This is definitely one of the more personally difficult posts I've put up for everyone to read but writing about it helps me work it all out...

Every year at the end of October beginning of November when the conditions are just right I guarantee you can find me in one hole on the Sol Duc. You might have heard me mention it once or twice out of context in some of my other posts, the location isn't really that important here. I have had epic days in this hole and caught some absolutely spectacular fish, ones I will never forget. I've released far more fish than I've kept but given the right conditions I kill two fish every time...

...this last week I hit it just right and had another outstanding day. I bonked my largest coho ever, released a fish that was nearly as large, caught and released a 30# chrome bright king, released two other coho and bonked a hen full of eggs. Thing about it is I was sitting down to eat some of the buck for dinner tonight and I couldn't eat the fish. My girlfriend said it was the best fish she ever tasted...period. I had a couple of bites and it was pretty damn tasty but I'd been having second thoughts since just a little after it was too late to have them and I just couldn't do it.

The argument I had always used was that wild salmon were much more plentiful than wild steelhead and the sustainability of the population was a lot higher...the rate I've caught fish in there sometimes bears that line of reasoning out. But...

After so doggedly pursuing catching a Springer in the Hoh and finally getting one last year, killing it of course, through several conversations I've had with several members of this board I decided I wouldn't ever kill another intentionally...

...and after tonight I know I'm done whacking native salmon on the Sol Duc.

For the record anyone who truly knows me knows I probably don't fit the stereotype of the typical 'fancy wadered, bug tossin, meeting going C & R fanatic' or whatever...I suppose some of you will think I'm headed in that direction but trust me, I can't afford the gear...

So go ahead and think me soft or whatever for being more interested in fishing than in eating fish, I'm not going to force my ethical persuasions on other people but I will, if someone asks me 'why I released that fish?' take the opportunity to share exactly why...

...and to anyone that fishes the OP fisheries willing to listen I'll gladly share at length with them the reasons why I've come to these decisions and strongly encourage them to consider doing the same. I mean really consider it. Maybe even for years...

no need to apologize

makes sense

Kind of a weird feeling isn't it? I had the same experience about 6 or 7 years ago with the last deer that I bagged, haven't shot one since. Don't get me wrong, I have no problems with others, family included, taking game.....It was just something "I" had to do!
Still have my rifles, and shotgun, but they have not been used for sometime, now my fishing rods....thats another story, and even though I won't take home a native steelhead, I have not yet reached that point yet with a salmon, unless I absolutely know it is from a troubled run on "said" river. I do know when I intercept some wild Kings in the ocean, that I cannot tell what run they are from and know how that could be interpreted, but at least I am trying, and maybe in a few years even that salmon will be set free!

Ng

Its a far cry from 'Bambi syndrome'...its not like I think they are cute or anything...

...nor can I bring a whole bunch of facts, figures or data analysis to the table supporting my decision...

It stems more from concern over the long term health of the fishery, not like the actions of a two to five fish per year angler will make the difference...

...unless other people that have had similar thoughts about the ultimate lack of distinction between a wild steelhead and a wild salmon. I seriously hope those that have no qualms about releasing native steelhead will lose whatever qualms remain about releasing wild salmon...

I have a feeling I'll be writing a bigger piece on this subject shortly examining the factors that have led me to this place...

I think it's called resource stewardship. We could give up fishing entirely, and that might be good for the fish. But it wouldn't be good for many of us.

I don't need to bring fish home often, but I need to fish. Fishing is one of my direct connections with the world in a very organic sense. We were hunter-gatherers long before we became cultivators. I've been told that because I'm more highly evolved than a cave man, hunting and fishing shouldn't be necessary to my existance. Maybe, but hear me out.

Some of us are more primitive than others, in terms of retaining a compelling need to connect directly with our environment. For some lycra and gore-tex clad northwesterners, viewing Mt. Rainier from downtown Seattle gets it done. Some of us need it differently. I need to bushwhack favored haunts on favorite rivers and stride off-trail ridges in the mountains to maintain an important connection with the earth. I need to sleep under the stars of the autumn sky, breath the air filled with the scent of the woods, feel the push of the current against my waders, feel the heat from a fishing camp fire, get dirt under my fingernails, and occasionally get blood on my hands. For the past 20 years or so, that blood has usually been from hatchery fish. It's OK. It satisfies a connection that is vital to how I experience life.

