How can I get my hands on some of these hooks? I've been less than satisfied with the Gamis lately. Well, the red ones lately anyway. The anodizing comes off the hook out of the package. I expect a little more quality for the $ that they charge. I like the treated hooks because I won't sharpen a hook. I'd rather replace it. If I could find a quality hook at the right price, I would be a long term customer. I've tried every store around and nobody carries Visions. Can I buy in bulk at a discount? I see their "pro staffers" on this board, so I thought I would check here.

I've got a question about Vision hooks, too... do they come in any bends other than Limerick bend, like do they come in an Octopus or Viking type bend, or am I out of luck?

I've tried a few different packages of the Visions, and I like the sharpness, I like the strength, but I think I'd like to try them in an Octopus bend.

Just wondering,

-N.

"I won't sharpen a hook. I'd rather replace it."

Reel Time

Call O.C. Fisherman's Marine, I think they have Vision hooks.

Yes, they have visions in octopus hooks. Used them exclusively this fall fishing season with good success. They held up well. Go to the websiite. They can help you there. I thiink the website is http://www.visionhooksandtackle.com . I saay I think it's tha address.

Now, all I need is some vision fly hooks (hint hint Joe). I know you don't have any yet in production.

Reel Time,

I work for Vision and handle the accounts in Washington. Joe "Superfly" from this board works with the dealers in Oregon and he should be able to give you a list of dealers closest to you and/or bulk ordering information. I will let him know about your questions and have him contact you if you like or e-mail him at superfishh@home.com

Thank you and good fishing,

MoFish, O.C. Fisherman's doesn't carry them. Kid Sauk, Thanx, I will E-mail Superfly.

I tried some Visions this year after everyone said how good they were. I bought 100 and 6 broke in a fishes mouth. Thats 6% failure, I'm working my way thru 100 Mustad Ultra Points now...so far, so good.

Randy and I must have had the same batch of hooks. I also encountered hooks breaking on fish or just plain becoming unbuttoned.
I was using red 1/0 octopus.
I also have noticed that my red Gamakatsus lose there finish lately, however I would rather use gamy with a tainted finish over a Vision hook any day.

My opinion is that Vision hooks will always be inferior to the real thing.

F.J. out.

Interesting. I won't say Vision Hooks are perfect, but I've only seen one Vision Hook break on a fish. That was 5/0 that snapped in half on a fish on the Wind River.

I have had some "issues" with the light-wire jig hooks, but then again, they are not meant for big fish, and that was my issue. Aside from that, I've never personally snapped or straightened a Vision hook.

I'd be curious to know how old those batches of hook are/were. I can't speak for Justin or Joe, but I'm sure if you send the hooks back, they'd be happy to replace them for you. Send Joe some email.

We've suffered a large set back on the Vision e-commerce site. The on-line site should be up and running in the next week or two. Soon, you will have www access to Vision Hooks & Tackle.

Does the e-mail still work? I sent Superfly mail and have had no response as of yet. I'll give it a couple of days. I know it's the weekend. Actually the finish on the reds Gamis was the only issue I had. The problem is the price mostly. Gami offers no real discount on bulk purchases. When Fisherman's Marine has the Gamis on sale in the packages, they are cheaper than the bulk boxes when you do the math. Quite sad. The anodizing coming off out of the package was nothing more than a kick in the butt to look into other hooks. If I can't save $, then I'll stick with what I'm using I guess.

I've always been a fan of Gamakatsu (still am), but lately I haven't had too much money so I tried the Vision hooks. I've been using the 1/0's on silvers and they've been a great hook for the money. I prefer Gamakatsu, but they are almost twice as much $$$. Haven't had any trouble with the Vision's breaking, but I've only used them on silvers. All in all I think they are a good hook for the money.

~ Dr Pepper

I've been using the 3/0 black octo's for my nightin' and I've lost 4 kings out of the 20+ caught in those few trips.

1 40+
0 30's
a buttload of teens and 20+'s

The fish were lost = 1 that was too much for my line capacity. 1 sawed me off. And 2 were foul-hooked.

I did not break a hook. The last hooks I have broken were 2 gammies on springers.

Hooks break, hooks dull, etc. That's part of fishing. I know I have had no probs. fishing Visions and if I did, Joe is about as an approachable guy as any so I don't think customer service is an issue.

