So...

I go to the upper Sky today (not Reiter, so don't ask)...hit some of the deeper spots with my float rod and eggs.

Instant success! Several coho, maybe ten, and a summer run (released)...only one chum (ugly).

No winter runs, so off to another spot.

Instead of my float rod, or my GL3 1024, I grab the rod that I'm supposed to be testing to decide whether or not I want to buy it. It's an 1141c.

Start casting with eggs...and hookups are coming...

First hookup is only ten feet in front of me...bright fish comes up to surface, two slashes, and off.

Winter runs 1, Todd 0.

Ten minutes later, same exact thing happens.

Winter runs 2, Todd 0.

Move downstream a bit...two casts later...

And fish on! This one stays hooked for a pretty long, aerial fight. Looks to be about a ten or twelve pound 3-salt buck...chrome.

Comes off while beaching it...if I had a partner today, I'd be BBQ'g it tonight.

Winter runs 3, Todd 0.

Move down a couple holes, take a few casts, and another slashing rip on the surface...fish off.

Final Tally:

Winter runs 4, Todd 0.

Now, I'm no stranger to bad luck fishing...but this was ridiculous. I've never lost four straight in an hour, with none to the beach.

Here's my excuse...I couldn't get a good hookset with that whippy rod.

Now the one that came off on the beach, that's bad luck...but three that come off within five seconds of being hooked...and I rammed the hook home, lemme tell ya...anyone who's fished with me knows that I can really cross their eyes.

I use Owner cutting points, size 4, no corky, just eggs. These hooks practically set themselves...

On the hookset, the rod feels like I'm fishing with a rubber band...a really long one.

I really like the way the rod casts, and how it feels on the drift, but obviously hooking 1 out of 4 is unacceptable.

If this was way out in the river, I could understand, but these were all less than thirty feet away.

I think I'll just stick with my 1024 for now...to the guy who loaned me the rod to see if I'd like to buy it...

Thanks, but no thanks!

Fish on...

Todd

Sounds like you had a great day, even if you had a tough time landing the brats.

I agree that an 1141 is a poor choice for drift fishing. That rod is really great for free drifting from a sled.

Later!
SA

Todd,
I've got a 13' float rod I play with and my main complaint is it's too soft for hooksets with mono line.

I used it last year and didn't seem to have a problem... and then I remembered that I was using braided on it that time.

I'm with you in I'm not keen on "noodly" rods.

Sorry RP!

I thought you had a sucker!

I feel for you, Ripley. Tough is an understatement! That outright sucks!

Unbuttoned 5 in a row...
Everyone in the boat just kept saying, it's just fishin'. Yeah right!

Hang in there, your day will come again.

Uh, this might be a little on the obvious side, but DUH. Why would anyone in their right mind use an 1141 from the bank and drift fish with it?

I'll use one, if it's the only rod I have, but we tend to leave the 1141's in the boat. If we want to drift fish a light rod, we'll switch to the 1084c.

Yeah, I'm not surprised at all that you got your arse handed to you by lethargic winter runs on a 1141c. If you are relying on the 1141 for you hookset, you are in trouble.

Get the 1084c if you want a light winter run casting rod.....

Jeez Parker! Don't you think the guy took enough of an a$$whoopin' already? No mercy!

But wait.... he's a lawyer right? You're forgiven.

Sorry Todd... couldn't resist!

Parker, maybe you can send him some Ultimate Egg Cure as a consolation prize. I see it went commercial this month.... mini test market on steelheader.net.

I was afraid of it working just as it did...hence, the "try it before you buy it" deal that I made with its owner.

I'm thinking about building a rod for myself for Christmas, and a 1084, or a 1083 if I can find a blank I like, is exactly what I'm thinking about.

As far as the UEC goes, I'm happy with my own home brew...you guys can have all the "best bait fish offs" you want...I'll be the guy upstream catching my own fish!

Fish on...

