of 8/0 siwashes that should clear up your problem. It's a shame too because your 1st two posts were very good. Unfortunately your agenda had to come out sooner or later. Something tells me if there was a kill fishery you wouldn't be airing these same complaints about escapement. (it all sounds like wildcat steelhead club propaganda to me)

The only thing these arguments for or against catch and release accomplish is to drive anglers further apart. They solve nothing and change no one’s mind. There are far more serious and important problems facing our steelhead then whether one should practice catch and release or not.

I do agree with plunker on one thing. With all of the other north end rivers being closed the Skagit should be closed also. Leaving the Skagit open even for a catch and release season puts to much pressure on an already questionable steelhead return.

Steelnerves-Darin, how is the cnr fishery on the skagit going to improve the fishery on this river for the future ?, the fact is that the run is low and killing fish just to have a cnr fishery does not make any sence. is this your idea of "good managment" ?

If I am not mistaken they lowered the escapement on the Skagit system from 8500 to 6000 this year. If they lowered the escapement simply to have a fishery someone should be shot.

Vic - I think it was two years ago and it was reduced due to pressure from the local tribal cooperative.

boater - I think "Steelnerves-Darin A.B." decided to eat his words. Might be that his buddies at Washington Trout are coaching him in communications. Never loosely reveal you real agenda publicly cause it might come back around. Sneaky huh!

Kerry - Since you brought it up.

It's not the arguments for or against catch and release that drive anglers further apart. It's when one user group tries to impose their ethical choices upon everyone else at the expense of their fishing opportunities.

No one, to my knowledge, has ever spoken against C&R although some of us will argue for our opportunity to retain fish from healthy stocks.

The anti-retention groups remind me of the anti-gun freaks.

Hey Plunker,


I own land in the Okanogan and am a hunter appreciator so pi$$ off and stop guessing peoples agendas until you know the person. Hey, you couldn't even put up your email on this board huh,(how about a real name too or are you afraid everyone will know who you really are?) you must be a coward on this board -like a terrorist is! On the subject of GUESSING peoples agenda's Serve jail time there Plunker? I'm "GUESSING" your a racist, bigoted, abusive, wife beatin', trash leaving and corrupt individual!--- Quit picking on people and work with people. Show us that you re more intelligent and thoughtful. I nkow your intelligent.

I qoute one of the other posters here on a different thread saying,
"The original subject of this post has been lost

I have bonked my share of Nates in the past ....none sine 91.

Times have changed and so should this narrow minded idea ..........wild fish numbers are NOT increaseing and by continuing to impact this fishery .........We are only stealing from our children.

others have choosen to use this as a media for there their little "web games"..stir the Shiit kind of thing,He only wants a reaction
by responding to his meat mentallity you are all playing into his hand,which is not so busy now .......since his Card ran out

makeing a turd out of a Wild fish is wrong
Plunk...if you can really taste the differnce between wild and hatchery,I've got a real Wild trout you can taste..........Os
--------------------
Team RiverDawg
Silent Approach Pro-Staff silentapproach.com
N.W.O.


Release all Wild Fish"
Most people here have a much different stance than you re wild fish retention " Just look at the header on this page and you'll see Bob put up a ad/link for the "Wild Steelhead Coalition". Why don't you tell Bob and the moderators to take a hike there buddy boy! Oh, and take a look at the results of the poll on the Chehalis as proof of my hypothesis... You must have been in the very small minority if you even took the time to vote..... go read the end Conclusion of Dave Vedder's book called "Float Fishing for Steelhead Technique & Tackle" and tell me what you think.

Personal attacks beget personal defenses!
In the end, it's about fishing first and not killing/catching! Otherwise we would have called it "Catching & Eating".
(Yes, if fish numbers are VERY, VERY healthy maybe keep WF but if not can't do that can't we atleast FISH even if we can't keep? All you got to do is modify your gear a little... And if your a good fishermen -a real fishermen who is patient you should have no problem catching fish if they are in the river. I'd rather have some sorta season/more days on the water to "fish' than none at all!) Go fish a planted lake for food or when the hatchery fish run on certain rivers. Proven fact, Washington's Wild fish ARE in decline!
Ignorance is Bliss -especially in the case of people like Plunker.
you throw fuel on the fire and it only serves to engulf us!

Sincerely & Disrespectfully, DB

I don't have buddies as you call-em' at Washington Trout, matter of fact recently was the first time I ever wrote them or spoke with them.... I'm independent and am not a member of any "fishing organization".

P.S. Sorry for the post Bob(and everyone else), but you got some real unfriendly folks on here. They could give a damn about anyone else but themselves. It's like that kid recently who posted and a bunch of people used personal attacks at him. ... Can't we look to the future more positively?