But when you compare apples to oranges, you can't draw too many conclusions so give them a try, and use the right hook for the right conditions.

i've been using visions for the last year up here. and i have to say i'll probably keep using them! i've been really impressed! not real expensive but i really like the hook, i've broke a couple of hooks, i think this was due more to my pliars attacking the hook when trying to unbutton it from a fish. i've also been using vision snap swivels, and i have to say i love these too! i actually just bought another 100 snap swivels this weekend, and once again put them to the test, caught a nice 20+ pound king this weekend and had nooooo problem with the swivel or the hooks, too bad i had the let that chrome HOG go but it was still fun! hmmm...this reminds me i think i'm going to go get some more 1/0 red vision hooks at lunch time, i think i'm getting a little low!

Anyone else think that these numbers look like Y'all's recent dating pool?

[ 10-29-2001: Message edited by: Dave Jackson ]

Dave good question...but look at him ,do you really beleive he would have a date.

I'm sure those were all boots.
when you're night fishin they all look bright.

as far as this topic goes..........how in the Hell do you break a hook

I've had great luck with Visions,I also fish other brands,but I've never broke a hook,i need some of you're line.......Os

I was a Gammy man for over 10 years and lemme tell ya that Gammies are too expensive and you will lose more fish with Gammies than you will with Visions. The reason for this has to do with the design of the hook. The hook tine to shank ratio is greater on the Visions which gives you a deeper hookset which means more holding power. I have done extensive research on Vision Hooks and I fish as much as anybody. Very, very few problems if any and I have tried out stuff that hasn't even hit the market yet.

One more thing to remember for the skeptics....Vision hooks are sized differently than Gamakatsu's. Comparably, Visions are a size smaller than the Gammies so a 1/0 Vision is pretty close to a #1 Gamakatsu. Keep this in mind when buying or ordering your Vision Hooks.

If anybody wants to talk to me about good or bad experiences with their Vision Hooks feel free to e-mail me at visionhooks@hotmail.com and I'd be happy to help you out. If anybody needs a demo on the river sometime just let me know and I'd be happy to put the Vision Hooks and swivels up against any Gammies, Mustads, Owners, you name it. We are a small Olympia-based company and we are doing the best we can at distributing a quality product. Superfly and I post regularly on this board and are eager to offer advice to those who need it. I don't see any of the owners from Gamakatsu helping people out here on Bob's board, do you? Give us a chance and you will be pleased.

Thank you and fish on!

Actually, my brother Mike, I was finding considerable value in his usage of the word "buttload" as far as his dating pool goes.

My brother...........Anytime the phrase Date and Buttload are used together.............I get nervous ..........Os

Kid Sauk, Last year I E-mailed Superfly about getting some hooks to tryout up in Ak where I guide, and he said he would send me some, never recieved any so went to Auburn Sports & Marine and bought 100, hoping to find a replacement for the 1500 or so Gammies I buy a year, of the 100, 7-8 were garbage, I can't afford to have clients use hooks I don't have confidence in so I didn't use any of them. As for Gammie's, no there not perfect either but I buy them by the thousand and only get 1-2 bad ones per box, thats .2% defective compared to 8%, maybe things have changed in a year, I don't know, but I won't pay to find out.
As for the owners of Gammie not posting here, don't think they have the time, to busy selling great hooks all over the world.
why are all hooks compared to Gamakatsu, because they are the best.

I like Vision hooks but are they smaller then Gammies? I got some size 2 and compared them to Gammies and they looked like size 4. Do I need to go an extra size up or am I exagerating? Thanks.

O's as it seems that you have the impression that I am using mondo heavy line I would like to set the record straight. Broken 1/0 hook on a quality 12# leader , does this setup exceed the maximum line to hook ratio? If so would you recommend going to say, a 3/0 ?

I'm so confused............ F.J.....out.

AkKings, sorry to hear that you had a few bad ones in that pack. Since we are a smaller locally-based and rapidly growing company we are steadily improving our quality control efforts so you don't have to find any bad ones in your 100 packs. It's too bad that you didn't use the hooks and if you are still interested, then you can e-mail me and I'll send you a sample along with info on our guide program that you will want to learn about. I also used Visions up in AK last summer with no problems and there are a lot of AK guides and lodges using Vision Hooks and Swivels with great success. Shoot me an e-mail at visionhooks@hotmail.com and we can work on getting you a replacement for that 100 pack you mentioned.

Plug Puller, Vision Hooks are sized differently than Gamakatsu. Visions are close to a size smaller than Gammies so go up a size on the Visions if you want the same size hook as a Gammy. They are also a different shape which includes a longer shank for holding your bait better.

I've never seen your swivels before. How much do they cost? I've been using the cheapy Danielson swivels. The snap part breaks on me all the time when I'm tying a knot and I'm tired of them. So how much are they?

