#997724 - 11/29/18 02:33 PM
Pathetic but oh so true.
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My Area code makes me cooler than you
Registered: 01/27/15
Posts: 4546
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#997738 - 11/29/18 04:43 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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Shooting Instructor for hire
Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 7204
Loc: Snohomish, WA
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Yeah - that's sad. Because of the particular situation, I'm trying really hard to refrain from the whole "play stupid games, win stupid prizes" thing...but damn that's just stupid.
Why was there even an unarmed and unguarded mother and her young baby in the camp to begin with? Why was she even there? Totally unnecessary. These should guys know better and they do know better. Especially if they've already had previous problem bears.
Part of winning the risk battle is not even playing the game of chance and removing yourself from bad opportunities. Hell, there's another million different ways for that mother & baby to die up there past just bears - so where is the common sense?
Sad.
_________________________
“If the military were fighting for our freedom, they would be storming Capitol Hill”. – FleaFlickr02
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#997749 - 11/29/18 06:11 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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Shooting Instructor for hire
Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 7204
Loc: Snohomish, WA
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Thanks Captain Obvious. This was a very remote hunting and trapping camp in problem bear country during the big hunger. She was there on maternity leave with child and they were out and about walking while unarmed and unguarded. I continue to find it baffling how bad things seem to happen right after stupid decisions are made. I just must be a dense city slicker without extensive backcountry experience. What do I know. 
_________________________
“If the military were fighting for our freedom, they would be storming Capitol Hill”. – FleaFlickr02
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#997751 - 11/29/18 06:21 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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Shooting Instructor for hire
Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 7204
Loc: Snohomish, WA
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Nah - I knew that you were just speaking figuratively.
_________________________
“If the military were fighting for our freedom, they would be storming Capitol Hill”. – FleaFlickr02
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#997754 - 11/29/18 06:47 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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Dick Nipples
Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 27838
Loc: Seattle, Washington USA
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Who do you hold accountable?
Why does someone have to be accountable?
If you live where bears are, then you will have contact with bears. It's their fuckin house, after all.
This isn't a "we don't get to hunt enough" or "we shouldn't hunt" issue, not in the least...hunting or not, bears live in BC and Alaska. Bears are predators. Bears are territorial. People and bears together result in confrontations, and those typically end in the death of a person or a bear.
You can't blame the bear; they're being bears, they don't have any choices in the matter. They didn't come to someone else's house looking for a fight, it's where they live, and it's what they do.
This is a tragic story on many levels, and there are no easy answers or explanations for it.
"Shoot more bears" is a gross oversimplification to a complex problem. It's the exact opposite and equal answer as "don't ever go where bears are"...which is also a gross oversimplification.
Yeah, shooting more bears would reduce confrontations. So would people not being where bears live. Why is one any better than the other?
The answer is that they aren't...people and bears are going to be together, and confrontations are going to happen.
Seems to me that there were several things that could have happened to avoid this, and picking one and saying "this is who/what is accountable!" is ignoring the rest.
Fish on...
Todd
_________________________
 Team Flying Super Ditch Pickle
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#997772 - 11/30/18 07:04 AM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7612
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
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I think Todd nails it. This is a really bad time of year for concentrated protein to be in bear country, especially Grizzly. They need lots of protein, they need it now.
There is a lot of truth to the "Play stupid games, win stupid prizes" idea. Plus, life is a risk. Somebody here gets involved in a car wreck will there be calls to ban all cars, or kill all drivers (at least the subset that caused the wreck?). That is the risk and the beauty of the outdoors.
Our daughter, at Clemson, was out hiking recently and almost stepped on a small Copperhead. It apparently was trying to bite her ankle. Snake was beautiful, small, dangerous, and had every right to be there. They stepped around it and went on their hike.
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#997775 - 11/30/18 08:38 AM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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My Area code makes me cooler than you
Registered: 01/27/15
Posts: 4546
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King County continues it's march toward ignorance.
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#997784 - 11/30/18 12:24 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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The Chosen One
Registered: 02/09/00
Posts: 13942
Loc: Tuleville
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Didn't read the article. Don't got no facebook. Besides, I hear Facebook is a 306'er thing.