Killing wild fish might be a purer connection to what seems important. But if killing wild fish is detrimental to our interests, that is, wild fish populations are declining or cannot sustain the harvest pressures of the oh-so-too-many of us, then our interests end up being better satisfied if we can exercise our connections by taking fish that are actually surplus production. In most cases, that is hatchery steelhead and salmon.

Perhaps some of this is what is going on for you, too.

Sincerely,

Salmo g.

Hey Salmo, Can you please send me a signed copy of that book

This seems to hit most of us at some point in our fishing career. On our side of the mtns we can only keep hatchery fish so to hear of someone killing a wild salmon/steelhead sounds crazy!!

RM

it seems that some anglers are bent on bringing home fish regardless as to whether they need it or not. I landed a chrome bright silver on the Satsop two weeks ago. I saw that it was a native and prepared to release it when a guy approached me with a bonking stick saying he wanted the fish. I told him I just don't bonk native fish unless mortally wounded. He cursed me when I sent the fish on its way and then told me his freezer was full anyways. The purpose of fishing to me was always sport first and a nice dinner if it works out that way. I catch more than my share of fish and don't feel the need to bonk every fish I land. My .02 worth.

~steelymann~

tight lines

I catch and eat a lot of fish, I like fish, my family likes fish, and I like to catch fish. I like to bring some home too, just feels good to process it all and put it away. I hunt also, I even catch and process all my herring. We pretty much only eat meat that I shot, caught, or raised on the farm - my wife and I were raised that way and that's what we do.

Now the good thing about all this is that I can also be very selective about what I keep, and if I don't want to mess with it I can release everything. Hell, that's what I've been doing since September anyway - my freezer is too full.

Now I did keep a few Chehalis silvers that I know were wild fish - but this year the Chehalis has a healthy wild run so I don't feel bad about it. I would feel bad about keeping wild fish on a river where the runs were questionable, and I never keep wild steelhead, period - In my opinion there is no wild run of steelhead that can take any exploitation beyond the stress caused by catch and release, plus there is the likelihood that if you release that fish you will catch it again (I caught the same 12 pound hen 3 times in one day on the Queets once), and the possibility that it will return to spawn again and again (I believe the record is 7 times for a fish from the Toutle).

The fact that salmon always die after spawning, and that they really only agressively bite until they are done feeding, are good reasons not to feel too bad about keeping one on a river where they are not in trouble. Steelhead, on the other hand, return way more to everyone when left in the river - they bite aggressively and repeatedly even after they have spawned. For the sake of continued good fishing in your favorite river, release the nates carefully and always.

I've had long conversations with friends about this very subject. I think it is admirable to make a reasoned decision. I've made a different decision in that I will keep hatchery fish if I'm catching them, but if I'm in a river with a healthy population of silvers (I too fish the Sol Duc frequently), I do not feel any guilt about taking home a native fish once in awhile. I still release 3 or 4 for each one I keep, but I keep some. Why?

Instead of eating that salmon, what are you going to have for dinner? Salmon caught somewhere else by someone else? Who caught it? Were the runs healthy? How do you know?

And when is the last time you bought a fresh fish from the store?

So, you say, just don't eat salmon. So you eat beef or chicken. Well, there is some pretty intense impact from factory farms. In the end, maybe the best thing you can do is responsibly catch fish, target hatchery fish, and if you get native fish from healthy runs, don't outright dismiss keeping a fish now and again.

I think that decision is very hard that you've made. Everything you do has an impact and just remember that the fish you eat for dinner comes from some stock somewhere. I say it's better to know where your food comes from as much as possible, and be as responsible as is possible (which it sounds like you are).

Stldl20,
I believe you are at a point in your life where you don't really need to kill them to prove your a good fisherman. I'd say your a better sportsman for not killing them!
That's just being responsible of your resources.

I kept "1" Silver this year. My freezer is full of Sockeye, so why kill every fish, to prove what? And to who?
I know, I'll probably burn in hell for admitting this but, I've even released Hatchery fish!!!!!

Besides, I'm getting tired of cleaning those "Slimmy Things" anywhy

drama???

