Cutty, I'm on your side! Don't let the uninformed rattle you!

Cutty, I'm on your side! Don't let the uninformed rattle you!

My sister works for the state as a secretary. She has not recevied a raise of any kind for 3 years. Not enough money in the budget. But the cost of her medical coverage goes up every year. So in effect she makes less now than 3 years ago. She also cannot strike.

Teachers at least were going to get something. Because of that there is no way I could support a teachers strike. If you think I am uninformed oh well.

I rest my case.

welcome to the real world...

not only have I taken a cut in pay my insurance price has almost doubled... time to suck it up... or find a new job...

Teachers and school levies are linked together like a glove is to your hand!

Personally, if given a choice, I would rater pay teachers more, and eliminate the wasteful use of levy monies. If teachers could get their higher salaries, why on earth would they want to tax us more with levies?

I don't have any problem paying for public education through our general taxing system, because its fair and everyone pays into it, but I do have a problem when school districts place special property taxes on a person just because they own a home or land.

Why are school districts allowed to use their personal influence in the local churches and senior citizens centers to convince all the "older people" who have already been given "special" tax exemptions that allows them to escape paying school levies if they make less then $30,000, are over 61 years old, and own less then 1 ½ acres of land?

That puts and unfair tax burden on anyone who makes over 30,000 and just happens to own more then 1 ½ acre of land and is not yet 61 years old. Almost no one who is 61 or older who lives in a small town owns that much property, and that places the majority of the tax burden on everyone else who is under 61 and who lives outside the city or town limits.

As just one example, during our last "local" school levy, a chair person for the schools "levy committee" which does all the "promotional crap" that goes on just happens to also be the son of one of the "riches" persons in our county. The levy "chair person" kids all attended our school district and were heavily involved in all the athletic programs that much of the levy monies are usually wasted on.

After checking with the appraisers office, I found out that this same person doesn't even live within the county borders, nor does he pay and special levy assessments tax for our school district either! In fact, he owns 23 acres with a $450,000+ home just outside of the county line. So yea, you might say that I am a little bit "passionate about this topic". It just amazes me who much a person can discover if they are just willing to spend the time and do the research that is needed to get the "real facts" and not just a bunch of BS!

From my own personal experience (and I have plenty) of researching School levies, Levies are full of corruption! Probably not all levies are corrupted, but in my opinion, the majority of them are. The money that is generated from the majority of them only benefits a few of the students who parents are not willing to pay for their kid's college education.

They hope that their kids can excel and achieve in the after school sport programs so that they can get a free "sport" scholarship so that they won't have to cough up the big bucks for their own kids college education! Many of you may think differently, but that's just the way it works in small town communities.

Four years ago when I had scheduled a meeting with our local school superintendent to discuss the results of what my public records requests had revealed, the superintendent unbeknown to me, had also invited one the schools biggest supporters to my meeting. I knew the guy, so it really wasn't going to effect what I was going to say one way or another.

After I had addressed all of my concerns, and I was ready to leave the office, his friend stopped me in the door way. His friend said, "Bob, if you will just support this levy and stop writing letters to the editor, and vote to support this levy, I will pay whatever the difference will be in your property taxes" I couldn't believe that he said it right in front of two office workers and in front of the schools superintendent!

What really bothers me even more is the fact that the superintendent did nothing to stop his friend from doing this illegal act! He just smiled! In this state, rather people know it or not, it is illegal to attempt to bribe a person to sway their vote! This guy was putting me in jeopardy by asking me to sway my vote in favor of what he wanted to happen by paying my levy taxes!

I told the guy that it was wrong, and if I did such a thing, I could not live with my self! I also told him that it may be great for me, but what about the other poor guy who won't be getting there taxes paid. He just smiled and said that they would have to work that one out for themselves!

Two years later, after several factual letters to the editor, the richest guy in our county, sent me a check for $600! He writes on it; for ….property taxes! I will not accept a bribe from any man, so I sent it back to him and told him that he could send it to the school district in both of our names and use it for an educational scholarship because I was not for sell! I also said that the money is not to go to any "sport" related scholarship if he joined my name to the donation. I believe in education, but the cost of sport is up to the parents of the kids who participate in the events!

I don't know what he ever did with his check, but I do know that I still don't have any problems sleeping at nigh!