Todd

Let's see, caught 11 fish, had four more one, decent weather, doesn't sound like you were being crowded, on a day when I had to work, and you want SYMPATHY!?!?! :rolleyes:

Does sound frustrating, though. Also highly motivating, given that we're launching at 8:00am tomorrow...

No sympathy needed here!

Just a little self-absorbed venting!

The summer run was in pretty decent shape...a buck of about eight pounds.

One of the silvers was a solid sixteen or seventeen pounds...a hen at that! A little too red to haul back to the truck, but don't think I didn't contemplate it.

*visions of three pounds of steelhead bait danced in his head*

Most of the silvers were very decent...one of the bucks was getting a little scabby, and the rest of the bucks were rocket red...but full of vim and vigor, to say the least!

The hens were all worth catching, if not as lively as the big bucks were.

The winter runs were quite lively, putting on surface shows even in the brief battles...the one that I actually had hooked got up out of the water several times, and I was fishing in full sunlight by then, so it was quite a flashy show.

Sure would have liked to punch a couple more on my card, though...the one I had to the bank already had his dance card filled for Sunday night, as we have dinner guests...I was picturing him on the BBQ!

Don't count your dinners before they're bonked!

Fish on...

Todd

P.S. Good luck tomorrow, Silver...the Sultan was puking bad, and the main river was very pretty above it...not too bad below in Monroe, but pretty tough looking just down from Sultan.

I feel your pain Todd. I slipped out for a couple of hours today and fished the Sky below Monroe. Went 0 for 2 on jig & shrimp. 1 was jumping all over the place and just as he settled down a bit, off he came. Lost the other strike as I was talking to a guy who was using a centerpin reel. While I was flapping my jaws I felt a tug, looked up and saw my float flat just under the surface and a fish just starting to twist and roll.

Sounds like a tough night Todd. That rod is tough to really put it to a fish with, I have seen them snapped in two on the hookset.

To the owner of the 1141, if it is still for sale, PM ME!

Todd,
I saw that rod in the classifieds a few weeks back and it sounds really nice.
I would only use it from a boat, though.
I know that most use 1141's boondogging but I don't like using spinning reels and thought about setting up that rod with 8lb line on a Curado BSF for boodogging so that everyone had same rod/line/weight setup.
Not to hijack Todd's thread but any comments about the feasiblity of that setup?
PS...thinking about selling a 1084IMX.....

The 1141 *is* primarily a side-drifting rod. Used as such, the boat is moving away from the fish during hookset which helps tighten up slack line for an effective set.

I've used mine as a bank rod at times, and there is a definate trick to setting the hook. You must reel down on a tight line and try to break the SOB at the cork, and I'm not kidding. Small cutting point hooks are also a must: Number 4's are perfect and absoulutely no larger than number 1's.

P.S. I went 7 & 0 one summer before things turned in my favor. It do suck.

You really want the 1141s over the 1141c when it comes to boondogging.

I am *really* good with a casting rod/reel, but when it comes to light boondogging gear, the spinning set up is the only way to go. You have much more control and accuracey of your casts with a spinning rod over a baitcaster.

Add to that 3 or 4 people in a sled, and good luck trying to get everyone to cast in the same place, direction, etc.

The key to boondogging (besides having the skipper know how to correctly run the boat), is to get 3-4 IDENTICAL setups, all cast to the same area, but running on different lines. You want that wall of bait to sweep through a run.

I've put in way too many hours with random people who insist on using a casting setup for boondoggin. Never works. All it takes is one birdsnest, one short cast, one goof, and the run is shot.

Also, you hold a spinning rod much different in your hands than you do a casting rod. The spinning rod basically becomes an extension of your arm - which is a good thing when the 1141 starts to load up on a fish. Your whole arm and body feels the rod loading up, and the hookset is automatic and forceful.

Try doing that with a casting rod, and you'll see that you grab the rod differently, usually holding the rod tip up high (drift fishing), and are waiting for a different type of bite. - a more aggressive "tap tap tap" over the loading up of fish.

Maybe it's just me....but casting rods have their place, and that is usually on the shore, drift fishing, fishing spoons, spinners, floats, but not out in a boat boondoggin or side drifting.

