I drove a GMC Sierra crew cab pickup today with the Duramx Diesel/Allison powertrain. The inside sold me with all the goodies like DVD player, Bose stereo, XM satellite radio and OnStar, leather...on and on and on....

This is a reprised topic.....I know a few folks with the Dodge Cummins diesel and I like those but am still partial to the GMC....

Any constructive thoughts? I would prefer to listen to those who actually have one than those who are set on something they drive that they are already in love with. I drive a
Suburban now...3/4 ton with the 454ci gas engine. Gas mileage is the main reason I would change to the diesel.

Grandpa, as you know I have a 2004 F-350 powerstroke and am quite satisfied with it. But saying that , I have a friend with a Chevy duramax and he loves it too, it does have a few more gadgets than mine too. My truck is the King Ranch model so it does have upgraded features like better leather, heated seats, etc.
I would say that they are all good trucks and the best thing to do is to drive them all and then make your mind up with feel of the drive train and creature comforts.
Hope to see you next season in the new boat. Hopefully I can get the motor in shape without having to invest in a new one, not quite ready for that. BIG BUCKS!!

Steve

Hey Steve...I have seen your truck and it is a beauty...I just happened to be helping my daughter look for a car and stumbled on this GMC truck....New it is over $50,000 which blows my mind...FOR A TRUCK!....Anyway this has all the options including DVD, OnStar and XM satellite radio....real comfortable rig. It has a super long warranty and even though it is used it is still under the warranty. We'll see what kind of price they come up with I guess. I have to trade in my Dodge "hot rod" pickup that peels rubber with the big off road tires....A real impractical but really fun vehicle..

I am mainly looking to change away from the Suburbans 10mpg to the 16-20 of the diesel and still be able to tow the boat.

I hate car shopping by the way

You can buy that truck all day at Dave Smith motors for about 34-35,000 bucks. for 50,000 it would have to have a pretty nice boat attached to the back.

If you're still looking to buy, skip the salesman and go straight to the fleet or internet sales guys. Just did that with the wifes new car. Got less than consumer reports and Edmunds.com said we should pay. No hassles, just their price plus $500

Not necessarily, I bought mine at 200 over invoice and it was still in that price range. I did my homework on the internet , before purchasing. What Grandpa is stating is that this is a loaded truck and will be far less than buying brand new.

You are right though , if buying new shop the internet and get all you can.
BTW-Granpa, mine will smoke the tires from a stand still too, just don't like to loose the rubber if you know what I mean. Oh did I mention "Mods", I didn't because that would void my warranty.

Steve

I am on about my 4 or 5th gas motor GMC truck now and have had mixed results. The truck I own now is a 1999 half ton four wheel drive with about 60k miles. The rear end has positrack and I am getting some noise back there....have tried changing the fluid helped for awhile but its back. The anti-lock break system gave out and now I drive it without ABS as it's $600 to have it fixed and not that impt to me. The tail-gate will sometimes not stay closed....loud bang driving down the road and scares the crap out of ya. Lately the "service 4wd" light has been coming on and I have been told its a sensor as I still have 4wd. The electric window on the right side goes up real slow on cold mornings but still works and has been this way for three years. So I have had "ok" luck with the truck..not great. GMC's I owned before this one ranged from incredibly good to not good at all.

I know you are interested in the Diesel and the only help I can give you there is a guy I met during archery season that owned one. He told me he had almost 100k miles on it, no problems and incredible power.


RM

Grandpa, I own a 2003 Duramax crew cab. What a FANTASTIC vehicle. I also have all the bells/whistles (leather, heated seats, Onstar, etc) I do not have the XM, but wish I did. I have about 53k miles on it and have not had one mechanical issue! It pulls my 8500lb boat very well. I even forget the big thing is there! The only three issues I've had are w: The A.M channels all stink and FM isn't much better.... I also had an issue with the tapedeck (fixed under 36k warranty) . Lzstly the drivers side running day light doesn't work. It's not the lightbulb, but some other issue. If you look at 2001-2003 Chevy's you'll notice half of them have this problem with the running light?? I get about 19mpg average w/60% highway miles.

On another note, I've noticed w/in the last month or two that Diesel is now MORE expensive than SUPER Unleaded? It was always at or less than regular, but something recently changed. Anyone have any ideas? I've noticed it at more than a dozen stations in the state, so it's not just a local thing???

Gramps,

Just do it! I did. I had major remorse for a few weeks. Then I took one last trip in the 89 K5 blazer and now I am very pleased with the 04 sierra crewcab duramax/allison. I have friends with the dodge and the ford but the tranny really puts the GMC/chev over the top. expect to get the loaded slt crewcab for around $39,000.

Anyone running biodiesel? I'm all for a all USA made product, am thinking of going diesel for this reason. Not a penny to middle east for gas sounds great to me. Better for the environment too. Almost sounds too good to be true. Anyone tried it out?