So yes, I do know more then most do about school levies and teacher's perks and benefit! I always do my homework!

How many times have any of you ever went through a schools finical records to see how much of a levy tax actually went to what it was supposed to be used for? It always goes directly in the schools "general funds" and then they hire "extra teachers" and enhance their sports programs! I see them hiring a cough's assistant for the first year. The next year the assistant becomes a PE trainer, the following year he promoted to PE-heath advisor and the games never ends! The more kids that come to attend their school for the "sports" programs, the more money the district gets for each kid from the state.

Remember, the state gives the matching funds for levies, so whenever they pass a levy, they are almost doubling what a levy was originally run for. And where do you think that all that extra money goes to?

Do the homework, and then come back and tell me were I am wrong!


Cowlitzfisherman

I also know a number of teachers. And I never said my sister was complaining. but when I see the unemployment numbers and see how many people are lossing thier jobs at Boing and other places. All I can think is that maybe the teachers should say to themselves,"self at least I have a job".

May this is not the best time to put a further drain on the econmey.

By the way I do infact vote in favor of all school levies. I just don't think now was the best time to do something like this.

CF, if all levies are corrupt, then could it be that the authors of said levies are the ones who are corrupt also? Like I said before, and you also noted, ADMINISTRATION are to blame for the state of education, not the people expected to implement their crooked agendas. Teachers are only the most visible targets, and are innocent. ASK YOUR SCHOOL BOARD! They are the ones which allow such travesty, and should be removed the same way as they were inserted, by election. Most of these boards are in the pockets of just about every superintendent in the state. Nepotism, cronyism, and just plain arrogance are their order of march.Time for ALL taxpayers to start asking REAL questions about school administration, before all the qualified and competent teachers do leave for California!

cfm, thanks for that. Not that you have any obligation to care about what I think, but that was much easier for me to stomach.

"Almost no one who is 61 or older who lives in a small town owns that much property"

Then it's "almost" no votes, and it's "almost" no increase in your taxes, right? That would be MY taxes too, by the way. I'm certainly not exempt by those criteria you listed.

Your biggest beef seems to be the cost of athletics, from your last post. Good luck shooting that stuff down, man. Whew.

Most people just don't have the time to look into this stuff, and frankly how many people with kids in a school district want to go around publicy and call foul on programs that their kids are involved with?

And that guy that lives outside the county, but has kids in your school district? What's that about? Why are his kids not in his county's schools? I assume it's probably a special case of proximity to schools, but it seems there should be an exception that allows people to pay into their own district....either that or they don't get officialy involved with stumping for them...or both. That's pretty screwed up if you ask me.

BW, I Interpreted your post wrong... I aggree 100% with what you are saying...

Skywalker

No! That is not right!

You said;
"Then it's "almost" no votes, and it's "almost" no increase in your taxes, right? That would be MY taxes too, by the way. I'm certainly not exempt by those criteria you listed."

The biggest number of voters who are over 61 lives within the city limits. There are not that many voters who live outside the city limits that are over 61. They enjoy the perks of doctors and stores that are close by.

That is why the schools wine and dine these people! They vote, but they will not have to pay any levy tax!

Is this any clearer?

Cowlitzfisherman

Jeeeeez and I'm the dumb one. Pull your monkey head out of you know where and pay attention. NO ONE is saying that the teachers don't deserve to get payed for what they're worth. I want to know why they aren't giving two $h!ts about the kids through all this. You teachers on this board keep saying you went into this to make a difference, or because you enjoy helping kids. If thats the case I'm betting at least half of the ones striking would say the same, but they're actions are not backing that up.

Also why don't we get rid of the ten year and cull out the worthless teachers and then we'd be even more willing to give you more money.

wasn't there an initiative ,that the legislature derailed, that was just passed that would have given teachers raises? kinda like cola?

and forget about the whole 'what about the children?' thing....if we as a society cared about children we'd complain about a system where both parents NEED to work 40+ hours a week to survive instead of bein' able to spend time with 'em...instead of letting daycare raise them...

If my job required the education a teachers does,no way in hell I work for less than 40k to start.

cfm, sorry, I reread your post and see where I lost track of your point. Duh.

