I'm a vet. Don't jump to a decision while you're red hot with emotion. One reason you shouldn't shoot your dog is because it is illegal. Any animal that bites someone legally becomes a rabies suspect and should not be killed so that the animal can be monitored for a period of time for progressing signs of rabies. Rabies is not common in the NW, but the law is the law. Variations in how to deal with observation/quarantine exist state to state and since I'm in Oregon, I will defer you to your vet. Besides, a bullet to the head is how we delt with these problems 30 years ago. I do think that euthanasia is appropriate in some of these instances, esp. when children are involved.

Wild Crome is right!

Remember one thing, you picked the dog, and the breed, he didn't pick you! There are lots of people out there who want and desire the trends that your dog has now shown! They are a breed that has been known to kill, harm, and mangle mankind many times before, so why did you bring him home?
Why did you pick him, his breed? They are not known for their loving, kind, attentive needs to children.

The dog has now developed it's bread problems. That's a no-brainer for this breed of dog! So punish the dog if that makes you feel better, or spend the money and have it put down in a humane way.

Cowlitzfisherman

Sorry for the bad news.....but, you are right the pooch needs to go! I know thats a hard thing to deal with , but life happens! I had a 6 yr old bird dog that I witnessed bite the neighbor kid for no apparent reason. It was very hard, but I took him for his last ride and paid the hospital bill. Do what it takes buddy but find a better family dog....Good luck to you!

Phish,
This thread is chock full of opinions on whether you should kill your dog or give it away or lock it in the laundry room or whatever. Only you can decide what you are going to do with the dog and I will not presume to give you advice on this matter. If however you do decide to do the deed yourself, please do not shoot him in the face. Feel with your fingers for the point at the base of the skull where the spinal collumn enters the cranium. Place the muzzle of a small calliber gun in contact with this point and squeeze the trigger. The dog will never know what happened and the mess will be very minimal.I speak from experience on this. I have had the unpleasant responsibility of putting down a number of dogs over the years.
Hope this helps and also hope the boy feels better soon.
Grumpyr

What's wrong with shooting the dog "between the eyes"?

Matt

Hey matt, would you want to look at your family dog after you blew its head off? that horrid image would stay in you mind forever.
tyler

Between the eyes is messy. Grumpyr is correct. The base of the skull. This is the best spot to do it with very little mess and no gunshot noise. Me and my partner found this out on our last meeting with Jimmy Hoffa. Right behind and under the ear.

[ 01-09-2002: Message edited by: G-MAN ]

To all you He man CNR fanatics. Its truly pathetic to me to see the numerous just shoot the fuc--- dog posts. You guys will sit here and whine all day, and threaten human life if a person bonks a wild steelie, legal or not. You sit back and do the trailer trash talk, the hillbily crap, and all of you guys start ranting about baseball bats, and 22 slugs. Your talking about what you yourself at one time surly said was your best friend or fishing buddy, this pussy who makes a decision to leave a five year old rott with obviously not suffeciant supervision that put his son in harms way and your response is kill the dog. To the contrary i think the owner is the one due a bat to the head. How dare you jump on this board and attempt to gain sympathy for your son when you and your wife are the responsable parties, I would like to hear all you tough guys when your dog of five years who has been your partner is playing with the neighbors kid and since we have not really heard why the dog actualy snapped i asume its because they dont know because they werent there. however if your neighbors kid yanked on your dogs tail or some other threat to your dog and your dog takes a chomp on the kid, how many of you he men are going to allow your neighbor or anyone for that matter kill your dog in any manner ecspecaially a 22 shot or a bat. You guys would bawling like kids at school. What age bracket do you suppose its only worth a kick to the head for a snap to that kid? What if it was an adult is my eye not as important as your kids? What happens if its not a rott but a poodle or beagle, you gonna bash the head in of your wifes 5 year old poodle because it snapped at the kid. You know if this wasnt your kid but the kid was mine I would sue you and you would be facing criminal negligence or child endangerment. You hear what i am saying you are the most to blame for this accident.How much information did you research prior to the childs first arrival in your home. I just spent about ten minuteds on the web and found numerous helpful tips about the breed you have. How much time was spent coming up witha plan to assure your childs safety when only one parent was home to supervise .I know you read up about the potential for this same exact thing to happen. did you allow for an emergency plan in case of a emergency you were slack in supervision of your son around a potential danger, Do you let your kid out on the street without you. how about by the pool with no supervision . You have the means to rectify this situation without having to kill anything. properly supervise your son when around the dog and go back to being a good pet owner like you were last week im sure you love the dog and the dog and your son will most likely withnd on the carpets when hes a bit bigger.I notice you have not responded to my offer of taking the dog and placing it in a good home so i asssume again its the heman wanna kill thing by the way how many cars do you have in he yard next the plastic pool, and auto parts, lying in the

