I understand everyones right to fish the way they like.

When it comes to fishing I myself use different lures and occasionaly flyfish.

But I also am a "Bait Soaker and Chucker" especially when it comes to my 3 year old daughter. She is just learning and so we go to lakes where it is legal to use bait.

But when I fish by myself or with another adult I go to lakes and rivers and in salt I use lures and flys.

So please be aware that most of us "Bait Soakers and Chuckers" only do it where legal.

And if I were to go to a lake such as Rattlesnake I would bring my lite gear and use only single barbless hooked lures.

Thank you for letting me vent.

Just a note. I can take a lot of ribbing and can give some back just would like to see more RESPECT for people who do fish with bait where it is legal.

That's right, i fish with bait when i take my 3year old son with me. He can't cast yet so it's the easiest way for him, but at the same time i toss back anything that hasn't been hooked deep and follow the regs. There ain't nothing wrong with it as long as you're follow the law.

PT - Not quite sure where you are coming from. There is no question that bait is an effective way to fish and I have no problem with it. I have not seen posts that put down chuckers & soakers. The only negative post against bait is on selective waters were it is not allowed, hence illegal. Fish legally and I doubt you will see any complaints against the use of bait.
Fish anyway you like, JUST FISH! (Legally.)

I have to somewhat disagree with Microbrew. Baitsoakers are part of a mentality of
Put and Take Fishing that is directly responsible for the poor quality of the majority of our
fishing waters. The cost of baitfishing is incredably high in addition. You might say
that bait fishing is KILLING (and eating) the sport.
I started out fishing with bait and cannot argue that it's somewhat easier than other methods
and should have a place in angling(for the kids sake.) However, one must admit that the vast majority of fishermen and women never progress beyond slinging the bait or trollling w/ bait.
And in Canada I see often Fathers teaching flyfishing to their 5-6 year old kids. So lets not use the
kids as an excuse to baitfish.
The inherent EVIL in baitfishing is simply that you can't release any of your catch without poor
odds of survival. Those few of you baitchuckers who brag of releasing much of your catch are
actually extremely hard on the resource because most of your released fish will swim off
and DIE. Those of you I am familiar with usually break the law by releasing more that your legal
limit each day plus keeping a few. (while baitfishing the first 5 fish you catch regardless if released
or kept IS YOUR DAILY LIMIT).

You who eat fish regularly are also responsible for the mentality that pervades the sport that it's
OK to catch and eat,give away,or freezer burn your limit each time out because F&G "will plant more
for us next year".Your put and take lakes never develope more than a few Carryover sized trout you so long for because you take them all home and eat them each year. That means a couple of things. Worst of all is that the fishing is essentially OVER in about 6 weeks as 95% of the fish have been jerked out and eaten.Secondly and also bad is that F&G has to plant the expensive triploid and Jumbo which has been grown to a pound or so to plicate you with a few big fish to catch because you won't let the lake grow them.

It makes me cry to see rich lakes, which could grow trophy trout in abundance with good management and provide sport pretty much throughout the fishing season managed for 6 weeks of put and take mayhem on 8-10" fish year after year. It also saddens me to fish Canada and see that the majority of their lakes are managed with quality in mind and the majority of anglers fish with barbless flies and C&R their catch compared to the Put and Take Attitude and poor quality of sport here.

I know this diatribe will not convince many if any that put and take baitfishing is something they
should evolve away from for the sake of the sport of fishing. That said, I still prefer to point out to the baitfishermen who fish trout, that you ARE a big problem and you should change your way of fishing for the sake of the sport.
If that insults or angers you.....so be it.

Bait, oh yeah, is there any other way?

FishnfellaS,

put and take fishing is a standard in the majority of our trout lakes because the majority of fishermen like to catch fish AND take them home to eat. there's nothing evil about that.

your observation about Canadian fathers teaching their 5-6 year old children to flyfish is the exception rather than the rule, no matter what Trout Unlimited tells you in their literature.

i dont think you will find the answer you are looking for on this board. or maybe you are just looking to stir up emotions again? it seems like you post the same thing regarding the evils of bait fishing every month or so???