I guess my point in all of this is that frankly I'm willing to live with it. I have kids in school and I want them to have the best available curriculum and selection of extra-curricular activities possible. I have a pretty crappy experience with levy failures as a kid and don't want them to go through it themselves.

It may not be the right way to do it, but if it's getting me what I want I'll live with it.

What I don't understand are the exemptions on federal income tax for having kids...why do we get checks for having kids? Because eventually they'll be tax payers?

That my friend... Is the American Way...

I must admit, there are times that fat, dumb, and happy suits me just fine.

As I settle deeper and deeper into these geezer's shoes, it just seems the only way to fly.

Now, get off my lawn, ya punks!

Glowball,


Your logic is faulty. Your logic is that teachers should care more about the kids then their own lively hood. Well I'm a paramedic. And I care about people and I love helping people, but I also do it for a living. The public always screams how teachers should sacrafice their own well being for the kids. Truth is they are just making a living for themselves. Why don't they teach and negotate at the same time you ask. I'm sure they have been negotating all summer long to no avail. Give teachers binding arbitration and it will all be a mute point.

Remember the vote we had two years ago to make cost of living raises mandatory for teachers. Well the first year instead of a raise the teachers had to work 4 extra days. If they didn't work the extra days, no raise. Thats not a raise, thats more work for more money, they still make the same each hour. This year for their cost of living raise the school used it all paying more for health insurance. I don't have a problem with that. Health insurance is sky rocketing.

Okay, here I go..........

On one hand you make a good point. We do not place our childrens education as our highest priority. We will support some punk sports hero's exhorbitant salary, but not a raise for teachers...... BUT

If teachers really want to see their salaries increase they need to stop fighting the "pay for ability" issue that so many want (including myself). Too many worthless teachers are sitting pretty because of tenure and strong-arm union tactics. If they perform well (easily measured) they should be rewarded for it. If they don't, they lose their job. If this was to be supported by the teachers and the unions, many, many more people would be willing to see salary ranges increase.
Teachers DO know what they are getting into and by going to school to get a teaching degree they are in effect accepting the status quo. Any increase in their pay and/or benefits are then a "happy surprise".
They should not hold our childrens education "hostage", which is exactly what they are doing when they strike..... But they say the children are their #1 priority?
They also need to be vocal when a district builds schools for millions when a far less fancy building could educate just as well and leave plenty for better books, supplies, etc.....
I for one never attended a school that looked even CLOSE to what some of these fancy structures look like, and I received a very good education.......
Teachers that go on strike, IMHO, should be ashamed of themselves...... They are doing nothing more than teaching our kids that if you do not get your way, pout and throw a fit and then you may get your way.. No matter who suffers.
I am in the medical profession (RN) and I will not and have not ever joined in a strike. I have belonged to Nursing Unions (it was required at some hospitals I worked at) but made it clear from the onset that if a strike were to occur, I would not participate. Not trying to place a halo on my head, but patients come before anything, and striking ultimately hurts the patients and places them at risk....

Those that bemoan the teachers salaries, etc., need to also take into consideration the amount of time off, sick time, leave of absense (for cont. education/sabattical), medical benefits, retirement, that they recieve. It is much sweeter than most get in the private sector..... Again, I agree that Americans in general expect the best education for their children but do not want to put out the bucks for it.... But at around $10,000.00/child now the yearly average cost to the taxpayer to educate them, we are not getting our monies worth...... Tossing more $$ their way is not going to improve that.....

MC

Oh come on now Nookie..... Some of them yes, many of them...no.
The fact that they are paying for supplies out of their own pocket is true. That says more for the school district and how they allocate the $$ they receive than it does teachers being underpaid. Hundreds of thousands on sport programs, but pennies for teaching materials... Raising taxes and levies is not going to fix that problem. I work in the medical field and many times I have purchased equipment that I use in my work OUT OF MY OWN POCKET because what the hospital supplies is sometimes broken or low quality. It is still MY choice. No one forces me to do it. Should I scream that I need to make more money because of a choice I make?

As far as spending the summers the way you describe? I have personally known (very well in fact) 5 teachers in the last 12 years and only one of them spends summers the way you describe. 3 were females and as second income earners enjoyed the summers with their children, one (studied and worked) male, and one male that played all summer long......

Refer to my other post regarding americans not placing education at the top of priority list if you care to read my thoughts on that subject....

MC