~ Dr Pepper

Hey wasn't this originally a question about where a guy could find these hooks? A couple of posts helping the guy out then all of sudden you startin bustin on the product. Then you start bustin on each other. Any chance you could of just e-mailed the guy with your opinions? Sheeesh!

Since the issue has been raised I might as well jump into it too. I've been using Vision #1 and 1/0 blacks since Joe first lent me a few on the river. I'd been snapping off Lazer Sharps right and left on nice silvers. Been using them since with zero problems on a heck of lot of large pig silvers and bad doogies. No busted hooks....and I'm one of those heavy handed guys that doesn't use the drag much but likes to bury the ol'thumb in the spool. Plus the design as pointed out is different...I think they hook better and definitely stay in better especially when barbless than whatever brands. Plus I've never seen the use in a metallic red hook unless your after Lk Washington sockeye.

Dr Pepper definitely give those swivels a try.

Cove RV Park & Tackle Prostaff(1)
Always FishOn!
Gooose

Kid Sauk, Thanks for the offer but I think I'll stick with what I have confidence in, the reason I didn't try any of the remaining hooks was because I was worried there would be others with defects I couldn't see, when half of my seasons earnings are tips I don't like to have to explain to a guy why his king just busted a hook. I'm sure 90% of those hooks are good, its the other 10% that concerned me. In 11 yrs. I haven't broke any Gami's and only straigtened a couple both on big halibut. Thanks again but I'm happy with the Gami's.

HELLO? I'm not asking for anything free here. I would like to actually BUY some darned hooks.

Let me quote: We are a small Olympia-based company and we are doing the best we can at distributing a quality product. Superfly and I post regularly on this board and are eager to offer advice to those who need it. I don't see any of the owners from Gamakatsu helping people out here on Bob's board, do you? Give us a chance and you will be pleased."

In direct response to that:
1. I don't see your products for sale anywhere I buy gear. I sent an e-mail Saturday and have had no reply. Your web site has no info at all.
2. I'm not asking for advice, just hooks. If I needed advice I would write Dear Abby.
3. I'm giving your company a chance. However, my efforts have seemed futile.

Now if anyone would like to actually sell some hooks, my e-mail is below. If you only want to tell me how good your products are, then let me tell you what my grandpa used to tell me. "Talks cheap. It takes money to buy whiskey."

catch22@spiritone.com

Dr. pepper, i got a 100 pk of snapswivels, for $5.59 at yeagers sporting goods in Bellingham, not sure where to find them where your from, but they are a good buy for that many swivels, and i havent had one pull out yet!

Reel Time and others,
You can e-mail me at superfishh@home.com
Thanks Joe

I would like to be so forunate as to say I hooked something that actually broke the hook, I think I would be almost grateful I didn`t get it in, I would probably be afraid of the dang thing..If the thing can break a hook without snapping the line, sheesh,,
But as for Reel Time, I still didn`t see your inquiry get answered, maybe Dear Abby is your best bet..

FJ I'm not dissin on you
I've just never broke a hook is all.

With a name like Jesus,I'd think you wouldn't even need a hook .....Os

IMHO Vision makes the best barrel swivel

ReelTime:

I don't handle any of the accounts for Vision, so I can't tell you why your favorite tackle store(s) does not carry any Vision Products.

I am working on the www side of Vision, so I'll respond to your inquiries again (see above reply).

As I mentioned earlier, we've suffered a LARGE set back on the Vision e-commerce site. The new on-line site should be up and running in the next week or two. Soon, you will have www access to Vision Hooks & Tackle, and will be able to buy Vision tackle on line.

Obviously, we don't want to piss off Bob, so we'll get in touch with him about how to announce it to you all.

Hang in there. I have a day job, so my time working on the site is limited to my off hours.

In the meantime, fire off some email to Joe or Justin. Don't worry if they don't respond immediatley, as they are probably on a river fishing someplace.

Parker, no fishing for us Vision guys today. Too much work and Joe and I are both in the office today if anybody needs any info and/or orders.

visionhooks@hotmail.com

Thanks and good fishing

[ 10-30-2001: Message edited by: Kid Sauk ]

Getting one of your geeky fishing buddies to help you on your professional website = good thing

Trying to get that buddy to work on it during a record fall fishery = bad thing

O's it's all good. What can I say about the Fish Jesus thing, you know how it is when the mojo flows and you can't keep them off, your buddies begin to call you names. The FJ thing
sounds much nicer than a-hole, my previous moniker.