I am proud to announce that i bait, fly, and lure fish. I have not kept a single fly-fished fish. I have kept ALL my bait-fished fish. I have C&Red many lured fish, but have kept many also

I posted this because I read the post about maybe a bunch of us getting together and fishing and one spot came up was Rattlesnake lake and one person said to the effects that those "Bait soakers and Chuckers" would just blend in the poachers.
If we had this meeting at any lake with selective gear rules the ones that do not ever fish with lures and flies probably will not show up and if the do most probably want to learn how to use lures and flies succesfully.
And as to using my kid as an excuse is total BS because she may never want to fish other than to be with me dear ole daddy and its her way of being in my life.
When she is older say 5-6 and wants to learn to fly fish or use artifiacals I will teach her, but I will be damned if I am going to force her into doing something she does not like.
And as for the "bait" lakes fish there is one with a limited number of native fish and was that way for many years according to old timers and the other never had fish at all matter of one lake I used to fish dried up every year until the built a earthen dam and used it for irrigation( I am from North Central Washington which is all but a desert).
And yes I do understand about planting trout in lakes just for people to eat that have great numbers of native fish in them and thus making the natives stressed. In those lakes I agree do not plant fish.

i could be wrong about this, lord knows i often am, but weren't many of these trout(almost every species) brought to here origanally and stocked all over? i know that we talk about the good old days, and how once upon a time the you didn't even need a hook the fish just jumped into the boat, but realisticly would most of those fish have been here in the first place if we hadn't put them here. i know that in montana the native species were cutts and brookies, no rainbows or browns, they were brought here from the east, far east like europe east. does this mean i think fishing for these non-native species with bait is okay, i don't know, but i do know that trout aren't some form of untouched natural resourse that we are destroying. by putting more agressive species here we destroyed the native fish generations ago. i'm not trying to justify anyone's opinion pro bait or con, but i do think the reality we fish within is a reality that was created long before any of us were here. should we be more responsible with the resourse we now have? ofcourse, that goes for feather tossers to. i've fished many places and seen so much pressure put on blue ribbon trout streams by fly fisherman that its unreal, guides have told me every fish they take by the end of the summer show marks of being caught time and time again. is that good fishing ethics, to zap these fish over and over i don't know. what am i getting at? we live in the reality that we create and that was given to us by those who came before us, we should do our best to take care off it (through educating ourselves not pointing the finger) however we choose to use it.

I post my anit-baitfishing message occasionally because I'd like to help you poor
suckers who think you are fishing when you pull out a limit of 8-10" fish from
powerbait lake discover the REAL sport.....that is catch some REAL trout.

Of course I do it in a somewhat controversial way because I've learned to be nice
and put butter on a rotten egg does not change it from being a rotten egg. You all always
seem to get defensive and start spouting stuff like since the majority like to do
catch and kill fishing then it must be OK and besides we put those fish there
with out liscense money, etc.etc.etc. Rather than getting all defensive you should
speak with a few people who have converted and fish for quality sport. Chances are
they started out baitfishermen and WOULD NEVER GO BACK. Not because they are
elitist snobs as many baiters think, but because they are catching quality trout fishing
and would never return to a life of 8-10" trout just so they could eat them.

And yes I have a selfish motive here. I'd like to see fisheries management do something
because it's right,not because it plicates the majority. And I'd like to see more
quality fishing opportunities for those who enjoy fishing for sport.

Oh and Sushi, "Is it cruler to catch and release the same trout several times a season
or to jerk it out the first time, kill and eat it?" Put yourself into the trouts fins,which would you prefer?

The rationalizations regarding baitfishing are legion. I've heard them all. Your points are well taken.
Just don't ask me for a little respect when as you cannot refute,baitfishing and catch and kill fishing
is the reason for the poor quality of our troutfishing in Washington.

fishnfellas
i agree that the bait fishermen you speak of are an issue, the 8-10inchers, powerbait people whatever you want to describe them as, though i don't think that every person that uses bait is a vagrent, poacher, or out to destroy the area. most lakes in this area of the state are hard hit by opening day anglers( as are most lakes anywhere the population is this high) which is why i think stocking those lakes is a good idea, it allows the powerbait/ plunkers to satisfy their urges until the lake emptys of those fish. when it takes a bit more work or knowledge they go home until the next opening day. the resident or carry over trout are usually still there after opening day because they aren't as likely to go for powerbait/ what have you. does that sound correct, or am i living a lie?

as far as those trout that have been caught released, caught released over and over, i'm not saying that i think they should be killed i'm saying that is a type of abuse that is overlooked by a HUGE portion of flyfishermen. putting that much pressure on a stream or river IS cruel to the population. there are also many blueribbon waters that are becoming overpopulated to the point where people are being asked not to release all of there catch, wether fly, lure or bait caught. why? because rainbow and browns are so agressive that they destroy the true native fish and because catch and release is not allowing the trout population to stay at a level that can be sustained in the long run, wether through disease or lack of food. does that mean i would keep the fish, probably not, virtually any fish that i catch, unless there is a specific reason, goes back. why? because i don't eat fish regularly.

i do appreciate what you are so strongly opposed to, but the getting in your face aproach tends to dig peoples heels in further rather then convince them to change. every person that uses the outdoors has room learn and much to gain by doing so, wether they fish with bait or not.

