I ran the thread when was the last time you were checked?

Do you think there is enough enforcement?

There is only one reason that I have never been checked on the river and get to witness the meat fishing i.e snagging of wild fish every fall.There is nowhere enough law enforcment!Plenty of people to make the rules and fake the science but no where near enough guys in the field protecting the resource.A bunch of rules without enforcement means nothing.I am tired of new rules to further define old rules.We either need to have the state patrol become involved as in oregon or hire and outfit more gamewardens.Enforce the rules we got will due.Unfortunately with the current state of affairs I do not see it happening.

Maybe if we link the risk of terrorism to our fish and wlidlife then we could more gamewardens?

This just came up. On memorial day I decided after cleaning the garage to go pitch some jigs at campbell lake. I arrived around 4 in the afternoon and there were more skiers/jet skiers/swimmers/drunks standing around then you could shake a stick at the swimmers wouldnt even move off the ramp so I could launch until I almost ran them over with the trailor. I realize that every one has the right to use the lake/ramp but when I park the truck way up the parking lot, I walked by the first row of cars and drove behind the same row and 4 out of 20 had the yellow parking sticker (washington tacks on $2 for ramp maintenance on the license fees) its a $66 fine for not having it. most of the row was full of cars without trailors. to end all some one backed into my left tail light....At 8 I returned to a empty ramp, A eagle grabed a sparrow from a tree next to the ramp then I guess was so intent on gettiing the little bird wasnt watching where he was going and crashed into the bush and fell into the water. I was only 15 to 20 feet away when he swam(flaped his wings in the water) out to the edge and flew to a near by tree to have his dinner. It was so cool and I was so dumbfounded I watched with my hand not even 2 feet from my camara, maybe next time....I spent the next 20 min picking up trash left at the ramp and the shame in it all there is a trash can not even 30 feet from the ramp!!!!!!!!!EOR (end of rant)......DJ

Herm,

It's kind of like asking people if we need more traffic cops! The people who are going to break the laws will continue to break the laws. More cops only work for a short time. Yea, they can stop poaching for a short time, but the guys who do the real poaching are usually to smart to get caught. So we just usually end up catching the guys who just makes a bad judgment call and forgets to punch out a fish, or some other minor violation.

Will more enforcement turn around our declining fish runs. . .not likely! Will more enforcement save our "wild" fish? Again, it's not likely. So what purpose will more enforcement really serve? Is it really worth having to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to catch a few guys who go out and intentionally snag a fish or 2 or forgets to punch his fish?

Personally I don't see the need for more enforcement. Most guys, most of the time go by the rules. I believe that there are enough enforcement out there to handle most of the areas that have the biggest poaching problems. . . will they catch them all. . .not likely!

WE already have enough "stand by enforcement"; and it's called the state patrol. When the WDFW need additional help, lets pull a few of our troopers off their radar guns or coffee shops and let them work the fields for a day or two during the times that we have high poaching periods. Anyway, that is how I would solve of problem!

You know, we spend millions of dollars each year teaching our kids how to play football, baseball, and all the "other sports" and sportsmanship. How much do our schools spend teaching the kids about the oldest sports in the world . . . i.e. hunting and fishing!

Better yet, let's get our schools and our educators off their fat duffs and start teaching the next generation about fishing and hunting, and then maybe, just maybe, the next generation won't need to have a cop or game warden to tell them what is legal and what is not!

AuntyM: someone put another box on the floor again, and I just couldn't help myself!!


Cowlitzfisherman

I disagree. There is almost no enforcement at any of the places I fish. I've been checked twice in over twenty years of fishing and I fish quite a bit including some popular spots like elliot bay. Granted I strictly observe all the regs.

I think too much enforcement effort is focused on sting operations against organized poaching like the geoduck and crab poaching ring they busted down in tacoma last year. Multiple agents worked on that for something like 18 months. Thats a lot of effort to bust a few poachers.