Hey, Sea Claire, welcome aboard, I think it's pretty cool that this thoughtful discussion got you to sign up and post

My friend lTlcleo maybe see's the issue as being a little deeper than what all of you are discussing....NutnButLips if you have paid attention to his posts over the time he's been here you'd see that. On one hand you(no one intended) gather around the flag of cnr and wild fish while on the other hand we condone continued fishing of any kind(cnr of wild/bonking of brats) due to small hatchery plants on a lot of rivers and streams. The wild runs on these streams continue to decline even though there is no commercial fishing or legal taking of wild fish. Eliminate those two "boogey men" from the equation and we'll have robust wild runs? Maybe or maybe not. Both of us have vast knowledge and experience of some watersheds where there has been no commercial fishing on wild fish or lawful take of wild fish by recreational fishers for some 10 years. The results....wild fish are still declining. The issue is much larger and deeper than ideology or ethics and I've finally come to understand that due to my good friend. It's a simple reality that the wild runs are dying irregardless of what banner we choose to wrap ourselves in. Thanks lTlcleo. Yah Mon=====Drama! Go ahead and burn me at the stake.

Stlhdh20,

I commend you on your decision! I released many legal silvers last year at Sekiu, letting many go so that I could enjoy the day. I let a number of hatchery and wild silvers go in September, after you could retain the wild fish.

I will still bonk legal fish, even nate salmon depending upon the stream, but the nate steelhead will swim to see another day. Someday maybe I will get to that point.

To answer someone elses question, "When was the last time I bought salmon in a store?"

1992.

Hey cleo -

I would say more like 'absence of drama'.

The fact that I've been considering this for awhile actually made the decision rather anti-dramatic if there is such a thing.

Gooose -

Congratulations...you've managed type another entire paragraph without saying anything.

ltlcleo and gooose please leave your "views" of stlhdh2o at that other place and stlhdh2o please ignore their darts.

Is there such a watershed?

I thinks so, but it's a few thousand miles west of here, and it has a funny sounding russian name.

I had thought about it for a while and decided to make the same choice a while back.

I do think that it probally dosent hurt in some places. But I made this decision for a few reasons.

1. I preach wild steelhead release so I felt a little like a hypocrit for killing wild salmon.

2. Im not poor, Im not starving and there are plenty of hatchery fish out there to satisfy my needs. I just dont have a reason good enough to kill a wild salmon.

3. And agian I kept asking myself why and I just could'nt answer it.

So I decided to error on the safe side and not kill anymore wild salmon.

For those of you that do well thats your choice and I dont think the majority of fishers are ready to release wild salmon. Shoot most wont even release wild steelhead.

Can you post exact directions to this hole? How about a Lat and Long for the GPS? I swear I won't tell a soul !!!

Downriggin'

I think I wasn't as clear in my previous post as I wanted to be. Killing a wild salmon is neither intrinsically good nor bad. There are wild salmon runs that are very healthy. For example, Alaska has many, Fraser R. sockeye, even Skagit pink and chum runs. There are surplus wild coho salmon in many WA rivers at least in some years, although not all. An angler's decision not to kill any wild salmon is a personal one. It may be related to the perceived abundance of wild salmon, or it may be related to something else. It's OK either way. It probably more important to understand the why of the decision than its specific ramifications, but that remains personal to the individual.

My earlier post had more to do with fishing v. not fishing and killing hatchery fish v. wild fish, which isn't exactly the same thing. Jerry G., thanks for the kind words, but there is no book. Those thoughts came from thinking about why I fish, and particularly why I fish, why I keep hatchery fish and release wild fish, and why I participate in CNR fisheries. I've been challenged by some critics to defend catching and releasing fish (obviously I like to torture animals), since it must be worse than just catching and killing the poor things. Nobody lives on this planet without impacting something, and if we're Americans, it usally means impacting the planet a lot. An earlier post described foregoing the eating of salmon as resulting in eating something else, like beef, leading to the question of where it came from and what were the impacts of its production and distribution.

Maybe it's just a feel-good exercise, but I like trying to understand how living my life affects the world around me, and how the world around me affects me. So I think I'm pretty clear about why I fish, and I offer no apologies. That's pretty good when I run into a PETA type. And it's even better to live deliberately and as lightly on the planet as I choose.

This thread has elicited a lot of thoughtful responses. Thanks to all.

Sincerely,

Salmo g.

I think that gooose did a very good job on summing up a lot of others member's thoughts on this subject! Yes, there are many true believers such as salmo, but not all believe the way that he does. That does not make him wrong, nor does it make him incorrect in his beliefs! (I think that I may have political blood in my veins now!).