Not saying you can't do it, but IMO, the spinning rod is the much better choice while in a boat.

I personally don't see the reason for a 1141c. Seems rather pointless and silly to me.

Ditto.


Ditto^3

I think Todd should be using CND 1308!

"You have much more control and accuracey of your casts with a spinning rod over a baitcaster."

For people who aren't very good casters, or if you have a boat full of people side drifting who aren't all of fairly equal (and very proficent) ability at casting...perhaps.

The danger of a poor cast screwing with the set up of the boat is dependent on the caster, not the reel.

However, if anyone gets a backlash, it's done, and that problem is minimized with a spinning reel.

But generally speaking, baitcasting is much more accurate, and no way does a spinning reel have more control than does a baitcaster.

With a baitcaster you have pinpoint line control, you can control how much "belly" is purposely cast into the line much easier, and you can literally "cast around corners" with a baitcaster, and casting distance control is a brush of the thumb away.

I find that spinning rods are best for 1. rookies (no annoying backlashes), and 2. casting very light packages, like a small float and jig with no additional weight, or free drifting small egg clusters, or driftfishing a fly with a few split shot, no float jigging for coho/pinks, or 3. fishing in very confined areas where your backcast room is very limited, or non-existent.

And that's just the casting part...even with the great strides in design and engineering of spinning reels over the last decade, good casting reels have better drags, much better line capacity, and hands down are better in every way for float fishing (except for the above example of a very light jig, float, and no weight).

Float fishing, you can let out line at precisely the rate you want, have exactly NO slack in the belly, and clamp with your thumb and set the hook at a moment's notice. They also handle braided line much better (and anyone who has yet to discover the virtues of braided line when float fishing really, really needs to...it's the most revolutionary advance in float fishing since the long rod).

Spinning reels, of course, are much easier to master...but won't get you nearly as far as being proficient with a bait caster. I learned to cast as a young buck with a bait caster, and it's one of the best things I could have done for myself as a young steelheader...


Fish on...

Todd

P.S.

Homer, I couldn't possibly use that rod...how could I wave to my friends and flip off the sledders if I had to use two hands to cast?

Todd responded

But generally speaking, baitcasting is much more accurate, and no way does a spinning reel have more control than does a baitcaster.

With a baitcaster you have pinpoint line control, you can control how much "belly" is purposely cast into the line much easier, and you can literally "cast around corners" with a baitcaster, and casting distance control is a brush of the thumb away.

I find that spinning rods are best for 1. rookies (no annoying backlashes), and 2. casting very light packages, like a small float and jig with no additional weight, or free drifting small egg clusters, or driftfishing a fly with a few split shot, no float jigging for coho/pinks, or 3. fishing in very confined areas where your backcast room is very limited, or non-existent.

And that's just the casting part...even with the great strides in design and engineering of spinning reels over the last decade, good casting reels have better drags, much better line capacity, and hands down are better in every way for float fishing (except for the above example of a very light jig, float, and no weight).

Float fishing, you can let out line at precisely the rate you want, have exactly NO slack in the belly, and clamp with your thumb and set the hook at a moment's notice. They also handle braided line much better (and anyone who has yet to discover the virtues of braided line when float fishing really, really needs to...it's the most revolutionary advance in float fishing since the long rod).

Spinning reels, of course, are much easier to master...but won't get you nearly as far as being proficient with a bait caster. I learned to cast as a young buck with a bait caster, and it's one of the best things I could have done for myself as a young steelheader...


This is exactly right and the very reason for my interest in an 1141c.
Thanks, Todd and good luck.

spinning is not more accurate than casting generally,but with light set ups ,spinning is much more accurate

You simply cannot cast a three or four bee-bee side-drifting slinky far enough---accuracy aside---with a bait casting reel. Baitcasters are the WRONG equipment application for side-drifting, bottom line. Put sacred preference for baitcasters aside and try a spinning reel for one season and you *will* understand.

