#175689 - 05/21/06 11:12 PM
Re: not good
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 1765
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It must be lonely walking around with ALL the answers in times like these...
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#175691 - 05/22/06 12:13 AM
Re: not good
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Spawner
Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 954
Loc: Spokane, Wa.
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Gotta agree with the last sentence Aunty M. It will be interesting to find out what happened. It's already tragic, and a budding atrocity if the doubts are not cleared up and aired.
I see I need to clarify: I was referring to your 4:21 PM post Aunty M.
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#175692 - 05/22/06 12:25 AM
Re: not good
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River Nutrients
Registered: 03/27/02
Posts: 3188
Loc: U.S. Army
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Eliminate the threat immediatly by the fastest and most reliable means, without a seconds hesitation. Yes, that's what Salmo asked. How do you intend to eliminate the threat when there are Americans used as human shields? I'll give you a hint; your first inclination will put you in jail.
_________________________
Tent makers for Christie, 2016.
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#175693 - 05/22/06 12:43 AM
Re: not good
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 1765
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Take one of my kids hostage and start shooting at the other and I'd order you a MOAB ASAP........
It's called cutting your losses and it has been proven to win wars, but I guess these days it's not the winning, it's the effort we are supposed to embrace ?
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#175694 - 05/22/06 12:45 AM
Re: not good
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 1765
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And then you ask how could Kerry have done worse............
Wasn't his big plan for the sand box to fly over there and give a personal apology ? What kind of academy do they teach that in ?
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#175695 - 05/22/06 01:33 AM
Re: not good
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River Nutrients
Registered: 03/07/06
Posts: 2527
Loc: WA
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Sure it's understandable that it wasn't right that a few Marines killed a few civilians, but it might have been good. The people that are killing our troops are roadside bombers and suicide bombers so some of those "innocent civilians" might have been the Iraqi's that are placing bombs for our American troops to walk over and detonate them or strap on explosives and kill even more people when they blow themselves up . I mean its not like these Iraqi's are wearing uniforms while they are placing bombs for american convoys to run over, they are just plain looking civilians and if you consider what America has done to "innocent civilians" look no further then the two atomic bombs we placed in Japan in WWII....
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#175697 - 05/22/06 09:36 AM
Re: not good
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Returning Adult
Registered: 05/02/04
Posts: 384
Loc: Portland
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They were just Iraqi's Aunty, quit being so sensitive...
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#175699 - 05/22/06 09:12 PM
Re: not good
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 1765
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Locals DO matter, the locals are the whole point of even being there(wherever there is...)
Since there are women in my family, then I guess I am an expert on menstral cramps and childbirth...
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#175701 - 05/22/06 10:55 PM
Re: not good
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 1765
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SO if the bad guys in Iraq have 50 hostages, and you still have 16 good men under fire, are you saying you just lay there and get picked off until you are all either dead or captured ?
You do remember that being captured means a certain death, and most likely beheaded and drug through the streets and then burned........you are not dealing with a State, let alone a State which plays by the rules......
IF taking hostages and making a scene meant 100% certain and immediate death, I think that tactic would largely be a thing of the past.....
We HAD a policy against negotiating with terrorists, what ever happened to that ?
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#175702 - 05/22/06 11:01 PM
Re: not good
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 1765
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Locals always did matter, but not more than our boys......
Maybe you guys think we should be using paintball guns and tazers ?
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#175704 - 05/23/06 12:43 AM
Re: not good
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 09/07/05
Posts: 1832
Loc: Kitsap Peninsula
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"Do you understand how scared the Founding Father's must have been while standing up for you and me"
What you are confused about is that our founding fathers had experienced freedom, to a point, had land and other property and, as such, had something tangible to lose. Of course they stood up -they knew the altenative.
The locals in Irag have never experienced the type of freedom we have, are limited in education, don't know who to trust and the only thing they have left to lose is their family and thier own lives.