Note: I have had great success with Visions black hooks. Are the same proccesses and metals used for both?

FJ........... out.

I've used the Vision hooks for over a year now with no probs - they are a good hook in both the red and the non-painted alloy (I haven't used the black ones yet). I use the 1/0's for steelhead, 2/0's for silvers, and both 4/0 and 5/0 for Kings. I haven't broken one yet. I did have 2 Vision snapswivels break at the wire snap holder on big silvers; but they were a size too small for the target fish. No probs with the next size up. Gamis are good hooks too. But I have had the paint come off as mentioned above. The Owner hooks are great but they are very expensive.

RT

The reds verses the black.

Superfly, that's the addy I used on Saturday and I got your e-mail this morning stating that you never received my mail. So, I checked my Sent Folder and the addies were the same. So maybe your e-mail is outgoing only.

Dr. Pepper,

You can buy Vision hooks and swivels at Swain's in Sequim, they don't have any Octopus bend hooks there, only Limerick bend, but they do have a bunch of swivels. If you don't see what you want, ask Brian or Rudy there to special order you what you want.

I've used the red #2 and red 1/0 Vision hooks, I like the initial sharpness and price, but I've straighted a bunch on snags (with #15 test) and I'm not sure if they stay sharp long enough for me, but my personal jury is still out, so I have to do more testing...

-N.

FJ, yes there is a different process in making the black from the red. First of all the black I think are sharper because they are handeld less. In the process of making the red hooks they go through 3 more processes which means they are handeld three more times which means everytime a hook is handeld it has the chance of becoming dulled or damaged. So I personally stay with the black, but the red outsale the black, go figure!
Peace Superfly

Ok thanks Stormin' I'll check that out tomorrow because I'll be in Sequim. Hope the swivels aren't too expensive. The more I use the Vision hooks, the better I like them. I've been using the Limerick bend ones that they have in stock at Swain's, but I'm going to see if they will order the Octopus style. Been working great on silvers this year. Have you been out to the Dungy yet?

~ Dr Pepper

I use both the vision and owner needle point with great success, No longer a gammy fan. Also like the Vision Swivels. Bay Street outfitters in Port Orchard used to carry the swivels but no longer does. Any Ideas where I can get some close or at Monty Square maybe......

Man I used those damn vision hooks and they suck JJ. I love those hooks for some reason I cant ever seem to bend them or dull the point well just my $.02
Dances out

Hey C1 I was just play around with Joe and he knows it those are the only hooks I ever use man they are great. So dont worry man it was all in fun and Joe knows it too so no hard feeling man.

[ 11-06-2001: Message edited by: danceswithfish ]

???

"Man I used those damn vision hooks and they suck JJ. I love those hooks for some reason I cant ever seem to bend them or dull the point well just my $.02"

Ok so you say you dont like Vision hooks, I hope that that is a joke because they are the best hooks on the market and then some. Today Justin(Kidsauk) and myself were catching chum on 1/0 visons and could even bend them at all.
I have never had a point break off or dull.


I will sugest visions to anyone that I come in contact with.

FISH ON!!!

:p


[ 11-01-2001: Message edited by: catcher1 ]

well that does it, if Catcher1 says Gami's are no good, I'm going to throw out my remaining Gami's and go get some of them Vision hooks. Dude, you sound like your kissin some major Kid Sauk butt.
I have to ask what you mean by "Gami's are no longer any good they are like a wife, they used to be cool but now they suck to have did they change how they make there hooks and I missed something. By the way kid, how many wife's have you had?

I have not had the opportunity to fish the vision hooks either, but, i am a diehard gami fisherman. How much do they cost for 100? Currently i get gami's from a wholesaler for 15.00 for 100. I will try to find some visions and try them, until then gamis are the only way to go...I have yet to have a gami break, worst case is that they bend, the only time this happened is when i was hung up anyways. My $.02.

That's the million dollar question Fishinfreak! I've been waiting for 5 days for a price. I get lots of testimonials and hype but no prices. The Gammies are more expensive probably. However, at this rate, I'll never know. At least I can go down to the store and actually get the Gammies when I want. This is getting ridiculous. I'm not sure that I even care anymore.

Vision hooks and swivels kick butt. Ive been using them for over a year now. I havent had any problems with them. I was one of the first guys in my area to start using them. Now everyone uses them.
There are not a lot of retailers carrying Vision. You guys need to start bugging your favorite tackle stores to carry Vision products.
My wifes store in Kalama carries Vision hooks and swivels. In fatc she needs to order some more, we are almost out.

