Any science types willing to comment on the effect of sodium sulfite on Salmon & Steelhead Smolts,Fry or native fish ?
SS is a commonly found in Egg Cure in very high doses.It is a proven Cancer causing agent.

Cancer-causing in humans or fish?

Cancer-causing in what doses?

I suppose it's possible, but I wouldn't think likely. Only because carcinogens (unless they're radioactive isotopes) usually require a fair amount of exposure to cause cancer.

I worry more about things like whirling disease than bait cures. Good Q though.....maybe some of our resident scientist-types could offer an opinion?

Welcome to Piscatorial Bilge Rat. Interesting first post. I hadn't heard that sodium sulfite is a carcinogen. Will you tell us where you got that information? And what levels are a serious cancer risk to fish or mammals?

It seems to me that like most carcinogens, it would have to be very high levels. Both fish and mammals contain natural high levels of sodium. But some of us fishers have been exposed to it's sulfite form with fine dust while making powdered egg cures, mixing eggs in it, and putting eggs and other baits and scents on our hooks. Guides and other long time serious fishermen could have significant exposure. I would think that it's not enough to be of significant risk levels though. I'm not aware of any non-smoking fishers that have gotten lung cancer, nor have I heard of a higher rate of any type of cancer among NW salmon fishers. But let us know what you read about it and where it can be looked into. Thanks. ...

As far as it's danger to salmon/steelhead in the completely diluted form it occurs in water, I strongly believe the only harm to these fish occur when they eat it - with a hook attached. They live most of their adult lives in an immensely higher concentration of sodium chloride (salt), but aren't being killed or harmed by that. It would reason that a microscopicly infantesimal (sp?) amount of it in water would not have any affect at all.

RT

RT has it right, salt content in the ocean that raises these fish, is 100 times higher than that which all fisherman could possible emmit into any body of water. a larger problem would be the effect of pencil lead on our fish. just how much lead is in a river that gets beat lots? think about that.

Sodium sulfite is not a known carcinogen, however it may be toxic to some animals but there's no data on aquatic toxicity, TLM96.

NTP CHEMICAL REPOSITORY
SODIUM SULFITE


-IDENTIFIERS
===========

*CATALOG ID NUMBER: 002209

*CAS NUMBER: 7757-83-7

*BASE CHEMICAL NAME: SODIUMSULFITE

*PRIMARY NAME: SODIUM SULFITE

*CHEMICAL FORMULA: Na2SO3

*STRUCTURAL FORMULA: Na2SO3

*WLN: Not available

*SYNONYMS:
ANHYDROUS SODIUM SULFITE
DISODIUM SULFITE
EXSICCATED SODIUM SULFITE
SULFTECH
SODIUM SULFITE ANHYDROUS
SODIUM SULPHITE
SULFUROUS ACID, SODIUM SALT (1:2)


-PHYSICAL CHEMICAL DATA
======================

*PHYSICAL DESCRIPTION: LITERATURE: White crystals or powder
REPOSITORY: Not available

*MOLECULAR WEIGHT: 126.04

*SPECIFIC GRAVITY: 2.633 @ 20/4 C [062,275]

*DENSITY: 2.633 g/mL @ 15.4 C [017,042]

*MP (DEG C): Decomposes [058,205]

*BP (DEG C): Decomposes [017,042,062]

*SOLUBILITIES:
WATER : Soluble in 3.2 parts [031]

DMSO : Not available

95% ETHANOL : Slightly soluble [017]

METHANOL : Not available

ACETONE : Not available

TOLUENE : Not available

OTHER SOLVENTS:
Glycerol: Soluble [031]
Liquid chlorine: Insoluble [017]
Ammonia: Insoluble [017]

*VOLATILITY:
Vapor pressure: Negligible [058]
Vapor density : Not available

*FLAMMABILITY(FLASH POINT):
Literature sources indicate that this compound is noncombustible [058].
Fires involving this material can be controlled with a dry chemical,
carbon dioxide or Halon extinguisher.

*UEL: Not available LEL: Not available

*REACTIVITY:
This compound can react with strong acids [058].

*STABILITY:
This compound is moisture sensitive [275].