One more thing...

There's side drifting, and there's side drifting.

If you are fishing 100 yard runs on the Sky, Cowlitz, or Lewis, or something like that, then all of the "concerted effort" issues come into play, along with the relative abilities of the multiple casters, the abilities of the guy running the kicker, etc.

If you are side drifting the Sauk (one of my favorite things to do), then you are pitching pink worms with heavy weights twenty feet into bucket size holes in log jams, hitting the bottom, and jigging it out in a way that would make Jimmy Houston proud...while the man on the oars is expertly holding, slipping, and sliding back and forth.

A couple spinning reels would have you decorating the trees like a pack of five year olds at Christmas!

There's also steelhead fishing, and there's steelhead fishing...

There's stalking the banks of pretty little rivers, stealing fish from little pockets and seams that would make the Artful Dodger of Dickens fame blush with humility.

There's floating a rough and tumble river in a drift boat, sneaking up on wildlife and landing fish on gravel bars that haven't seen the foot of a man that didn't get out of drift boat for decades.

Then there's ripping up and down long runs in a sled, like last minute shopping at a grocery store on Thanksgiving morning, in a boat that looks like a spy satellite with twelve antennae, taking fish off the conveyor belt at the end of the factory assembly line.

Connect the dots as to which rods work better for each situation, and you'll discover another clue as to why I prefer baitcasters!



Merry Christmas, everyone!

Fish on...

Todd

See Todd a 1307 or 1308 would work just fine!

Todd,
I like it. I can tell you put some thought into your side drifting post. Nice.

I have not typed any thing in this site in a while but this thread needs a answer

I learned to fish for trout in small streams with spinning rods as a kid with two grandfathers, also flyfishing. I can cast in to small pockets of water behind trees and logjams and around corners, ever under brush hanging over the bank. casting rods were for trolling from boats becouse no one can cast with the damm things. it was not until i moved to texas and bass fishing that i even concidered buying a casting reel. I tried to learn that thing for two months and then threw it in a box. I still have it and only use it for trolling for trout with down riggers.

It was not until i moved here three years ago that i started using a casting rod for salmon that i learned to use the damm things. its still hard but iam pretty good with them if i have it set right and thats the key to sucess with casting reels.

its a matter of what you grew up with and what are you doing with it. I would never fish spoons with any thing but a spinning rod,. I am just not good enough with a casting reel to do it. and any one that thinks a spinning rod is easy to master is dead wrong , its just easy to learn, not master.

nonsense! I use a baitcaster for every possible scenario, including the lightest of lead. I wouldn't be caught dead using a spinner, and I have absolutely no trouble with accuracy or distance. I feel like such a gomer using a spinning reel. I can see no reason, under any circumstance, to ever use one (spinning real).

Just my opinion and I hope I didn't offend anybody on Christmas.

ST,
I would never fish spoons with anything but a baitcaster. It is the only way I can get the spoon to "flutter" downriver. It's sort of like flying a kite upside down. If casting BC steel's or lil' Cleo's you may want to revisit the baitcaster. You will be able to extend your drift by thumbing the reel and maintain that lovely dancing thumping action. I can use either a spinning rod or a baitcaster in most situations but when spoon fishing I must have a baitcaster. I would agree that both are easy to learn but difficult to master.

I to let the spoon fluter and allow more line to come off the reel with my fingers. like i said you can do it with a bait caster becouse you learned with it. i can do the same with a spinning rod becouse thats what everyone i grew up with did. its easy to learn either reel but hard to master either reel. one is not better then the other.

Confidence is the #1 thing. I'm glad it works for you! I've never mastered the open bail finger thing.

the rod is still for sale.

btw-I've used that rod for a years now and have had no issue hooking and landing plenty of steelhead with it...all from the bank...on hook size 2 through 8 n.s. black gami's.

I hate to sell the rod and wont be disapointed if nobody picks it up but I've used it once in the past year and dont see myself using it anytime soon as I just dont fish terminal tackle all the much anymore (a few times a year).