Akkings you know you can pay a pile of money for
a fancy good product...and I'll be the first to admit that gami's are a good hook....or you can get the same service out of a reasonably priced good product that doesn't depend on glamour but simple functional quality and innovation. Glitzy colors and big money advertising campaigns made gami's what they are in the market....and they can charge big extra bucks for their product because most fisherman are easily caught by fancy makeup. I call it the "sucker" factor. Shoot there's been no diff between gami's in quality and all the less expensive copycat hooks such as Owner, VMC and Mustad. Just a price has been the diff. Visions steelhead/salmon hooks have some noted innovations that myself and some really hardcore steelhead fishermen have been always looking for in our hooks for years. Gami's and the other brands haven't recognized this but apparently these Vision guys have. Hey if they don't perform at least as well as the hooks with the heavy makeup and fancy clothes I'll be the first to bail on them....but I won't dis them on the way out. Finally...don't get any ideas that the Kids pimpin me either....don't work for the company...and alls I've gotten from him is my free sample of hooks & swivels.

Gooose

I like the Hooks but after hearing the word from Catcher. a 17 year old kid that has a track record of sh$#. What do you know about a good wife. Heck my kid has thrown back more fish than you have ever cought. But yes the Hook are are great.

It seems to me, that if your are happy with the product, in this case the hook, that you are using keep using them. If you aren't then try something else.

I have used Gammis, Owner, Mustad etc. and they work fine for me. I personally like Hayabusa hooks, which are a Japanese made hook that you can buy at Wal-Mart. I have never used Vision products, but I am sure they have their followers that feel they are the best product for their particular needs. I am also sure they have people that don't like them, and thats fine too. It is all a matter of what a person feels confident in.

I was with RT when he broke the two Vision swivels he mentioned. We all were a little skeptical on the quality of the swivels that day. As it turns out, the swivels RT was using were not rated for the type of fishing we were doing. I am sure they tested to the pound rating they were designed for, they were just too small for Chinook fishing. That is not a product problem, that is an application problem. The swivels RT was using looked smaller than anything I would have tried. It would be like using a size 4 hook and hooking a Chinook that bends or breaks the hook, and blaming the hook manufacturer. Kudos to RT for finding out the "Reel Truth" before blasting what I am sure are a very good quality swivel.

Reeltime. If you are not getting good customer service from a company, go elsewhere. Support companies with your dollars that you feel are taking care of business, whether that company is Vision, Gammi, Owner or VMC.

As for Gammi's advertising being the reason people love them, I don't buy that. They earned a good reputation by offering a good product. Give them some credit. If advertising was the main reason people bought fishing gear, I think we would all be using Maxima Perfection.

Just to clarify, Mustad cannot be described as a "copycat". Mustad has been around longer than most other hooks and are of excellent quality.

Furthermore, Mustads can be found in most tackle shops and they stand behind their products!
I cannot understand the fuss over a hook that you cannot find anywhere!
Good Luck!

[ 11-01-2001: Message edited by: fishskagit.com ]

Drift boat-
All I was saying about the wife thing is from what I have heard. And maybe you have fished longer then me but that meens nothing now a days, but try telling BK that your better at fishing then him because your older and he will LAUGH at you.

Just my opinion.

My dad used to be able to kick your dad's butt but now he's happy just fishing instead of buttkicking.

..and one time, at band camp.....

ReelTime, Vision doesn't sell directly to the public and does not have an e-commerce site up yet. If you want Vision products, you'll have to go to a tackle store to buy them for now.

I'd suggest that if your local favorite tackle store does not carry Vision products for them to get in touch with Joe.

Hey BK, I'm a better fisherman then you because I'm older then you! I'm sure as heck a better fishermen then The Kid! SO there! Oh wait, but that means I'm not as good as Joe. Oh well, 2 outta 3 ain't bad!

My oh My,
All this started from a guy that just asked where he could find and BUY a particular brand of hook..
Why doesn`t someone just tell reeltime where they sell them?
I`ve never looked for them so I don`t know or I would be glad to help you out guy.

[ 11-01-2001: Message edited by: rainycity ]

Ted's in Lynwood. Answered. (JK)

Actually, in ReelTime's defense, I went back and looked at all the replies. I compiled the results: From this thread, I've determined that:

You can call O.C. Fisherman's Marine just to find out they don't carry Vision products.

You can try going to Swain's in Sequim. No idea if they carry Vision or not.

You can email Joe but he may or may not be responding to email.

Apparently, no one wants to email Justin.

The Vision web site was mentioned, but it was learned that it's broken, doesn't have any useful information and won't get you any products.