*OTHER PHYSICAL DATA:
Saline, sulfurous taste
Odorless
Refractive Index: 1.565
Evaporation rate (n-butyl acetate): Negligible


-TOXICITY
========

*NIOSH REGISTRY NUMBER: WE2150000

*TOXICITY: (abbreviations)
typ. dose mode specie amount units other
LD50 ipr mus 950 mg/kg
LDLo ivn cat 200 mg/kg
LDLo ivn gpg 200 mg/kg
LD50 ivn ham 95 mg/kg
LD50 ivn mus 130 mg/kg
LD50 ivn rat 115 mg/kg
LD50 ivn rbt 65 mg/kg
LD50 orl mus 820 mg/kg
LDLo orl rbt 2825 mg/kg
LDLo scu cat 1300 mg/kg
LDLo scu dog 1300 mg/kg
LDLo scu gpg 600 mg/kg
LDLo scu rbt 300 mg/kg

*AQTX/TLM96: Not available

*SAX TOXICITY EVALUATION:
THR: HIGH via intravenous and subcutaneous routes; MODERATE via subcutaneous,
oral and intravenous routes. MUTATION data.

*CARCINOGENICITY: Not available

*MUTATION DATA:
test lowest dose | test lowest dose
----------- ----------------- | ----------- -----------------
cyt-ctl th 250 mg/L | cyt-dom th 250 mg/L
cyt-mus th 25 mg/L | mmo-oms 600 ppm
spm-ctl th 250 mg/L | spm-dom th 250 mg/L
spm-mus th 25 mg/L | ots-hmn:lym 100 umol/L

*TERATOGENICITY:
Reproductive Effects Data: Not available

*STANDARDS, REGULATIONS & RECOMMENDATIONS:
OSHA: None
ACGIH: None
NIOSH Criteria Document: None
NFPA Hazard Rating: Health (H): None
Flammability (F): None
Reactivity (R): None

*OTHER TOXICITY DATA:
Status: EPA Genetox Program 1986, Positive: S cerevisiae-reversion
EPA TSCA Chemical Inventory, 1986


-OTHER DATA (Regulatory)
=======================

*PROPER SHIPPING NAME (IATA): Not restricted

*UN/ID NUMBER:

*HAZARD CLASS: SUBSIDIARY RISK: PACKING GROUP:

*LABELS REQUIRED:

*PACKAGING: PASSENGER: PKG. INSTR.: MAXIMUM QUANTITY:
CARGO : PKG. INSTR.: MAXIMUM QUANTITY:

*SPECIAL PROVISIONS:

*USES:
Photographic developers, for fixing prints; bleaching wool, straw, silk;
generating SO2; as a reduceer in manufacturing dyes; silvering glass;
removing traces of Cl in bleached textiles and paper; and preserving meat,
egg yolks, etc.

*COMMENTS: Not available


-HANDLING PROCEDURES
===================

*ACUTE/CHRONIC HAZARDS:
When heated to decomposition this compound emits toxic fumes of Na2O and
SOx [042,058]. It may cause irritation [275].

*MINIMUM PROTECTIVE CLOTHING: Not available

*RECOMMENDED GLOVE MATERIALS:
GlovES+ Expert System Glove Types For The Neat (Undiluted) Chemical:
This chemical has not been tested for permeation by Radian Corporation;
however, the GlovES+ expert system was used to extrapolate permeation test
information from compounds in the same chemical class. The GlovES+ system uses
permeation data from literature sources; therefore, extra safety margins should
be used with the estimated protection time(s). If this chemical makes direct
contact with your glove, or if a tear, puncture or hole develops, replace them
at once.
The GlovES+ expert system is a tool that can help people better manage
protection from chemicals, however this tool cannot replace sound judgment nor
make technical decisions. Our GlovES+ expert system is designed to offer
initial advice and assistance in glove selection while the final glove
selection should be made by knowledgeable individuals based on the specific
circumstances involved.

Glove Type Model Number Thickness Estimated Protection Time
Natural rubber Ackwelll 5-109 0.18 mm 240 min.
PVC Edmont 34-100 0.18 mm 480 min.
Nitrile Comasec Comatril 0.55 mm 480 min.

*RECOMMENDED RESPIRATOR:
Where the neat test chemical is weighed and diluted, wear a NIOSH-
approved half face respirator equipped with an organic vapor/acid gas
cartridge (specific for organic vapors, HCl, acid gas and SO2) with a
dust/mist filter.