I've seen the light!...I've given away all my fishing gear that's not approved by the society of snobby,crochety fly fishers of America. In return for their help in setting me straight,I'm gonna spend every waking minute stocking Smallmouth Bass in every water that doesn't have them now. After all to be a fly fisherman you have to be all about the sporting element,and Smallmouth are where it's at!!! :p

O.K....I've got a 55gal drum crammed full of Smallmouth. Next stop Chopaka, I hear it's a rough road, but my super snooty Land Rover should get me there. Next week I'll head to Lenice,Nunnally,and Merry lakes.If I've planned this right I'll have Smallmouth heaven in a couple years. Oh I almost forgot Banks they have some Smallmouth but not nearly enough ,there's still other fish in it. WhoooEeeee! this will be great the Smallies will eat all the trout AND they like artificial lures...Yea!

Thank's HBP, I needed the chuckle tonight. You guy's and gal's take care.

good one HBP!!

Oh boy.......can we stop now. This is getting old.

You didn't see me joining in here.... but HBP... why promote illegal activities??? You got a reason for always wanting to walk against the traffic??

PT, pay attention to who used the "bait soakers and chuckers" remark and you'll see you were getting tweaked. TM used to be one of the
biggest rabble rousers on the board before he found employment.

Sushi, you make an interesting point about planted trout(years ago)have made the Native fish far and few, or even extinct in some lakes. I never really thought of it that way. I shoot down the baiter/flyers/spinners that keep limits of 8 inch fish, simply because they are so much funner to catch the following year. So i thought, the more i release the more chance there will be bigger fish next year. ANd i couldn't see why other anglers don't want big fish(hence their keeping of them)but you have changed my ideas of it all now.

Maybe these fish(true natives) that i expect to be in these lakes, lurking under cover, waiting to pick off the next minnow or fly, really aren't even there. Well at least in the urban stocker lakes around the south sound area. How can you(us) be sure that any big fish we hook is or isn't a true native to that lake??? Is there a way to tell?

When i was 16, me and a good friend were fishing lake Fenwick, not known for anything but the usual stockers. And most stockers, around here atleast, seem to look a certain way. Either a purple stripe instead of pink or small tails, or dark bellies, and the bigger fish(which we consider hold-overs) either outgrow this dark look or came from a different batch of stockers or they are native. Anyways, we fished 6oz. weights with a 4 foot leader with a hotshot attached and trolled right off bottom. 20 minutes into it, we look out behind the boat and a nice rainbow jumped about 3 feet. Just as the head of the bow hit the water on it's way back in we noticed a weight also apeared and follow the arc of the rainbows jump. I slowely reeled him in and when i looked at him, he was unlike any rainbow i had ever seen. It had the typical markings but the spots were alot bigger than normal and the pink stripe wasn't pink, it was ice blue. Almost like glowing ice blue. Could this have been a native? Or did he just swim to close to the nuclear plant?

So i think you may be right Sushi. All my fish from that point on that i have caught out of local lakes for the past 15 years all look the same, but that one fish.

That sucks donkey $#%@ if this is true.

Hey Zen...
I'm just trying to lighten the mood around here.It seems every other month or so,somebody starts in with the badmouthing of another's fishing methods. Just two weeks ago we had a few members threatining each other over a question of somebody's manhood,and their not wanting to confront a group of poachers. In this day and age it's just plain STUPID to walk up to a couple drunks and confront them about damn near anything . It's a great way to get shot.

A while back when a certain induvidual wasn't posting,the mood around here was alot more pleasant. Ever since he came back,everybody's getting attitudes again. The thing that pisses me off is the fact that if anybody dissagrees with one of his posts,they are seen as a immature or a trouble maker because they don't agree with his views.

Why can't we all just accept others opinions,and not start a war everytime a topic on style of fishing comes up. Before you call me on my posts,take a look at the content, they aren't ment to ignite any ill will,they are just about having a little fun again.