Doesn't sound like the bear was interested in eating, as the bear mauled the two people to death and then charged the husband. No cubs so I gather is was not a protective mamma bear. The bear didn't stick around to eat what it killed. Was doing it for fun, pleasure, or the whatnots. Probably sick, weak, or was a member here on the Darkside.
Bear gone bad.
Bear gotta go.
Doesn't mean you gotta kill every last bear or severly cull the brown bear population, though....if that was what was being mentioned in the article. Just the problem bears. They gotta go.
Just like the problem wolves. They gotta go too.
Problem sharks are OK, though.
"Now, if we could just get rid of the problem people" -A. Hitler & J. Stalin
_________________________
Tule King Paker 
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#997835 - 12/01/18 11:50 AM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: The Moderator]
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Shooting Instructor for hire
Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 7204
Loc: Snohomish, WA
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"Now, if we could just get rid of the problem people" -A. Hitler & J. Stalin
Do you propose a remedy for that Paker? Perhaps a final solution?
_________________________
“If the military were fighting for our freedom, they would be storming Capitol Hill”. – FleaFlickr02
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#997837 - 12/01/18 11:56 AM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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Repeat Spawner
Registered: 08/04/99
Posts: 1431
Loc: Olympia, WA
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Interesting article and video featuring bears, bait, poaching, timber companies, cheatin' hunters with hounds and questionable WDFW bear management practices. Gotta be a reality TV show, or a soap opera for outdoorsy types in there somewhere... https://www.king5.com/article/tech/scien...w/281-545006442
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#997850 - 12/01/18 02:20 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: NickD90]
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Carcass
Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 2267
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"Now, if we could just get rid of the problem people" -A. Hitler & J. Stalin
Do you propose a remedy for that Paker? Perhaps a final solution? It appears that those that like to dish it out---can’t take it---Pity. It also appears like attacking the messenger instead of the message is the preferred method, instead of a debate on the subject matter of that particular thread. Either way works for me.
_________________________
The world will not be destroyed by those that are evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything.- Albert Einstein
No you can’t have my rights---I’m still using them
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#997861 - 12/01/18 05:26 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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Shooting Instructor for hire
Registered: 10/26/10
Posts: 7204
Loc: Snohomish, WA
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You're reading way too much into things. Hanlon's razor Chief. I see an opening to make a horrible, poor, no good WWII joke and I take it. I call my shots. Albeit generally very poorly and to the detriment of greater society at large.
Edited by NickD90 (12/01/18 05:29 PM)
_________________________
“If the military were fighting for our freedom, they would be storming Capitol Hill”. – FleaFlickr02
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#997882 - 12/02/18 10:33 AM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: NickD90]
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Spawner
Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 981
Loc: Tacoma
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Yeah - that's sad. Because of the particular situation, I'm trying really hard to refrain from the whole "play stupid games, win stupid prizes" thing...but damn that's just stupid.
Why was there even an unarmed and unguarded mother and her young baby in the camp to begin with? Why was she even there? Totally unnecessary. These should guys know better and they do know better. Especially if they've already had previous problem bears.
Part of winning the risk battle is not even playing the game of chance and removing yourself from bad opportunities. Hell, there's another million different ways for that mother & baby to die up there past just bears - so where is the common sense?
Sad. +1
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#997883 - 12/02/18 10:34 AM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: NickD90]
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Spawner
Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 981
Loc: Tacoma
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Thanks Captain Obvious. This was a very remote hunting and trapping camp in problem bear country during the big hunger. She was there on maternity leave with child and they were out and about walking while unarmed and unguarded. I continue to find it baffling how bad things seem to happen right after stupid decisions are made. I just must be a dense city slicker without extensive backcountry experience. What do I know. +1
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#997884 - 12/02/18 10:47 AM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: Todd]
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Spawner
Registered: 03/01/11
Posts: 981
Loc: Tacoma
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Who do you hold accountable?
Why does someone have to be accountable?
If you live where bears are, then you will have contact with bears. It's their fuckin house, after all.
