Just tired of the entire negativity about not removing the fish from the water part of your posts

I take pictures of all my fish... fin or no fin

I think you must have me mistaken for someone else Lead Thrower. I believe the only thing that I've really said about it was that there probably should be some kind of handicap exemption.

I'm starting to think that you just just have a problem with anyone that doesn't agree with your line of thinking.

Too funny! I personally thought the question in my post added much more food for thought than the last couple posts.

I'd still like to hear anyone else's thoughts about it..

Sometimes people dont like what they come up with when they think too hard... things that sound good on the surface are much easier to defend.

Bruce,

Review the "hooking mortality" thread. In summary, Canadian studies found hooking mortalities between 3.6 and 5.1%. The 3.6 figure was from broodstock collection efforts during which, if a fish was bleeding it was let go instead of carted to the spawning facilities, so the figure is probably a little low. The 5.1 figure counted all fish and mortalities on one river over 2 winters (336 total fish caught; 17 mortalities), but fish were caught by biologists or techs with a great deal of fish handling experience. Again, considered somewhat of a low number.

Given the general and wide-ranging experience level of most sporties, the Canadian managers generally assume a figure of twice that of above--i.e., 7-10% hooking mortality.

Given the data, and how it was collected (and who), I think its pretty reasonable to assume that if you release fish in the Sparkyesk fashion, hooking mortality would more likely approach those found by the Canadians--say 4-5 percent. Any more handling, and the percentage just increases dependent upon how much. This is probably the most important point; that you can MAXIMIZE the survivability of the fish.

I can see how enforcement will be tough with this one, but I think fishermen should view it as: yes, the fish needs all of its scales and it needs to breath to live. Gamies should probably view it as the old saying: "I don't know how to define porn, but I know it when I see it"

I don't think lifting the fish out of the water for a few seconds to get a hero shot will hurt the fish, but have the camera out and ready to shoot (how long can you hold your breath after running a 440). I personally won't take pics of a fish when I'm by myself just because of this and the hassles that Sthder 1 stated in his example.

The debate here is probably good just because it raises awareness that 5 seconds out of the water is ok; 15-30 seconds--hurry up and take the damn shot; anything more and you really bump up that mortality percentage. I really don't think the gamies are going to enforce it unless they witness someone being a real a**hole.

All in all I agree with the new reg, because I've fished in Canada. Those folks know how to release fish. Sockeye during the closures, wild coho, wild steelhead; hell even pinks in the Vedder (natures fertilizer) are all released with feet in the water, holding only the line, and using a pair of pliers. The worlds not ending up there; PETAs not taking over; fishing privileges aren't going down the tubes.

Why not just make it like a hunting license. You have to pass a class on how to handle fish properly? It's not like the law will ever be enforced.

I suppose guides should start getting ticketed for netting natives to get their favorite plugs back??

Again as I mentioned above, keep the whining up and creating the new laws and someday we won't have a fishery for the native fish... They'll just shut it down and we'll all stand on the shore and stare.. Again, telling our kids that there are people in this world that were born stupid and I'm glad I'm not one of them...

I mean really, why is it that sportsmen or so called sportsmen want to micro manage and control something so insignificant.. Perhaps we could focus our strengths on other true factors to native fish declines...

I don't know about most out there but the fishing the last few years has been unreal for native fish around here... I can gaurantee it's not from the sportsmens but the lack of over harvesting along with great ocean conditions...

Keith

Naw, they were probably caught by hung-over college students working for minimum wage and a few credits. I was there once, but I think the carp and gar we caught are less sensitive than steelhead when it comes to how they are handled.

As I've mentioned several times this law makes me sick... Take a native steelhead on a stream close to home here, matter of fact where the state record is held... The East Fork of the Lewis and you've got 3 good sets of falls... I'm not sure if any of those on the board here have seen what steelhead do at a falls of seriousness do but.....

I've seen these fish try and jump the falls time and time again.. Sometimes jumping and sliding out of the fast water and ending up on the shoreline.. Sitting there for 20-30 seconds before they flop several times back into the river...

UH-OH SPARKEYS LAW WAS BROKEN... Better get a gamie and write these fish a ticket, they were completely out of the water... Nature it's self accomodates situations worse than those of humans at times....

For all that it matters I have to say it's the most stupid law I've ever seen..

It's like a cop busting a dude for going 65 in a 60 when he could be off investigating and busting a drug dealer...

If anyone understands this, then you are not a idiot for those that don't then read between the lines..
Keith

Steelhead are tougher than you think (quote stolen from smalma), I am not a hungover college student working for minimum wage and I am not an idiot.

I don't blame the folks out on the OP for being a little upset about some of the recent events that have taken place. A couple of the latest rulings supported by many members here and passed by the commission are a double whammy for them.

There are 4000 members here on this board, of those 4000 members probably only a small percentage are actually active members and of those active members a good percentage probably support the latest rulings. There are 385,979 licensed anglers in the State of WA most of which probably will think twice before heading to the OP this year. The small percentage of active members here do not reflect the views of the 385,979 anglers in WA. I know a LOT of anglers and most of them have said that they will either be cancelling their OP trip or just not going this year.

Bruce

That was very well stated!

Cowlitzfisherman

Even if your figures were correct we're still talking about roughly 40,000 anglers.

Using a dollar figure that I think is close based on personal experience. $200 spent for a trip to the OP.

40,000 * $200 = $8000000

Maybe the people of Forks have a good reason to be concerned and I would bet that that number is even higher especially when you take guided trips into account.

These numbers also do not reflect anglers that go more than once a year.

I seen probably 951 anglers on the Bogachiel on day last year and they all had rooms booked in Forks, had few beers at the local pub, had some dinner at the local greasy spoon and gased up their rigs for the trip home.

Actually I don't think that number is unreasonable, but I would be interested in any numbers that you come up with.

I've been trying to get the total numbers of steelhead punchcards issued, but haven't been able to yet.

I think the person you would want to talk to is Susan Marki with WDFW. I'll PM you her number.