I asked you this question before -
"You say you have a wife and children. Would you be willing to put them at risk by talking to US troops?"
Put yourself in their shoes - what would you do in their place -Talk to the US troops or mind your own business?
_________________________
"I didn't care what she didn't 'low--I would boogie-woogie anyhow" John Lee Hooker
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#175705 - 05/23/06 07:00 AM
Re: not good
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 03/17/05
Posts: 1765
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I would like to think I would be of the "Give me liberty or death" crowd, but maybe I would be a coward..........
I've not be in a revolution yet.
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#175706 - 05/23/06 02:26 PM
Re: not good
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Three Time Spawner
Registered: 09/07/05
Posts: 1832
Loc: Kitsap Peninsula
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It's not a question of being a coward if you have no idea what freedom is.
While I know you may be insulted by this, in my opinion based on your posts, you have not had much life experience outside of your comfortable world. I'd be surprised if you've been out of the country to a real third world country and see the conditions other people live under. Freedom is not even a conceivable concept in a lot of countries. How can you want something if you don't know what it is?
_________________________
"I didn't care what she didn't 'low--I would boogie-woogie anyhow" John Lee Hooker
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#175707 - 05/23/06 03:54 PM
Re: not good
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Spawner
Registered: 03/17/06
Posts: 930
Loc: Olympia
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People love to armchair general about Iraq all damn day. The only people who we should be listening to are the Vets coming back, and the ones that I've spoken to say the whole thing's a crock.  Finally, Miller went to a military psychiatrist, who diagnosed him with signs of post-traumatic stress disorder. Miller thought that meant he could not be deployed. But in early September, he joined a group of Marines headed to police New Orleans in the wake of Hurricane Katrina.
Finally, Miller went to a military psychiatrist, who diagnosed him with signs of post-traumatic stress disorder. Miller thought that meant he could not be deployed. But in early September, he joined a group of Marines headed to police New Orleans in the wake of Hurricane Katrina.
"I really didn't want to go. ... There was a possibility we would be shooting people," he said. "We could be going into another (urban warfare) environment just like Iraq, except this would actually be U.S. citizens.
"Here we go, Fallujah 2, right here in the states."
_________________________
The art of government is to make two-thirds of a nation pay all it possibly can pay for the benefit of the other third.--Voltaire
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#175709 - 05/23/06 08:03 PM
Re: not good
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Spawner
Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 954
Loc: Spokane, Wa.
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I am no shrink, not meant dirisively, but I suspect a productive job and an income that made life more than just a paycheck to paycheck existence would go a long way to relieving some of the "stress." Many of those guys have family and the readjustment is difficult. To go from sleep to 150% and ready to kill is difficult and causes problems in the marital bedroom. I know a couple of the guys that made it thru the adjustment process. I used to know another one that didn't
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#175711 - 05/23/06 10:09 PM
Re: not good
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Returning Adult
Registered: 05/02/04
Posts: 384
Loc: Portland
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I bet you would see less and less sign up if the rules were changed. Not that I disagree but my suspicions lead me to guess.
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#175713 - 05/23/06 10:21 PM
Re: not good
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Returning Adult
Registered: 05/02/04
Posts: 384
Loc: Portland
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#175715 - 05/23/06 10:57 PM
Re: not good
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River Nutrients
Registered: 03/27/02
Posts: 3188
Loc: U.S. Army
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What do they call the person that graduates last of their class in med school? Doctor. 
_________________________
Tent makers for Christie, 2016.
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#175716 - 05/24/06 12:12 AM
Re: not good
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Spawner
Registered: 07/26/05
Posts: 954
Loc: Spokane, Wa.
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I didn't mean to imply that a job was a fixall. I suspect that there are some that cannot be fixed they are so damaged. It was just a piece of normalcy that might help.
I have a couple of MD friends that were Reservists. The NROTC put them thru UW. They were activated from civilian life during the Viet Nam fracas. NO alternative, saddle up. That's the way it oughta be.
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