Fishjunkie-
Have another!! And go hug another tree! Likely, you're a California native that wants all killing to quit, ya know, all hunting!!
Just guessing,
Keith

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: stlhdr1 ]

I don't generally post here too often, but this topic has drawn my attention. First off, I sincerely hope your son recovers fully and quickly and isn't left with a lifelong hatred or fear of dogs because they truly can be "man's best friend." However, I also can't help but to agree with at least some of what 'fishnjunkie' is trying to say. Granted, the guy has a hard time writing and spelling, but the point he is try to make is very valid. A Rott is NOT bred to be a family dog. True, many people have these dogs and they end up making great pets. However, dog breeds have inherited characteristics that don't just go away. Raise a lab as a family dog and take it hunting later, and the instinct will be there to chase and retrieve birds. Bring a Rott into a home and raise it as a family dog and the instinct to attack and bring harm will still be there. You house is full of dangers for small children and generally you take precautions to keep them away from your child. I assume you don't leave poisonous cleaning agents on the floor for him to get into. However, if you leave the child alone with a Rott, to poke at him, pull his legs, and bite his ears, the dog's natural instincts may very well come out. Is this the dog's fault? In my opinion, NO. If you had a truer family dog, maybe so. But with a Rott, I think you are inviting trouble unless you never take your eyes off the two of them. It's becoming easier and easier for people to never accept responsibility for anything, and this very well may be another example. Please seriously consider finding a good home for the dog before he gets the slug.

BEFORE you think about giving the dog away, let me tell you what happened up here in Lynden this summer on Father's day. This family responed to an ad for a free Rott. They wanted the dog even after they were told the dog was being given away because he bit. {according to the Humane Society,
Rotts bite less people than your common household pooch} they took it anyway. Next day he bit a kid in the face. The child was flown down to Harborview Medical Center where he underwent facial reconstruction for about three weeks. The State got involved and sued the family for taking in an aggressive animal. It's not nessarily the breed that's the problem. I had four Dobies and they never bit anyone. My friend has two Rotts and their little girl rides them like a horses. They have never snapped at her. They are "Best Friends". Sometimes dogs, all breeds, get mean and you can't do anything about it. It's sad because everyone loses. The owner loses a friend, not to mention all the time and investment involved, and the dog loses it's life. If it lives, chances are pretty good it'll happen again.

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: G-MAN ]

Black Dog

I couldn't agree with you more!

Just like i said early; "you picked the dog, and the breed, he didn't pick you! There are lots of people out there who want and desire the trends that your dog has now shown! They are a breed that has been known to kill, harm, and mangle mankind many times before, so why did you bring him home?

Why did you pick him, his breed? They are not known for their loving, kind, attentive needs to children."

Cowlitzfisherman

is the taste of the bait worth the sting of the hook????