Grandpa, I have the same truck your looking at in the 2002 model. I love the truck, very quiet for a deisel and comfortable. I was lucky enough to get mine used last year with low miles though. I don't think you can find the same deals on the Duramaxs as other trucks because nobody can keep them in stock.

You are right about the fact that these trucks are selling fast and for top dollar..the one I am looking at is a 2003 with 30K mi ....

Grandpa - I picked one up last Januarury, it took me almost a year to decide between chevy, ford, dodge. I decided to go w/the duramax/allison. I tell you this you get what you pay for. I am more impressed w/the transmission than the motor. Also, the noise, major factor in my decision, you can actually talk at normal voice level.

Mentioned previously, Buyers Remorse, I did have it. But soon the quality/luxury of the truck minimized that.

LT

Do the math. The diesel is 15k more for the same optioned truck . Will you make that up in gas milage and resale over the life of the vehicle? In my experience the answer was no. So I did not replace mine with another diesel and went with the V10

Sundays paper- 4 door 4x4 Dodge diesel loaded with leather etc 32,488. Ford F-350 4 door 4x4 diesel loaded 35,229. Both with extended warrentys. I don't see a Chevy or GMC add right off but the duramax goes round 35,000 loaded.... So where do you get the 15,000 more dollars for the diesel figure ??? 5000 is more accurate... but then again, you pay to much for trucks over there. You can count on at least another 1,500 or 2,000 off those prices at Dave Smith in Kelloge.

In looking at the Duramax/Allison combo, it looks like you will be out about 4700 to 5000 for the upgrade. Considering you will be able to resell the truck for at least that much more than a gas powered used one, not to mention the savings on fuel and longevity of the powerplant and tranny, it definitely pencils out if you can swing it.

Right off Edmunds.com for a 3500 4x4 Crew LB;

MSRP Invoice /National Base Price

$40,380 /$35,333
Select Options
PDN Heavy Duty Power Package for SRW info

$5,510 /$4,739

Understanding that you are looking at a slightly used vehicle, this info may come in handy while negotiating.

Fyi, I've had 3 Powerstrokes and had good luck with all 3. I never put high mileage on any of them, so I can't really speak to how they hold up over time.

PD

B Run,

The truck granps mentioned was $50k which in 2003 you had to wait almost a month for the truck and could not deal on the price much. I paid My F250 $35k for my V10 with similar options I get 11mpg towing or empty the duro got 17. The resale stayed static meaning however much you paid for the truck new vs gas was the same % at resale. It did not math out.

The bottom line is.....diesels are made to tow. A V-10 is a fart in the wind compared to a diesel. I make just under 24 MPG w/ no load, w/boat 18, w/ boat and camper 15.5 (all highway). Difference in fuel every 10K about $500 in favor of the diesel. Considering a V-10 acutally makes 11 mpg, I'm guessing about 8-9 mph under load.

When towing, a properly maintained diesel may out last a gas vehicle by tow fold. Now do the math.

I did and saved 15K. Which at todays gas prices give me an 82k mile head start on the race:-) I owned the Dodge and the powerstroke before the V-10 great trucks. I only keep them 65k .

If you paid 35,000 for a V-10 Ford you got smoked. If you pay 50,000 for any truck you got smoked and deserve it.

TheKing - In the long run you may end up paying the depreciation of three vehicles compared to my one.

I am not attempting to start an argument just a good debate. I always say, "each to their own" and "different strokes for different folks."

LT

Lunch time. Yes it works better for me with the IRS to own 3. I agree if you plan to keep it fo 200k go with the diesel.

Grandpa,

I haven't heard a bad word about the Duramax- other than the price. I went with the F-350 6L Powerstroke and love it... Didn't go with the fully loaded package because I live off my land. That spells mud! However, I trailer 5 1/2 tons of hay from Napavine once a month. There's a lot of power and torque in this baby! Love the sound of that turbo!

Duramax are a good motor. My guys at the Chevy dealership tell me that after the 100K mile warranty on the engine expires you will want to get rid of the truck because the Duramax will be extremely expensive when it comes to doing repairs.

The more I analyze this the more I lean towards keeping the Suburban which is more than capable of towing my big boat. I have had one problem in 120K miles and that was the fuel pump failure I had on the way to LaPush this summer....Other than that I am about ready for the first tune up and just got a new set of tires after 60K miles...Maybe get one of the other cars back from the kids to drive every day....NOT....