CnR is almost like a religion to some members. But like all religions, many people have many different view points about it.

ltlCLEO; "Drama" was a very appropriate term to use. I for one am the kind of fishermen that can respectfully disagree with others also. I hear a lot of different opinions on this subject, and still believe that under the "right" circumstances wild fish can be harvested. After all, what biological facts support the theory that "wild" fish actually originated in the same stream that they currently strive in? That should get some of you jumping!!!

Thanks again Salmo g for being so open on this subject, and your open true opinion…I think that there is still hope!!!


Cowlitzfisherman

Is the taste of the bait worth the sting of the hook????

Jerry Garcia my personal opinions on any single person were never intended in my post nor were they implied in anyway. I gave my opinion on the subject as a whole and nothing else. If you feel otherwise then my apologies are offered for my somehow being confused about the distinction between an opinion on a subject under discussion and directing a personal barb at an individual.

As to the matter of the watersheds I referred too. There has not been a "in the river" commercial fishery on several Hood Canal rivers since around 1984. Netting in the Canal proper near the mouths of these rivers has not occured for at least a decade. There has not been a sport take fishery on chinook and coho on these rivers for at least a decade. There has been wild steelhead release reg's in place for going on a decade. But the runs of these three wild salmonids continue to be depressed or declining on these rivers irregardless of choice of ethics.

And that was the point I was trying to make in my reference to the discussion. Sorry for the confusion.

Hi Gooose, I knew right off whereof you spoke, as I have fished those streams at least once a year just for the hell of it since they declined in the late 80's, and a whole lot more before then. These little streams are horribly vulnerable to overfishing, and remain so today, but not necessarily to the fishing we all think of. Here are a couple fisheries that are still going on relatively unchecked:

1. Tribal, and even at times non-tribal, netting of chum and even other "hatchery" salmon. The early run steelhead that used to populate these rivers are in the saltchuck about the same time that many of these fisheries are going on, and very likely get intercepted "incedentally". Even if released from a beach seine or a gillnet they are dead.

2. Kids and even adults out on a summer vacation throwing a barbed hook and salmon egg in the accesible areas, especially on federal land, and "releasing trout" (ie, next years smolts), all of which have swallowed the hook and are dead on release. This is common everywhere in spite of selective fishing regulations - the ignorant crackers just don't know or care.

Add these problems to the fact that wild fish were decimated, mostly by tribal commercial fishing after the Boldt decision, but also by sportfishermen who couldn't see releasing that fish into a gillnet, by interbreeding and competition with hatchery fish, resulting in the nearly total loss of unique genetic material that allowed these fish to live in these unusually high gradient limited rearing area streams, and by the loss of pretty much all salmonids other than lower river chum and the nutrients they used to provided to the upriver rearing areas that steelhead smolts preferred, and you have a river in which the fish will never recover.

My solution - stop all commercial fishing (yeah, that means the tribes) except in the Hoodsport Hatchery zone and around the Skok. The Skoks could do this but it's kind of hard on the Port Gambles - how about they share areas with the Skoks? And stop all river fishing except for chum in the fall and total C&R of all steelhead in the winter - and maybe stop that too for awhile, although if the river was open on a permit basis, with a requirement of the permit being that all steelhead caught and released be reported, that would provide data for WDFW to track recovery. There are a very few wild fish still around, I actually released one last year, a hen that was all of 3.6 pounds - pretty, heavily spotted little thing. A few of these should be put into a broodstock program to see if these can be encouraged along. For sure stop dumping Chambers Creek stock in there - they return nothing to the fishery.

There is no reason these rivers, 98% of which are in federal lands with pristine watersheds, excellent riparian habitat except for the lower mile, with the estuaries relatively intact and mostly in state ownership, should not be producing tons of fish. Get the right fish in there and leave them alone.

H20, this reminds me of a saying of Henry David Thoreau he said "Fishermen evolve into conservationist"

Spawnout very nice reply and I agree on nearly all points you made as I have already made the very same ones on this board several times.

The one area that we may disagree on is the location of tribal netting.....except for the Port Gamble fishery at the mouth of the canal all of the remaining tribal netting has been primarily located well to the south of the rivers we both are referring to....and have been so for around 7 years.

As to the topic of this thread I stand by my comments directed at the general subject being discussed. I have a larger question of my own to resolve regarding those rivers and you referred to it already Spawnout. Sadly my decision one way or the other won't likely change the course of history for them. Thanks and let me know when you might be visiting this way.

Peace