In about half a day an agent could bust a dozen or more crab poachers simply by pulling all the pots out at shilshole right now fishing during closed season and sending each of those people a ticket. I am sure most everyone on this board know multiple holes on various rivers that snaggers can be found 24/7 when salmon are in the river. Why they don't enforce the no snagging rule is also a mystery.

I think if the state is going to keep applying more and more complex regulations on the sportspeople of this state (which I support in general), then it is their duty to enforce those regulations. If the current trend of ever changing and complex regulation keeps up without adequate enforcment, soon very few of us will follow the rules.

I'm not advocating hiring more enforcement people, just a refocusing of their effort.

The other thing that would help is to stiffen the penalties for violators.

We need more. If they just rotated from one meat hole to antoher it would help. The Crab Bar on the Snohomish every fall is a snagfest and I have only seen one warden in there over the years.

The one and only time I've been checked, the warden told me that only 3 wardens patrolled that half of the county! Yes, in my opinion we need more enforcement.

I also think we need more, both in Washington and Oregon. I havent been checked in years and I am usually on the river 3 or more days a week during Springer season.

Only warden I have seen this year was at Mahaffeys when I stopped for someting on my way home one afternon and also sitting in a truck at the Deadline at Bonneville when we were plunking. Niether one checked us though.

OOps scratch one of those votes I amde a stupid assumption again. I assumed without reading that yes would be we need more enforcment.. MY bad.. Haven't been checked in 15 years in Washington ranging from The Washougal and cowlitz to the Hoh and Bogie to the skagit and sauk. near as i can tell the state has no enforcment officers.

Also along with more officers their word in court needs to be taken as an expert witness just like a elite pathologist. When a gam warden says in court " i saw him snagging" the judge needs to accept that as a fact. None of this prove it crap and getting off on techncalities.. and as far as i am concerned any fishing violation that results in the death of a wild salmon or steelhead should have an excessive fine and a penalty of life time loss of licence in the state no exceptions.

The last time I was check was over 20 years ago when I drove my gillnetter into Lake Washington during the hydro races. The Coast Guard boarded my boat and wrote me a ticket for no throw ring. Can you believe it?

Rob

You're really too much!!

"Hang them", "shot them" and "through away the keys"!

I think maybe you were born in the wrong county . . . or maybe the wrong time!

Using your own logic, unless you have not been pulled over, checked, or charged with some type of traffic violation, or some kind of felony, law enforcement is not doing their job! Were in hell are you people coming from?

Why do you think that we have laws in this county that protect you and me from "harassment" or illegal search or seizer from our police? Well lets just pull everyone over and see what they have in their possession! If we pull enough of them over, we are going to catch one!

What in your liberal mind makes you think that a game wardens "word" is the law of the land?

The way that it is in our county is; you are innocent until "proven guilty". If you want it to be the "other way" you best head over to Brittan or some other county! There, you are guilty until you have proven that you are innocent!

Not the kind of place that I want to live in!

You have good cops and you have the bad cops! So just because a cop or "game warden" thinks that you are "guilty" in his eyes, certainly doesn't make you guilty! If you think otherwise, you are one sorry dog!

Your logic is so far flawed, that by your way of "liberal thinking"; that a cop can say that you were doing 80 in a 20 mile an hour zone just because as an officer, he is an "expert" and he is always right!

Think hard, and think deep about what you have said.

Cowlitzfisherman

No we do not have enough enforcement. Like CFM noted, people are going to continue poaching regardless. However, more enforcement coupled with stiffer fines might help a few individuals think about properly wetting line.

I would like to see a volunteer system in place to deputize individuals and/or a "watch" effort put in place- much like the numerous neigborhood watches. I am sure we could put a dent in poaching with the aforementioned.

So Cowlitz,

Are you joining the Grandpa/Ejo etc... bandwagon and equating EVERYTHING as either liberal or conservative now?