*OTHER: Not available

*STORAGE PRECAUTIONS:
You should store this material under ambient temperatures.

*SPILLS AND LEAKAGE:
If you spill this chemical, you should dampen the solid spill material
with water,then transfer the dampened material to a suitable container. Use
absorbent paper dampened with water to pick up any remaining material. Seal
your contaminated clothing and the absorbent paper in a vapor-tight plastic
bag for eventual disposal. Wash all contaminated surfaces with a soap
and water solution. Do not reenter the contaminated area until the Safety
Officer (or other responsible person) has verified that the area has been
properly cleaned.

*DISPOSAL AND WASTE TREATMENT: Not available


-EMERGENCY PROCEDURES
====================

*SKIN CONTACT:
IMMEDIATELY flood affected skin with water while removing and isolating
all contaminated clothing. Gently wash all affected skin areas thoroughly
with soap and water.
If symptoms such as redness or irritation develop, IMMEDIATELY call a
physician and be prepared to transport the victim to a hospital for treatment.

*INHALATION:
IMMEDIATELY leave the contaminated area; take deep breaths of fresh air.
If symptoms (such as wheezing, coughing, shortness of breath, or burning in
the mouth, throat, or chest) develop, call a physician and be prepared to
transport the victim to a hospital.
Provide proper respiratory protection to rescuers entering an unknown
atmosphere. Whenever possible, Self-Contained Breathing Apparatus (SCBA)
should be used; if not available, use a level of protection greater than or
equal to that advised under Respirator Recommendation.

*EYE CONTACT:
First check the victim for contact lenses and remove if present. Flush
victim's eyes with water or normal saline solution for 20 to 30 minutes while
simultaneously calling a hospital or poison control center.
Do not put any ointments, oils, or medication in the victim's eyes without
specific instructions from a physician.
IMMEDIATELY transport the victim after flushing eyes to a hospital even if
no symptoms (such as redness or irritation) develop.

*INGESTION:
DO NOT INDUCE VOMITING. If the victim is conscious and not convulsing,
give 1 or 2 glasses of water to dilute the chemical and IMMEDIATELY call a
hospital or poison control center. Be prepared to transport the victim to a
hospital if advised by a physician.
If the victim is convulsing or unconscious, do not give anything by mouth,
ensure that the victim's airway is open and lay the victim on his/her side with
the head lower than the body. DO NOT INDUCE VOMITING. IMMEDIATELY transport
the victim to a hospital.

*SYMPTOMS:
This compound is an irritant [275].


-SOURCES
=======

*SOURCES:
[015] Lewis, R.J., Sr. and R.L. Tatken, Eds. Registry of Toxic Effects
of Chemical Substances. Microfiche Ed. National Institute for
Occupational Safety and Health. Cincinnati, OH. Quarterly
Updates. WE2150000.

[017] Weast, R.C., M.J. Astle, and W.H. Beyer, Eds. CRC Handbook of
Chemistry and Physics. 67th Ed. CRC Press, Inc. Boca Raton,
FL. 1986. p. B-133; #s428.

[031] Windholz, M., Ed. The Merck Index. 10th Ed. Merck and Co.
Rahway, NJ. 1983. p. 1242; #8528.

[042] Sax, N.I. Dangerous Properties of Industrial Materials. 6th Ed.
Van Nostrand Reinhold. New York. 1984. p. 2453.

[058] Information Handling Services. Material Safety Data Sheets
Service. Microfiche Ed. Bimonthly Updates. April/May 1988.
#2606-523, F-02.

[062] Sax, N.I. and R.J. Lewis Sr., Eds. Hawley's Condensed Chemical
Dictionary. 11th Ed. Van Nostrand Reinhold. New York. 1987.
p. 1074.

[082] U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, Office of Toxic Substances.
Toxic Substances Control Act Chemical Substance Inventory: 1985
Edition. 5 Vols. U.S. Environmental Protection Agency.
Washington, D.C. January 1986. Listed.

[099] Grant, W. Morton, M.D. Toxicology of the Eye. 3rd Ed. Charles
C. Thomas, Publisher. Springfield, IL. 1986. p. 864.

