Bruce,

Instead of just saying...

...which is essentially parroting Plunker's comments on your board, why don't you do what Plunker, and Jacob, and CFM have not done, and actually explain why there is no science to back it up.

Better yet, take it to its logical next step, and show the science that says it's a bad idea.

Fish on...

Todd.

Do you even read my posts? Mandatory C&R hasn't worked on any systems. It's already been tried. It hasn't worked. What more evidence do you need?

Jacob,

I agree with you on the "removing fish from water" regulation.

It doesn't make it illegal to stick both your hands in its gills, or standing on its head in two inches of water to rip the hook out, but it does prevent you from responsibly holding it out of the water to get a good picture, and may have some safety implications both in boats and on stream banks that aren't conducive to wading.

Fish on...

Todd

Show me the science that supports it. Take a look across the state where C&R has been implemented for years, are the runs in better shape now?

JacobF,

Easy, cutt it off or use a hook release tool. You net ocean salmon and brig em in the boat to flop around and get all their scales scrapped off and they are as good as dead.

People I fish with and myself have been cutting fish off or using a hook release tool for years. You never have to touch the fish or put it in a nett.

It has come to this due to iresponsible fish handling in the past.

Jacob,

Did you read the post above the one you quoted?

Wild steelhead release IS NOT the only factor in wild fish recovery. It will be part of a program that addresses all the rest of the problems, too.

However, no program for wild fish recovery is aided by hitting steelhead in the head with rocks or sticks.

Unless you have a study that says it is...

Fish on...

Todd.

JacobF,

Easy, cutt it off or use a hook release tool. You net ocean salmon and brig em in the boat to flop around and get all their scales scrapped off and they are as good as dead.

People I fish with and myself have been cutting fish off or using a hook release tool for years. You never have to touch the fish or put it in a nett.

It has come to this due to iresponsible fish handling in the past.

**Double Post**

Jacob,

Did you read the post above the one you quoted?

Wild steelhead release IS NOT the only factor in wild fish recovery. It will be part of a program that addresses all the rest of the problems, too.

However, no program for wild fish recovery is aided by hitting steelhead in the head with rocks or sticks.

Unless you have a study that says it is...

Also, don't forget the questions asking you where you were on the other issues...

Fish on...

Todd.

You're right, and if the state would push on, and work at fixing other issues, I wouldn't even be arguing this point. However, past experience shows that the state will not move on. They'll treat this as if it is the magic bullet that will fix the problems. The won't curb commerical fishing, the won't do anything to try to end tribal fishing, they'll just wait for the runs to decline even further and then cut the sportsmen back even more. They've done it with every fishery in this state. Remember catching rockfish and cod in Puget Sound? They limit the sportsmen again and again while giving commercial interests a free reign until there's not enough fish for anybody. Unless the sportsmen make a stand and force them to look at the real issues, the same thing will happen to steelhead.

Again, I'm not against wild steelhead release. I'm against the state placing meaningless restriction after meaningless restriction on the group that makes by far the smallest impact while ignoring all other factors. The state as proven time and time again they don't give a damn about wild fish. Mud Mountain Dam anyone??? What makes you think they are doing this for the fish?

Even though this may be only a drop in the bucket it is politically huge.

This is the first step in showing sport anglers do not want to utilize thier alocation for harvest. If we dont want to manage our alocation for harvest how can our alocation be managed under MSH/MSY as it is now? One of the things that will ultimately be changed with the chain reaction that has just been set off.

It will be difficult to manage the tribal portion for MSH and the sport portion for recreation at the same time with the current level of tribal harvest that occures. I gues new management styles will have to be looked at.

Jacob,

The state wouldn't have even done this without the work done by thousands of individuals and dozens of sport/recreational/conservation groups over the last decade.

If you have an issue with what the state should do (as you obviously do), as I asked earlier, what are you doing other than fishing on the river and fishing on the internet?

I'm not saying you don't get involved, I'm just saying that I haven't seen you at any meetings or hearings, or seen you testify to any issue involving steelhead, and I haven't heard you say that you have.

This action shows exactly what the public sportfishing community can do if they get organized and get involved in the process. Rather than complain about it, how about looking at how it got done and use the process to further your own agenda?

Fish on...

Todd.

I'd like to know why this never went through the rule change process? Why did WSC, TU and WDFW blind side sport fisherman with this?

