Whoops, sorry about that Muskie Man, I forgot about all of the Native American bashing in that thread. I generally glance over that stuff. Vhawk and Deerslayer had some good tips though. I myself used a whole herring about four feet under a bobber. No weight was required because the herring was very heavy, and the fish were near shore anyway. I got a missed a couple of bites before a chum simply grabbed my herring and made a run with it. It was a very neat thing to see! Of course take everything I say with a grain of salt as it may have been beginers' luck.