If so, I'm glad. In fact, I hereby nominate you as official spokesperson for the conservative agenda. The "Rush Limbaugh" of Piscatorial Pursuits if you will.

Your first official duty will be to go to the Barrier dam this fall and tell all of the snaggers not to worry. The Game Warden won't only have to catch them red-handed, he'll have to provide forensic evidence at their trial as well!

P.S.
My comments were made before reading CF post #2!
I'm not going there and my comments below are in response to CF post #1

H



Cowfish,
You are most likely right on, on the assumption that most fishermen try and are doing things legaly and properly. I also agree about the license not on your person or the occaisional punch that is forgotten.

However, I believe that a more visible presence of gamies at the launches and on the rivers, would go a long way toward keeping the honest, honest!

I also believe that most poachers (professional) and the intentional stand a better chance of being caught if the gamies were making contact with more sportsmen. I believe most violators who are apprehended away from the field are done so because they bragged about their crime, or told someone they shouldn't have, and the more people the gamies come in contact with the better chance there is they will hear about it!

Your thoughts on teaching the kids in school about fish and game is brilliant and I think needs more exposure! Right on Cowfish!

I think WDFW should consider using "Manpower" or some similar agency to beef up the enforcement roles at launches and notorious snag and floss sights. they ought to be able to make back their wages in short order, and it would free up the prof. gamies for the more complicated issues.....Maybe!




herm

Herm: I agree with most of what you have said, except this one; "However, I believe that a more visible presence of gamies at the launches and on the rivers, would go a long way toward keeping the honest, honest!"

Well herm, that sounds pretty good, but what has it ever done for all the illegal gill net fish that are either "taken" or killed every year? How many times have we had the netters observed? and it still goes on and on!


4Salt, your colors are flying again!


I take it, that old "Rush" must get to you a little bit sometimes!


Well, he gets to me sometimes too, so don't gloom too much about that one


If I am Rush, then you must be "Phil Donahue" (sp) . . . right?

So tell me, did I put a "little bit to much pepper" there, or was it just right?


Maybe you should do just a little bit more home work, and then you may realize that you really don't know $hit about the history of the Barrier Dam, the Cowlitz, or snagging on the Cowlitz; or what the WDFW had originally proposed to do on the Cowlitz in the past!

Obviously, as usual, you have gone to your same old famous "attack" mode without doing all of your homework first again.

I just can't wait to hear your reply about what you "think" you know about WDFW, and "snagging" at the Barrier Dam.


One thing that you "don't hear me ranting about" on this board; are issues or places that I do not know anything about!

When you're done ranting, you can tell us just how salty it really is!

Ps, Your closing line: "can hear me now.....Good" should have an add on staying; " I need to look up, something is coming down on top of me !" (jk)


Cowlitzfisherman

Enough enforcement???

It really depends if I rememebered to pinch my barb or not....

Less rules, more game wardens, and a better judicial system.

Officer Bruce Richards, who patrols the Enumclaw area quite a bit (Really he works all over the county), told me about a guy who SIX has been caught illegally fishing for salmon, whether it be illegal lures, catching over the limit, snagging, etc. This guy is a poacher, yet he never gets more then a year or two. What the hell is that?

If they are going to make a big deal about everything, HIT THE OFFENDERS HARDER!

Click it or ticket... You just might get a what, $80 fine?? How many millions of dollars were put into that campaign?

Curtis

I would like to see a game warden carry a pole and wear a vest, walk along Blue Creek or any other meat hunting areas, and nail the pochers.

Jay

Herm
I think it depends on where and when. I know alot of people said they were checked regularly at Sieku. Obviously we dont need more there. Maybe we could use more in a less fished area???? Its not for me to decide. Whats up on that Piggy Roast in August

Not near as much as what they've brought in.
All that is is a money maker for the state.
I heard there's been staters walking up and down the Mukilteo ferry ramp writing tickets while the cars inch along or just sit and wait.