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: cowlitzfisherman ]

FISHnJUNKIE, BEFORE You Prejudge,(all of us "Hillbilly, Poor White Trailer Trash) openly slam and belittle someone on this forum, PLEASE, write your response, if your upset take a minute and think, do I really want to say this just because I'm PISSED OFF and crush this guy (who feels like crap anyway) and who has taken his time to ask us for advice??? Don't prejudge until you have all the facts, ask. I don't prejudge you. I won't assume your IQ is below 40 because of your terrible spelling, ect.(You were probably too mad to spell check) I don't think you're a "LOW LIFE SKUMBAGG" just because you list your interests as, Fishing PORNO Fishing PORNO. I'll assume you listed "PORNO" as a joke before I refuse to develope a friendship with you because I don't want a "Child Molester" around my little kids. This is a Great place to get info, learn some new tips and make some friends. It is also very easy to make alot of enemies here. PhishPreak has an E-Mail if you want to send him anything, like maybe? an apology for sending a heated reply before cooling down? We all do it once in awhile. We type and send before we think. One of our many faults being "Human".

[ 01-10-2002: Message edited by: G-MAN ]

According to a study done between 1979 and 1998 by the CDC, Rottweilers ranked #2 behind pit-bulls on the list of fatalities from dog bites by purebred dogs in the US; however, from 1991-1998 Rotties accounted for MORE fatalities (33 to 21) nationwide.

And, of course, children account for the overwhelming majority of these fatalities.

Dave you are right, "Fatalities by Pure Breds" But the number one at the top of "Biters" is your family Mutt type, Benji. The CDC is that the "Center for Diease Control"?

I am sorry to hear about your child.

Sinker said a .22 caliber is plenty. I will confirm his statement as we've slaughtered cattle on our farm for years. The rottweiler has a very hard front skull plate and the bullet will get in there and rattle around a bit, and turn the brain into jelly. Or you can place the barrel inside his ear and bang.

Personally I would have found the nearest jug of gas and book of matches.

Also, see if anyone around you is Cambodian. I guarantee you they would take it off of your hands.

Status update:



My son is doing a lot better. He shows no signs of being afraid of dogs. We let him pet our yellow lab and he was very excited. He also wanted to pet the rottie, but I wouldn’t let him because I don’t want him getting anymore attached to him (not because I’m afraid of him attacking).



My wife and I have decided to try to find a home for him. This will be very tough because we want to do it fast, and we have to find the RIGHT home for him – not just some ‘joe’ off the street. For example – no young kids or plans to have any, experience with rotties (owning, training, ect), fenced yard, full understanding that this dog has bitten once already, ect…



We’ve contacted shelters and pure-bred rescue agencies, and they won’t touch a dog that has in anyway bitten someone.



We have a few leads that we are following up with, including a few guys on this board. If the leads don’t pan out then we may be forced to put him down.



Grumpyr, if it comes to it, I agree with your approach, that is what I did with my wife’s old german shepherd that could no longer walk and was in a lot of pain (I discussed this in a post above). I know many of you feel I have waited too long already, but I’m not going to make this call until I’ve thoroughly explored alternatives.



As for the idea of re-training and seeking professional dog behaviorist, the time to do that is past in this case. While I agree that it is possible for life to go somewhat back to normal (including the dog), if we ever allowed this to happen again, especially by the same dog (who was supposed to have been re-trained), then I would have to agree with some of the others here and say that my wife and I would deserve to be taken out and shot….



Oh, and Sam is up-to-date on his rabies shot. So I’m not concerned about any medical or legal issues with taking the bullet solution. As long as it’s done right, dead is dead – one way is just harder for some to handle now days.



As for any finger pointing, well you are right. My wife and I are to blame and take full responsibility as to what happened. It was a 30 second mistake that turned out to be very costly.



We have a rule that no child plays with Sam without strict supervision. My number 1 concern is that the dog will simply knock the kid down and cause an injury that way. And we do play together as a family almost daily. And I purposely pull his ears (he has no tail) and other things a child may try to do. In our nearly 5 years, he’s been nothing but a happy, oversized lap dog.

In this instance, the dog was allowed in the house and put in his bed where he knows he’s supposed to stay (and always has. We also have baby gates separating his room from the areas the kids play). My wife was upstairs feeding our 4mo old and my 2yr old was in the next room playing loudly. She forgot to close the gate, and the dog decided to come see what all the noise was about. My wife heard him come up the stairs, but she did not immediately react. 30 seconds later she heard a brief snarl. She ran in saw Aidan bleeding and the dog hiding low in the closet – knowing he’d just screwed up. Later our son was able to tell us that he had tried to give the dog a hug around the neck. My wife will always bear the guilt of knowing she could have avoided this.