[107] Occupational Health Services, Inc. Hazardline. Occupational
Health Services, Inc. New York. Listed.

[110] Oak Ridge National Laboratory. Environmental Mutagen Information
Center (EMIC), Bibliographic Data Base. Oak Ridge National
Laboratory. Oak Ridge, TN. Listed.

[120] Oak Ridge National Laboratory. Environmental Teratogen Information
Center (ETIC), Bibliographic Data Base. Oak Ridge National
Laboratory. Oak Ridge, TN. Listed.

[151] Gosselin, R.E., H.C. Hodge, and R.P. Smith. Clinical Toxicology
of Commercial Products. 5th Ed. Williams and Wilkins, Co.
Baltimore. 1984. p. II-123; #149.

[205] Dean, John A., Ed. Lange's Handbook of Chemistry. 13th Ed.
McGraw-Hill Book Company. New York. 1985. p. 4-113.

[275] Aldrich Chemical Company. Aldrich Catalog/Handbook of Fine
Chemical. Aldrich Chemical Co., Inc. Milwaukee, WI.
1988. p. 1353; #23,932-1.

[301] Dreisbach, R.H. Handbook of Poisoning: Prevention, Diagnosis
and Treatment. 11th Ed. Lange Medical Publications. Los
Altos, CA. 1983. p. 229.

[346] Sittig, M. Handbook of Toxic and Hazardous Chemicals and Carcinogens.
2nd Ed. Noyes, Publications. Park Ridge, NJ. 1985. p. 799.

[610] Clansky, Kenneth B., Ed. Suspect Chemicals Sourcebook: A Guide to
Industrial Chemicals Covered Under Major Federal Regulatory and
Advisory Programs. Roytech Publications, Inc. Burlingame, CA.
1990. Not listed.

[620] United States National Toxicology Program. Chemical Status Report.
NTP Chemtrack System. Research Triangle Park, NC. November 6, 1990.
Not listed.

-------------------------------------------------------------


Return to NTP Home Page
Please send queries, comments, and suggestions to: ntpwm@niehs.nih.gov
Last revised: 13 August 2001
-=-

WOW!!!!! Wash your hands when you're fishing.

Here's my Sodium Sulfite story, I was hunting down on a buddies ranch in Glide (just east of Roseburg) We had shot a couple deer and were having liver and onions for dinner. The guys doing the cooking grab the "salt" shaker and proceed to make dinner. Feeling that it needed more flavor they continued to "salt" the food as it cooked. Well we eat dinner and it is all good, then when we are cleaning up my buddy who lives there asks why they have his sodium sulfite shaker out. Turns out they opened up the cabinet saw a salt shaker and assumed it was salt. Turns out it wasn't. we got a good laugh out of it and I tell you what, that was five guys with the worst gas I have ever been around. At least it was balanced out and not just one of us Didn't make anyone sick other than the smell. we just figured with the preservatives in it and all the beer we drank that weekend we were going to live forever. That was 14 years ago.

My egg cure kills fish. I cure the eggs, the fish bite the eggs, the fish die. Pretty simple

Fishhead5

Copy that one Fishhead5!!!
UEC!!
Keith

Geeez St'man, that's what we always wanted to know about sodium sulfite, but were afraid to ask. I'll be right back - I feel like washing my hands.

BTW, welcome to Piscatorial Kevin (Lund). Good to see ya here. ... FYI, he is an expert egg curer, expert salmon fisherman, but only fair at catching bass (so I've heard).

Steve

[ 12-24-2001: Message edited by: RT ]

What we have learned so far........
Don't handle it
Don't breath it
Don't superheat it
Carcinogen ? debateable
FDA warnings against it on wine and foods...

That funny taste you get when you use it without gloves is because it is absorbed through your skin.Not Good.

Salt,sugar,borax and jello might be better for you and the fish.

Just remember,

Too much oxygen can be fatal to humans.

With oral LD50s (50% lethal likelihood) of about 1 gram per kilogram of host (victim) weight that means that an average 80 kg (176 pound) person could consume up to 80 grams (about a tenth of a pound) probably without dying. That is not much more toxic than ordinary table salt. Pretty safe stuff.

WOW! Holiday Inn Express must have been awful busy lately!