Jerry

I didn't know that you could get a prescription for common sense! After reading some of the one-sided replies to this thread, apparently there is a bigger need for that prescription (common sense) then I had realized.

I am not supporting the bolt decision one way or the other. But I am supporting my own opinion that I, I, I, I (incase you don't "get it) that means me, believe that every person on this earth has a inherent natural right to fish…plain and simple! Its simply is not a "privilege".

For all of the "privilege" worshippers out there, long before we had any form of self government we fished! No license, no laws, no rules, we just fished! I suppose that the same people will also believe that was a "privilege" too. It's kind of like drinking alcohol (I'll use alcohol as an example, because it appears to be controlling some peoples logic) in some ways; way back before we had government, rules, or bureaucrats to control everything that we could possibly do, you could if you wanted to, drink all the alcohol that you wanted to, and that was your right to do that back then. It was not a "privilege" it was your right. But now days because of governmental rules, we can not drink all the alcohol that we want; because we will get arrested and get thrown into jail for being drunk in public. Well I guess you can still do that now, but now you will also pay a price for doing it… right? (money)

Regardless of what the "privilege" people attempt to make us believe, fishing is a "right" by virtue of the definition of what "right" means; "something that belongs to a person by law, nature, or tradition…like the right to free speech! Even though "free speech" is a right, it too has restrictions on what a person can say. So you can and have "rights" with restriction attached to them.

When will people finally get enough "common sense" to understand that bureaucrats will always use the word "privilege" instead of "right"! They can charge you for it being a "privilege" but they can not charge you if it's a "right'! Now you know why they want to keep calling your right to fish, a "privilege". It's all about money baby!

Finally, Jerry, I am probably not going to be changing the bureaucrats or the "trust me" members on this board that believe otherwise. But I do believe that a lot more people now have a much better understanding of what the difference really is between our "right" to fish, compared to your "privilege" to fish is... it's all about money baby!

Any clearer now Jerry or do I need to write you a prescription?

"You can lead a horse to the water, but you can't make him drink it"


Cowlitzfisherman

"When will people finally get enough "common sense" to understand that bureaucrats will always use the word "privilege" instead of "right"! They can charge you for it being a "privilege" but they can not charge you if it's a "right'! Now you know why they want to keep calling your right to fish, a "privilege". It's all about money baby! "

They do not have enough money as it is to run the program properly. Are you proposing we now take what little we do give back through our liscense fees away?

You can also lead a dead horse to water but it too will not drink...

The Other Thread Was Better...

I need to go fishin'

CF 'Oh, God of common sense" ,In the Utopian world you seem to be stuck in --- each person would not abuse the "right" to fish. It seems the folks that abuse the resource [now and in the past] made it such that laws and rules were made [fishing became a 'priviledge'] so that we could all share the resource. With the laws and rules came the money grubbing government. A right became a priviledge. Seems simple to me but then again I'm not the God of common sence like you.

CF, your posts are by far the most one sided in this tread.

When the exersising of your rights infringe on my rights, then there is a problem. That is why there needs to be some management of these rights. So while it may be your "right" to fish, the execution of these rights must be treated as a privelege.

CFM ..... I'm kinda sorry you posted this topic. As an infrequent visitor to this site I've always enjoyed your posts on events impacting the Cowlitz, and I had assumed you were a reasonable and logical guy. Now I'll read them with a different view.

You asked a legal question, and you got a legal answer from an expert. The horse is dead.

Just like 4 salt you seem to be trying to turn this thread into something its not!

freedom of movement is a right and of course that right is regulated. Rights and what your talking about (anarchy)are two different things!

I am not a hippie and I dont live In a fantasy world.

All that I want is to have fishing officially called a right for every american and for that right to be undivided. I never said unregulated though really that would be nice but we would not have anything to fish for in a few years now would we!

Why is it so hard to get people to go along with whats best for us sheesh! Just pretend for crying out loud. Rights are not that bad are they?

Lets stick to fishing!!!!!! This isn't a #%!^*@% editorial/political chat room, Dig!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Tahoma, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Tahoma, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by stlhdh2o:
<strong> You can also lead a dead horse to water but it too will not drink...

The Other Thread Was Better...

I need to go fishin'

CFM, is there a simple way to say you are talking about your beliefs? Not engaging a battle of semantics, Expressing your outrage to the Boldt case, or, saying you believe it is your "right" to fish any time, any place your heart desires.

All CFM is saying is that we have a right to be on this earth to fish, hunt, breath and enjoy all of the basic "rights" of living.