Any breed of dog would more than likely have responded the same way. Sam is just bigger and stronger than most. He is also used to our 1yr old lab harassing him, and he often lays into him to get him off his back. Of course the lab is quick and has thick fur, so he has never even had a scratch as a result. I think Sam expected this same thing from Aidan, not realizing that a 2yr old’s skin is like butter.



As for you who want to understand why I owned a rottie to begin with, well I grew up with rotties. My mother was a rottie breeder and never had any temperament issues with her dogs. I chose a rottie for my family because I know a lot about the breed and loved my mom’s dogs. My wife is a runner (I’m not so much…) and when I couldn’t be with her, I felt safer with her running with a big scary looking dog to deter flakes – even if we realized he’d probably lick a stranger to death. I have stacks of books on rotties, I did tons of online research, my wife has extensive experience training German shepherds, and we spent several months looking for just the right puppy from the right breeder. Sam had such a good temperament, that many wanted us to consider breeding him. We did the responsible thing and had him fixed. We also considered taking him to training to become a volunteer in hospitals and nursing homes. I am not another white trash jerk looking for a junkyard watchdog and overall ego booster.

Rotties are one of the highest registered dogs in the country. Unfortunately, many people are breeding them for a quick buck and don’t care who buys them. There are many idiots out there who get these dogs for all the wrong reasons, abuse them, don’t bother training them, tie them up in the back yard, and are surprised when the dog finally gets loose and does some damage. Of all the dog attacks and bites from various breeds that occur, the rottie makes the news because he is scary, big, and powerful. Had my rottie been from a junkyard line, and not been trained, and had been neglected, and he had actually been trying to attack my son (and not just the quick snap that he did), the results would clearly be worse. And my wife and I should be tossed in jail. As it is, we are very responsible, knowledgeable dog owners and parents who made a mistake and are now paying the price. Just like if I took my eyes off the road for a second and caused a terrible accident – it could happen to anyone on any given day.



Also, if my lab or my rottie ever attacked a neighbor kid, provoked or not, I wouldn’t wait for my neighbor to shoot him, I would take care of it myself. I am responsible for my dog’s actions and am also responsible for keeping him from being harassed (thus, being put in a position to want to defend himself). I would then expect my neighbor to want to kick my a$$ at first, and maybe even try to sue me.



I’ve also heard a few of you mention that sometimes you think it would be better to kick your dog, or otherwise take physical action to put him in his place. This is not a good idea and any experienced dog handler would agree. Establishing dominance, when done properly, is good. Making your dog scared of you, can turn him into a fear biter – or at least a carpet pi$$er. Either way it’s not good. Rotties don’t take well to physical abuse/correction especially.



Anyway, I’d like to wrap this post up as I don’t want to see this turned into any more mud slinging.



Rest assured that I will handle this in a thoughtful, responsible manner, and do what’s best for my family, the dog, and the general community. I really appreciate all your advice and opinions.



The rivers are dopping – let’s get back to fishing!!!!!!!!!!!! (:



-Chad

If someones kid bites someone elses should we kill the child? If a child stabbs another should we kill the child? In my opion yes, but we don't we try rehab first. Same respect should be given to a pet.

Dont shute youre dog its not humain!!!!!! have it put to sleep you are going to have to live with youre self and if the shot isnt just right it will suffer.this comes from experience.you still care about this pet regardless what it did and it will probably do it again .I feel bad for you!! what a cruddy spot to be in.t

I wouldn't let the perfect 20/20 hindsight bother you too much,Phish.There are a lot of other folks that own different breeds that find themselves in your position.You obviously didn't see this coming.

You make a good point about the dog not understanding its limits with the kid.It still presents a danger though.

For what it's worth,I would follow the same course of action that you have chosen.I would use a different method,if I had to put the dog down,but otherwise I agree with your decision.

Good luck in finding the dog a proper home!