This isn't a "we don't get to hunt enough" or "we shouldn't hunt" issue, not in the least...hunting or not, bears live in BC and Alaska. Bears are predators. Bears are territorial. People and bears together result in confrontations, and those typically end in the death of a person or a bear.
You can't blame the bear; they're being bears, they don't have any choices in the matter. They didn't come to someone else's house looking for a fight, it's where they live, and it's what they do.
This is a tragic story on many levels, and there are no easy answers or explanations for it.
"Shoot more bears" is a gross oversimplification to a complex problem. It's the exact opposite and equal answer as "don't ever go where bears are"...which is also a gross oversimplification.
Yeah, shooting more bears would reduce confrontations. So would people not being where bears live. Why is one any better than the other?
The answer is that they aren't...people and bears are going to be together, and confrontations are going to happen.
Seems to me that there were several things that could have happened to avoid this, and picking one and saying "this is who/what is accountable!" is ignoring the rest.
Fish on...
Todd I don't camp in rattlesnake dens in Eastern Washington for a reason. Shockey like so many has the "kill mentality" as evidenced by his life long career of killing. Do you think he's eaten every bite of what he's killed? I think not. I gave up deer hunting right after I started. They taste like sh!t regardless of how you cook it unless you flavor it up which defeats the purpose. If you kill it you should eat it. Being a father and a grandfather I feel bad for that woman and her baby. It's heart breaking but if my daughter said she was going up there I would have begged her not to. Common sense....something so many people lack. There are a lot of people that live off the grid that realize they are in the bear's house like you said Todd and they know the risks and live with those risks.
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#997936 - 12/03/18 12:46 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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My Area code makes me cooler than you
Registered: 01/27/15
Posts: 4546
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"Didn't read the article. Don't got no facebook. Besides, I hear Facebook is a 306'er thing."
You don't need Facebook to click on the link and read it professor.
I respect you choosing not to read it though.
I guess that makes me pro choice.
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#997937 - 12/03/18 12:49 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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The Chosen One
Registered: 02/09/00
Posts: 13942
Loc: Tuleville
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I'm trained NOT to click on anything I didn't personally request, let alone posted on this board.
I bet Evo clicked on the link and got herpes.
Crap. I clicked on the link. I feel unclean now.
Eh, still stand by what I said...although I am just as much of an expert on grizzy bears as the rest of you and all we really share on this is our opinions. Which are like assholes.
I still stand by what I wrote. Killing more bears won't solve anything. A population of 1 can still kill.
WE are invading THEIR territory and are doing so more and more every day. That isn't going to stop, by the way.
People that wish to live in grizzly bear country should be very aware of the dangers, and if they chose to ignore it, so be it.
Now, don't get me started about REINTRODUCING grizzly bears (or wolves) to an area where they no longer exist......if that isn't the definition of stupid, then I do not know what is.
_________________________
Tule King Paker
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#997938 - 12/03/18 01:34 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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Lord of the Chums
Registered: 03/29/14
Posts: 6771
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if they are over populating an area, you need to maintain a level that isnt a threat....
more bears, more food needed, if there isnt the food they normally eat, they will shift to something else...
its funny how some hunter/fisherman, say things like "we dont need to get rid of more bears", then in the same breath, say "we need to get rid of some of the sea lions" because they are harming fish returns...
you cant have it both ways, either its population control, or not...
as far as us invading their space, we are the apex predators on this planet, its OUR space as well... not just the bears... this is a planet, and we all co exist on it...
this isnt just brown bears either, from what ive been told by locals at Kaites dads house in Campbell River, is that the black bears are more of a threat there than the browns... the black bears have no fear of humans at all... they are the ones that rip the garbage cans apart and go into houses/cabins the most apparently...
as far as wolves, well, PETA and their friends are going to cause a real bad problem soon... they are already on this side of the mountains, and if you know anything about dogs, you know how they breed.....
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#997941 - 12/03/18 03:03 PM
Re: Pathetic but oh so true.
[Re: WDFW X 1 = 0]
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My Area code makes me cooler than you
Registered: 01/27/15
Posts: 4546
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"If man manages some of the species in an ecosystem he should manage the species of the eco system".
Me
12/3/18
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