We all have the right to fish. It becomes the privalage of those who buy the license. The governments way of turning your rights into privlages. Just (2) cents.

lead thrower:
When in your lifetime have you ever seen or herd of any government run agency ever say or admitted that they have "enough money"?

stlhdh2o; I am sorry that I can't please YOU all the time!

Jerry Garcia: You said "Seems simple to me but then again I'm not the God of common sence like you." Sounds like you know yourself pretty darn well to me Jerry!

Hooknose: You never herd me say that I wasn't a "opinionated person" have you? Some people believe in the "trust me theory" and others like me, don't. Call it what ever you want to!

Thumper: you said; "You asked a legal question, and you got a legal answer from an expert. What expert? I am still waiting to see if your so called expert is in deed authorized to give such a "expert legal opinion"! Maybe he is and maybe he's not! But I do know that If you are not licensed to "practice law" in Washington State, his "opinion" is no better than my "opinion" is! The horse isn't dead yet, it's just sick to death of being misinformed!

micropterus101: I could not have given a better reply…excellent! Can't you please "rub off" some more of your common sense onto these guys? It certainly sounds like you have more than enough to go around! That also tells me that there is still hope for mankind; as long as we have people such as you who can continue to "think" past what some else tells them is right. People like you are what make's America . . . .America!

Well, now that some of you have had your chance to criticize me, I fully expect next to hear from you know who.

P.S. I just wanted to let you "privilege" guys know that I was out at Blue Creek this morning exercising my "right" to pick up your rotten trash that you had left there!

No… maybe I should call it my "privilege" to do that!!


Cowlitzfisherman

RK43

[QUOTE]Originally posted by RK43:
=======================
All CFM is saying is that we have a right to be on this earth to fish, hunt, breath and enjoy all of the basic "rights" of living.
=======================

You're "getting it" but you're just not quite all the way there yet!

Please don't think that I am getting all upset about the "Boltd decision". It really has nothing to do at all with my belief that we do have a "right" to fish. The "Boltd decision was not brought up by me, it was brought up by someone else who was trying to prove that my opinion was wrong. I am not a native of Washington State, so it really didn't affect me like the people who have spent all of their life here.


Cowlitzfisherman

My contention is that the difference between a right and a privelege is so negligible as to be moot.

Suppose for a minute that you are correct. What does having the 'right' to fish gain you that merely having the privilege does not allow?

Last note...

CFM, of course I'm a licensed attorney, as all Assitant Attorney Generals are...

Now what?

Fish on...

Todd.

CFM --- As I said, the horse is dead. Give it a rest.

stlhdh2o: you asked;

"Suppose for a minute that you are correct. What does having the 'right' to fish gain
you that merely having the privilege does not allow?

For one thing stlhdh2o, and it a BIG ONE, "they" can take away your "privilege" from you, but they can not take away your right! Does PETA ring a bell in your little head turkey? They can, and they will, if you turkeys keeping telling everyone that fishing is A "privilege " and not A "right"!

Thanks Todd. . . I knew you had it in you!

I also knew that you were saving that for the very last moment. . . that's your style!
But what about my other questions that I had asked you to answer? Why not give me and the board those answers now in your same reply…hummmmm!

Thumper: You need to get off that horse, your making him sicker each time you try to ride it!


Cowlitzfisherman

Seems kinda funny how some people around here think they need to do their best to end a thread.Why,Maybe its not going their way.I don't know.
Thats your privelege,but not your right.Know what I mean.
I may not agree with peoples ideas but I do try to respect them.
Because this thread hasnt ended yet I have learned a thing or 2.
I have always tried to appreciate everybodies right to express their thoughts.
Please don't try to put an end to a thread just because you dont like it.
An alternative is to stay away from it.
That is your right,and you know how to use it.

I am priveleged to have the rights I have. Others sometimes don't feel so privelged about my rights, and when they suspect my rights, I go with a left. Though no damage is usually inflicted, it affords me the priveldge of using my rights.

CF -

No need for name calling is there?

You've had your 'argument' exposed as not only a fallacy but flat wrong in the eyes of the law. Its in the RCW for cryin' out loud.

After which you try to discredit the member who posted the law and resort to namecalling when someone asks you a tough question....

The simple truth sir is that you can have both your rights AND your priveleges taken away at any time for any number of reasons. Arguing about whether or not fishing is a right or privelege is like arguing about whether the rainforest is wet or moist. In the end it doesn't matter because the result is the same.

If the sign says 'Closed to Fishing' you can't legally fish there.

Suffrage is a Federal right. The only time individual states can revoke voting rights is when allowed by federal law(14th amendment to our Constitution-criminals).