Wow ignorance runs wild here what a shocker!
There cheering at peta right now. The tribes are having a big party too

Say bye bye fishy fishy. Now we just need to shut down the hatcherys and the anadromous fishes fate will be sealed.

Like I said before 5 years and you wont be able to fish for salmon and steelhead in this state!. its 4 years to go and counting!

Tribes? Bad publicity? YA RIGHT!

This is pretty damn funny in my opinion. It appears as though some people think the state did a great thing instituting these laws. But they (WDFW) are actually probably laughing at you. We did their job, by giving up our rights. How stupid. Just my .02

"But they (WDFW) are actually probably laughing at you."

You can include WSC and TU in that statement.

It is pretty clear from how this has all transpired from the beginning that WDFW was opposed to Wild Steelhead Release without exceptions.

I doubt their possition has changed. I gues it dosent matter now and they are gonna have to live with the decision that has been made.

Looks like it is going to be back to the old drawing board for wild steelhead management.

OK, just got back from some fishing, didn't catch any, native or hatchery so I guess I haven't offended anyone here. Let me see if I can respond to a variety of posts here even though I believe Grandpa's post was the one that stood out for me. But then, Grandpa does that to me.

In looking at the declining resource of anadromous fish there is no magic bullet I believe. There are the 4 H's however.

Hydro - This one is pretty obvious on the Columbia, Snake, Skagit, Cowlitz and even some smaller rivers like the Green, Pilchuck, Skookumchuck, etc. There certainly does not seem to be the political will to tackle this issue head on and quite frankly I'm not totally convinced that the price of removal is justified. But, there is no question that Dams have had a terrible impact on the resource.

Hatcheries - Mainly in place for two reasons - Mitigation for loss of spawning habitat due to Hydro/other factors and mitigation for over harvest. This is an area that I believe we can find some common ground on, there are hatchery programs (Long Live the Kings come to mind) that do not carry the negative impact on wild fish that other hatcheries do. I think we can work on this one.

Habitat - In my mind, the biggest obstacle to recovery. We have removed habitat through dams, we have spoiled habitat through development. With this issue we run right smack dab into the face of private property rights. This is the one that will require the most education and probably be the most expensive if we can solve it.

Which brings us to the 4th H - Harvest. As Richard Nixon used to say, "Let me perfectly clear about this". If I knew then what I know now, I would have had the foil ready. I believe that the tribal harvest of steelhead serves virtually no useful purpose to the tribes, and certainly has a terrible and negative impact on the resource. I believe that sports harvest of wild steelhead serves virtually no useful purpose to the sportfishing community and certainly has a terrible and negative impact on the resource. For the next two years, if we as individuals and as a community obey the regulation, we have 1/2 of the equation in hand. Now is time to go after the other 1/2. Foregone opportunity?? As GW says, Bring it on - I would love to see the courts rule on this so that it won't continue as the bogeyman that we make it out to be. If the courts rule that foregone opportunity is a legitimate concept, so be it - we have to deal with it. If the courts throw out the idea, then we can go forward without the threat. My comments about tribal fishing have always been offered from the viewpoint that if we point fingers only at the tribes without acknowledging our portion of the responsibility, we have no credibility. That's why it disturbs me so when I see Jacob write that the sportfishing community is not the problem. See above, the sportsfishing community is not the problem but we are part of the problem. As long as we don't acknowledge that, we bring nothing to the negotiation table except hypocrisy and we will never get anything done. As long as folks don't punch their cards properly, any contention that the tribal fishery reports are bogus boomerang back on us. It's so easy to blame everyone else - its really about personal responsibility isn't it?

I believe that we need to find a way of mitigating the impact of the tribal fisheries on the wild fish. Salmo had an idea a while back of harvesting the fish from holding ponds at the dams - that kind of creativity is refreshing. Personally, I would love to see fish wheels/traps come back into use for the tribal harvest as the impact on the wild fish is much less. Can we buy the fishing rights from the tribes? This is America - seemingly everything is for sale so it might be possible. What I know will not work is to try and rewrite the Court decisions that have affirmed Boldt. That really is a non starter. I know that blaming the tribes without accepting our responsibility and working on the other impacts is also a non starter. However, creative, passionate minds came up with many brilliant human achievements - I believe we can do this too. With this decision, I think we can come to the table with credibility and negotiate with our heads high.