Finally, I suggested Ted's, but that might be a long drive just for some hooks.

Ok, so ReelTime's questions was never really answered. I can't answer it, as I don't know who carries Vision products..other then Ted's. Just go to Ted's.

PS. I will be re-doing *ALL* of the www Vision stuff. Part of that will be a listing of tackle stores that carry Vision products. Sorry Reel Time, but that's on the backburner for now. We're in the process of changing over ISP's now. It's just one headache after the other.

So, to answer your original question, no, I have no idea where you can find a tackle store in your area that carries Vision Hooks & Tackle.

Parker

[ 11-01-2001: Message edited by: parker ]

Just for the record.....
The 6 hooks I broke were 1/0 red octopus. 1 broke on a spring king on the Frasier river on 20 lb test leader, another broke on a Skokomish king on 15 lb test, 1 broke on a Cowlitz silver on 12 lb test and the other 3 I don't specifically remember where, but they were tied on 12 to 15lb leaders. OS, I am with you, how do you break a hook? Don't know, just know that out of the 100 I bought 6 broke. Out of all the tackle components, the last one I would expect to fail would be the hook, and then I would expect it to bend out as a last resort.
Within hours of my original post on this thread, I got a e-mail from Fishead5 asking for the details of how I was fishing to get some details and offering to send me another 100 hooks. I am willing to try another 100 Visions, but it was not my intention to get anything for free, just report my experience with Vision Hooks.

Wow, with the same last names and living in the Northwest, you two guys are probably married.

"I sent an email Saturday...blah blah blah"

Last time I checked, most business hours are Monday - Friday 8am - 5pm, and when I contact a business via email, especially with an inquiry, it has taken up to 5 business days for me to receive a response.

Since they are a "small Olympia-based company" I imagine the small number of employees they do have, probably have to multi-task like a mother******. And since it is a company that caters to a particular interest, they probably get many many many emails. I guess one of the most key attributes in fishing gets left at the river = PATIENCE

And since you went to the website, I guess you plainly saw on the mainpage as you entered the site that the freakin' thing is under construction. Duh.

Vision also puts out a ton of VOLUNTEER HOURS so don't even start your lip because I know I haven't seen you attend any of these functions.

.....momma take this badge from me...I can't use it anymore.....

'Yall,

I take it you have some sort of personal stake in Vision products and the website?

Business 101: When trying to build a customer base, or get a fledgling company up and running, The LAST thing you want to do is alienate any potential customers. Let the product stand on it's own merit. Resist the temptation to lash out at those with dissenting opinions. Learn from negative feedback. And finally, THE CUSTOMER IS ALWAYS RIGHT!

4Salt

I do not get paid.

I do not like stupid people. (granted the person may not be stupid, just slipping.)

I don't know how many times it's been posted about locations where to buy.

I don't see why people have to huff-n-puff because Gamakatsu gives them a free, cool-looking sticker to put on their windshields.

I take personal interest in this because I like to see the local guys make it, especially those that give to the community.

I am a customer, and I am not always right.

There's several email addresses listed for Vision, on and off this board, and surely the question would eventually get answered. If it didn't, no sweat. It's not like it was a matter of life and death.

If I was concerned about customer service issues, I'd never do any business with Lamiglas or Shimano....but I still do from time to time.

People need to lighten up and expect someone out there has a differing opinion. I know what goes on behind the scenes, so I'm usually more patient before I go barking.

I'm sorry to thrash the guy above, but dude, the answers were pretty obvious. And as the company grows, so will customer service quality because it will be easier to delegate those responsibilities.

Who knows, maybe one day, they too will hand out nifty little window stickers at the sportsmen shows so I can look as cool as all the guys driving around with the Gammie stickers.

Of course I've only fished Gammies for 21 years, and many different styles, so I wouldn't know what I'm talking about either


............ it's just one of those days.

'Yall,

I definitely hear you on what you said above. My post wasn't a dis on you personally, just trying to point out that in the business world, impressions are EVERYTHING. How many times do you think Biff at the local McDonalds hears "Hey, do fries come with that?" when someone orders a value meal? He probably want to shout "Dipsh!t, don't you read the menu? But if he said that enough times, he would probably lose customers, and definitely get fired. I know that Superfly and KidSauk are your friends, and you want to come to the defense of their company. The main point of my post is: Sometimes you gotta turn the other cheek a little when trying to make the business a success.