Lunchtime wrote:

"I make just under 24 MPG w/ no load, w/boat 18, w/ boat and camper 15.5 (all highway). "

Is this true or just wishful thinking? If I could really get 22-24 mpg highway with a fullsize diesel pickup, I just may go that route. I've never heard anyone report this kind of "real" mileage. Anyone else? I've heard 15-18, but never a true 20+ mpg.

someone I trust put a computer chip in his Dodge 1 ton diesel and can get up to 20mpg on the highway...norml mpg is 16 -18....towing it drops somewhat

From a strictly pennywise standpoint I keep the Suburban and get it detailed like new, add the DVD and satellite radio....save about $30k and pay at the pump for a couple more years

Stay away from car lots!!!

...and if you run a "super" synthetic oil add another 1 or 2 MPG

If you put a camper shell on a Dodge, you can get an honest 20 unloaded. No Ford or Chevy can do that... 16-18 tops... the 24 MPG story is just that. Funny, this tread has brought out a lot of storys.... Like the 50,000 dollar truck. I could make an awsume living just selling you guys trucks... Buy low/ sell high or somehing like that.

My chipped F350 crew 4x4 could get between 19-21 on the highway if I kept my foot out of it. I think with a couple additional changes I could squeezed a little more. I got 16 around town fairly easily just by not stomping on it.

If you chip a truck you have just voided your warrenty..... Same if you turn up the boost.

No arguments on that... its a fact. Also, did you pay 50,000 dollars for your F-350 ??? Nice truck by the way.

$50K is a lot of money for a truck! I guess if you can afford it- go for it!

I got nearly all the bells and whistles... sticker price was $39,900. With trade-in I was a hair under $30K.

I have to consider myself lucky with some of the gas mileage figures I am seeing... My trips to Cathlamet this past season had me averaging 20.4 MPG (w/boat)(a light 16'r) from outside the Gig Harbor area.. With a full load of hay (5 1/2 tons), I get 18.1 MPG.

I don't have any "real" distance driving unloaded, so i couldn't give you MPG... I would guess somewhere in the neighborhood of 22-something. My 6L has been great on saving a few bucks...

Is 24 MPG unrealistic? Nah... I think it is very possible... I have heard some folks reaching 26-27 MPG with the power/gear box tweeked out to perfection.

Take your tailgate off for a few more MPG.

B-Run, you are certainly correct about the chip/warranty issue. I used the tuner so I could re-tune it when ever I needed to swing by the dealer for anything (which was only one time I can remember). that, currently, is not traceable in the truck's computer. I paid about 35k for the truck and drove it for a couple years and sold it for 32,500. Considering the tax benefits of writing off mileage, I came out just fine. Haven't heard of the 50k trucks, but when the duramax first came out, dealers might have been asking a huge premium for the first few. I also put a canopy on it which instantly upped the mileage by 1-2 per gallon. Added a k&N filter which helped a bit to. I ran the Delo oil, I think if I had gone to the Mobile 1, it probably would've added more mpg's. I think 24 is doable with a few mods.

Also, the Powerstrokes aren't broken in until they hit about 25,000 miles. Up until then, you haven't seen your best mileage yet.

Thanks to all for the great comments. I called Dave Smith in Idaho and talked to a salesman today. He quoted me on a 2005 Duramax/Allison 2500 SLT Crew Cab with all the accessories except the drop down DVD which the used one I looked had. The DVD option from the factory is $1200 and DS offered a better aftermarket version at $1500. The price included a $1500 discount from GMAC if you finance with them at a higher than market rate but you only have to keep the financing in force for three months then you cqan refinance with your bank. The deal also included a $1000 "hold back" discount which he explained is a hidden discount off sticker that the dealers get..this truck has a $1200 hold back. There was also another discount of $500 for whatever...The bottom line was $39,685.00 plus tax and license. That would be a much better deal than buying a 2003 for $36K less a generous trade in.

So at the end of the day I took the sensible road and decided to wait and keep the Suburban and spend a little money to detail it inside and out so it is like new. It is paid for so that is the frugile way to go.The emotional lure of a new truck is strong but I resisted it as I really don't need something new. With diesel at almost $2.50 I would still save money on fuel in the long run but it would take too many years to overcome the depreciation associated with something new or even used.

Grandpa

I've been considering the same truck, but after reading your last post, I think it's better that I hold out as well. Thanks for the words of wisdom... now off to the Koenings meeting in Aberdeen. Report to follow on the other thread.

I hate it when I make rational decisions....Those impulse spending sprees are so fun.

So don't let it stop there Gramps....
Several years ago, faced with a similar temptation I decided to keep my '91 F250SC 4x4 460ci gas hog. Still only has 97k and hauls the camper/pulls the boat just fine. Went shopping for a commuter car and ended up with a used '95 BMW325i (4dr, 5sp) which now has more miles than the truck. I love it. What second car would tempt you? Happy dreaming.

I already have a couple of other vehicles and don't know what I would get for a commuter>

I commute in a '97 Honda Accord. Good gas mileage and pretty much bulletproof.

My big 4X4 truck only sees duty on weekends.