Darin, I think I have the same thoughts and feelings as you do on this subject, but your steppin over the line bru. Ignorant attitudes like plunkers will make you angry to the 10nth degree but violence is not the answer. We just have to hope people like him are a dying breed, besides its obvious to me his skull is so thick even an old fashion ass whuppin would have little effect

Skydriftin,

Sorry for that, I've calmed down. He'll get his one day....... I shouldn't worry about it.
Sincerely, DB

Plunker,

You can choose to fish the c&r season or not. No one is going to force you. Why don’t you accept the fact that there will be certain seasons and areas designated catch and release.

You and others who repeatedly engaged in arguments over catch and release verses catch and kill only drive the wedge deeper between the various user groups. I wager you nor has anyone else involved in these arguments convinced one person to change their opinion one way or the other.

Kerry,

"It's not the arguments for or against catch and release that drive anglers further apart. It's when one user group tries to impose their ethical choices upon everyone else at the expense of their fishing opportunities.

No one, to my knowledge, has ever spoken against C&R although some of us will argue for our opportunity to retain fish from healthy stocks."

This thread has gone beyond reason but once again I'll say that my disagreement is with those wacko's who want all areas designated catch and release. In my opinion they are selfish pigs. 'nuff said! Done with this thread.

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

Darin Brenner,

I'm sorry if you are angry with yourself for the things that you said earlier...
The things you said in the two posts that you removed.
The bigger thing to do would have been to apologize or clarify any misnomers.

Get your bong out and take a couple of deep breaths and then re-assess your feelings.
Such deep spiritual anger can only lead to the disintegration of your physical heath.
Find a good spiritual councilor or other mental health professional.
It might be cheaper than needing a defense attorney.

At 31 you're still young. Get help while there is still hope.

You might also consider removing your threats. You won't be able to keep your guns
or shoot anyone after being arrested for a felony.

Plunker,
Look do you really think I'd shoot somebody(yea you probably do )...No,.... I can give you a list of my references and people who know me who'd support me and know my decency and respect for people. You were attacking, so I responded by forceful defense back at you. You upset me and other folks and I felt like the ol' kid again ready for a school fight! Bringing up the fact that I pulled my replies off wasn't helpful -after the fact.

It sounded like you might be a bigoted person though as you made the comment/comparison about anti-gun people being the same people as anti-keep fishing folks and that is untrue and totally unfair.

I don't think I need a spiritual counselor as I am a Jew who attends services and practices peaceful ways of living. Again, you are "guessing" who I am and not addressing the truths. Like I said, I was "GUESSING" who you were to merely show that your biase was straying into gray areas that do not have merit or truth to them. And again you used "guessing" -assuming to describe me as a drug user -I do not use drugs nor ever will. That was kinda funny though! Do you not like the truth? Yes, I deleted my earlier posts Because I could see it was rediculous to leave my arguments on this thread -arguements going no where..... I should have just not posted and kept my thoughts and frustrations to myself. I did think you were being unfair to some people though including me.....that's probably why I spoke up! Go look at the poll.... I rebute my hasty comments I made earlier in anger and have deleted them respectfully. I respect the fact that you believe in what you stand for but why go about it criticizing others in such a degrading fashion? I will forget about this arguement and I will pass my forgiveness on.... I hope Bob deletes this thread....it's just a headache to anyone reading it!
Enough said, DB
P.S. By the way, where did you dig up my last name?

Plunker,

Glad to see you are still out there fighting the fight. While you and I have not agreed on some key points over the years, I always enjoy the debate. I would sincerely be quite sad if some hothead attempted to harm you. Besides, with you gone, the most articulate voice for Catch and Kill would be gone and I would be forced to listen to countless renderings of "I'm gonna eat them before the *&((($##***ing tribes do". Where's the sport in that?

For those that disagree with Plunker:
While you might not respect his conclusions, at least admire his articulate questions. If you can not defend your position against his, then face the fact he might just be right. Also know that he enjoys stirring the pot so ignoring him might serve you better than threatening him.

sinktip

Darin, I keep tellin ya brother ya can't argue with this guy . He only hears what he wants to.

"You can choose to fish the c&r season or not. No one is going to force you. Why don’t you accept the fact that there will be certain seasons and areas designated catch and release."

Tell me what the difference is in you telling people that c&r is wrong and should not be allowed unless when you can kill one and the c&r folks saying killing a fish is wrong and you should not fish unless you c&r? And don't tell me it is some moral thing. That’s a cop out. We talking about fishing, not screwing your sister. Although I practice c&r in that area also. Your howling over c&r is no different then the c&r folks howling over you killing one. Both of you are trying to tell the other what to do.

Thanks Sky, you're right I think I'll go fishing or do something with my family.... leave the bad politics up to guys that like to stir up fights and the worst in people.

Good Fishing to you, Darin