Anyone who puts high-end product stickers on their rigs, be it fishing tackle or mobile stereo equipment, is looking for their rig to be broken into. This is why I'm considering creating a line of auto decals that say in really cool lettering "Stock Stereo", "Tinny Speakers", or maybe even "Garage Sale Pro Staff".

How's that for some serious digression?

4 Salt, no hard feelings were taken, nor was I trying to deliver any. It's one of those font things I guess...lol

I didn't take your post as a dis, so we be down like fo' flat tires on a lowrider.

Catch22, reel time, whomever the moniker. I tried sending you an email, but that was blocked, so I sent this. See below.

Just wanted to say sorry if I singled you out too much in the Vision thread. I was pissed before I read the thread and I was pissed when I posted.

I have no idea where Estcada is, so I don't have a list handy for locations in Oregon. I know there are not many locations in Oregon, but new accounts are building each day. You will have to namedrop to your tackle provider. Several places started selling Vision products where I live and where I fish because of name-dropping. It makes it easier for me.

I'm sorry no one replied to your email, but I'll try and see if I can't answer your question personally when I find out more. I know most of the Vision guys are out most of the time since they have to pull duties normally designed for more employees.

I know where Joe lives...LOL so picking up hooks is easier on me...lol

I would have emailed you this, but your mail icon is blocked. Feel free to PM me, or email me at this address: all_4_the_chinookie@hotmail.com

Again, I'm sorry for tearing in like that. I've been dealing with PR stuff all week (with what I do) so I know the headaches from Joe's end, but also from your end, but because I knew it from Joe's end, I erupted. (gotta love run-on sentences).

I'm normally a peaceful guy, honest....LOL

You'll like the hooks if you like Gammies, but you can't compare them to Owner's and other manufacturers of that caliber, but they do greatly rival gamakatsu. The better thing is that they can be resharpened if you are into stretching out your hooks. Again, don't have any negativity towards Joe and those guys because of my post. They are really a good bunch of guys, and hopefully you can see that in future dealings with them.

I consulted in the beginning on the Vision website, for free, and I can attest that the site is under construction. I can't even go into details about the headaches of dealing with the ISP's. We try not to post too much about the site because we don't want to upset Bob, but it is in the works.

Sometimes sites take years in the works with full-time employees, but most of the guys have day jobs and usually their time is not their own, so your understanding is appreciated.

take care,
Mike

Wow, this is definatley getting interesting

RANDY,

I want to go over a few things with you about the 1/0 Visions that you had problems with. First of all, I would like to send you a 100 replacement hooks in size 2/0 or 3/0. I want to clear the record and say that the 1/0 Visions that you used are about the same size as a #1 Gamakatsu and since Visions are sized smaller, then please make sure you go a size up if you are used to using that size in a Gamakatsu. Get a hold of me at visionhooks@hotmail.com and we can talk about getting you a replacement.

I would also like to thank you guys for the feedback which is appreciated both good and bad. I've said it before and I'll say it again.....we are a small company and we are trying to sell a quality product at a good price. Visions are the best chemically sharpened hook for the price (roughly 1/2 the price of Gammies).

I do a lot of field testing with Vision hooks, swivels and I use them in some pretty interesting situations like Catcher 1 got to witness yesterday. 15lb. chums with #4 and #2 Visions? Yup! Did it yesterday and broke the Maxima leader but didn't break any hooks. Please, folks, do not try this at home! I also use comparably sized Gamakatsu's in my research along with Owner and Mustad. Part of field testing is *comparison* which involves using similarily matched products in order to have an idea of how our product holds up to the competition. So far so good.

I have met a lot of great people from this board and if anybody wants to get a Vision Hooks demo on the water or you want me to send a sample to you, then e-mail me at
visionhooks@hotmail.com

*Thanks for being patient with your sample packages too. I get a helluva lot of requests and I am doing my best to get them all sent out

Now let's quit debating and get out there and get into what is turning out to be the best salmon season in recent history! Peace

No we aren't married :p
But I soon see another Redneck running for political office,I'm sure Bill and HIlary are sooo proud of you.

you back peddled faster than the idiot that yelled at Timberman and realized his mistake when Kev stood up

If I complain about the Hooks can I get some more too
OK here's my complaint....the Damm things keep getting stuck in my fingers....How's that.....Os

curious to one thing: why are the vision hooks a size smaller? Why not just call the size 1/0's size 1? Everyone is comparing them to Gami's...so it seems Gami's are the industry standard. I mean a Craftsman 3/8 drill bit is the same as anyone elses 3/8 drill bit. Apples to Apples thing.

Due to a recent international shortage of oompa-loomps the newer hook factories have to settle for the shorter variety in their hook manufacturing process. As these oompa-loomps are slightly smaller than regular the hooks that they make end up slightly smaller than the norm.

Until the supply of larger oompa-loomps hits the market we're going to have to slight differences in size from one manufacturer to the next.

LMFAO



You guys are killing me... How do you come up with this shheeeat

Clearance prices on Halloween candy cause sugar highs, which lead to overactive brain cells.

Dave,

Bad news, just got off the phone with the IRS. Seems they have confiscated Willy Wonka's Chocolate Factory and all said property contained there within, namely: the larger oompa loompa's used to make the everlasting gobstoppers and lickable wallpaper.

Seems Gamakatsu has the largest supply on hand and they are not subcontracting them out, and the United States military has directed all the larger oompa loompas towards the war, in dealings with caves.

Seems the first oompa loompas that were ever enslaved were found in caves in Canada, plus their flourescent hair aids in casting light.

For now, we'll have to deal with the size smaller deal. We would have gotten Gary Coleman and Joe C but they are working on a remake of "See No Evil."

REEL TIME.
I you ever get south check out these stores, Dan Dee's Sales in Sweet Home Oregon. Fishermans Corner in Philomath Oregon. Harrys Bait and Tackle in Newport. If the guys at the Surplus Center in Coos Bay ever get thier crap together they may carry them also. These are the only places I can name off the top of my head.
If you want to go a little north, Fishermns depot in Woodland has Vision hooks. Also Kalama River Bait & Tackle sales Vision Hooks and tackle The store is located 2.5 miles up Kalama river road in Kalama WA.
If your local shop doesnt carry Vision products, Ask them about carrying Vision products.

Everyone,
I have e-mailed reeltime 4 times, Please send me your mailing address and we can get some hooks to you.
Also if you ask for them at your local tackle shop they might put them in.
Jacks snacks and tackle in sandy has them, as does ollie damons and we are working on fishermans marine and many other stores in oregon as well.

you can e-mail me at superfishh@home.com
this address works as well as the other ones.

Also our hooks are about a 1/2 size smaller than the gammies, and since when did gammy become the sizing king? Mustad has been around many more years than they have so if I was going to compare hook sizes I would compare them to mustad since that is probably what everyone else did.

Thanks Superfly

Everyone,
I have e-mailed reeltime 4 times, Please send me your mailing address and we can get some hooks to you.
Also if you ask for them at your local tackle shop they might put them in.
Jacks snacks and tackle in sandy has them, as does ollie damons and we are working on fishermans marine and many other stores in oregon as well.

you can e-mail me at superfishh@home.com
this address works as well as the other ones.

Also our hooks are about a 1/2 size smaller than the gammies, and since when did gammy become the sizing king? Mustad has been around many more years than they have so if I was going to compare hook sizes I would compare them to mustad since that is probably what everyone else did.

Thanks Superfly

Newsflash, `neck. Joe C. is dead. Don't feel bad, as it only happended damned near a year ago.

Dead midgets bend no hooks.

Yeah and I bet next thing you'll say is Elvis is dead, and that there isn't a Satan Claus.

I wasn't talking about that Joe C. I was talking about the one down on 12th Street. Besides, if dead guys can do vaccuum cleaner commercials, who says Joe C. couldn't play a supporting role to Gary Coleman? :p

Just got back from Elk hunting in Eastern Oregon and read the crap posted after I left.
Hey, Yall. Apology accepted. Guess I was truly "stupid" to think that I could actually ask a question on this board without you "helping". Estacada is up the Clackamas river from Oregon City. So my local fishing store is OC Fisherman's marine. They don't carry Visions nor do any other stores around here that I can find. I was TRYING to support a local company. I don't GIVE A CRAP about stickers. I NEVER wanted anything for FREE. I just wanted to know if I could BUY some hooks in bulk.
Joe, Ollie Damon didn't have any last week when I dropped off a reel there for service. I have to go pick it up tomorrow, so I'll check again. I know where Jack's is and I can try there too. Thanx for the reply and and the offer on the trial pack of hooks. Like I said, I never wanted anything for free, and I still don't. Just wanted to know where I could find a reasonable deal on some hooks in bulk. Thanx-

I wasn't addressing you with the sticker, point.

Screw showing humility to you PACNW'ers. From now on, you want an unhumble redneck, you got one.

There's the redneck we all know and love!! I thought you were going soft on us for a minute there! Sometimes I take this crap too seriously and too personal. Many times I'm too impatient. I'm man enough to admit when I'm wrong and when that day comes, I'll do so!!