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#272755 - 09/27/04 05:07 PM Do you feel a draft?
Sky-Guy Offline
The Tide changed

Registered: 08/31/00
Posts: 7083
Loc: Everett
Do you any have children? Planning on having any?

If so, read on:

Mandatory draft for boys and girls (ages 18-26) starting June 15,
2005, is something that everyone should know about. This literally
effects everyone since we all have or know children that will have
to go if this bill passes.

There is pending legislation in the house and senate (twin
bills:
S89 and HR 163) which will time the program's initiation so the draft can begin as early as spring, 2005, just after the 2004 presidential election. The administration is quietly trying to get these bills
passed now, while the public's attention is on the elections, so our action on this is needed immediately. Details and links follow.

This plan, among other things, eliminates higher education as a shelter
and includes women in the draft. Also, crossing into Canada has
already been made very difficult.

Actions:
Please send this on to all the parents and teachers you know, and
all the aunts and uncles, grandparents, godparents . . . And le! t
your children know - - it's their future, and they can be a powerful voice for change!

This legislation is called HR 163 and can be found in detail at
this website: http://thomas.loc.gov/ Just enter in "HR 163" and click
search and will bring up the bill for you to read.

It is less than two pages long. If this bill passes, it will
include all men and ALL WOMEN from ages 18 - 26 in a draft for military
action. In addition, college will no longer be an option for avoiding
the draft and they will be signing an agreement with Canada which
will no longer permit anyone attempting to dodge the draft to stay
within it's borders. This bill also includes the extension of
military service for all those that are currently active.

If you go to the selective service web site and read their 2004
FYI Goals you will see that the reasoning for this is to increase the
size of the! military in case of terrorism.

This is a critical piece of legislation, this will effect our
undergraduates, our children and our grandchildren. Please take
the time to write your congressman and let them know how you feel
about this legislation. http://www.house.gov http://www.senate.gov

Please also write to your representatives and ask them why they
aren't telling their constituents about these bills and write to
newspapers and other media outlets to ask them why they're not
covering this important story.

The draft $28 million has been added to the 2004 selective service
system budget to prepare for a military draft that could start as
early as June 15, 2005. Selective service must report to Bush on
March 31, 2005, that the system, which has lain dormant for
decades, is ready for activation.
Please see http://www.sss.gov/perfplan_fy2004.html
to view the Selective Service System annual performance plan,
fiscal year 2004.

The pentagon has quietly begun a public campaign to fill all
10,350 draft board positions and 11,070 appeals b! oard slots nationwide.
Though this is an unpopular election year topic, military experts
and influential members of congress are suggesting that if Rumsfeld's
prediction of a "long, hard slog" in Iraq and Afghanistan (and
permanent state of war on terrorism) proves accurate, the US may
have no choice but to draft.

http://www.hslda.org/legislation/national/2003/s89/default.asp entitled the
Universal National service Act of 2003, "to provide for the common
defense by requiring that all young persons (age 18-26) in the
United States, including women, perform a period of military service or a
period of civilian service in furtherance of the national defense
and homeland security, and for other purposes."

These active bills currently sit in the committee on armed
services. Dodging the draft will be more difficult than those from the
Vietnam era. College and Canada will not be options. In December 2001,
Canada and the US signed a "smart border declaration," which could be
used to keep would-be draft dodgers in.

Signed by Canada's minister of foreign affairs, John Manley, and US Homeland Security director, Tom Ridge, the declaration involves a 30-point plan which implements,
among other things, a "pre-clearance agreement" of people entering
and departing each country. Reforms aimed at making the draft more
equitable along gender and class lines ! also eliminates higher
education as a shelter. Underclassmen would only be able to
postpone service until the end of their current semester. Seniors would
have until the end of the academic year.

What to do:

Tell your friends Contact your legislators and ask them to oppose these bills. Just
type "congress" into the AOL search engine and input your zip code.

A list of your reps will pop up with a way to email them directly.
We can't just sit and pretend that by ignoring it, it will go away.
We must voice our concerns and create the world we want to live in for our children and grandchildren.
_________________________
You know something bad is going to happen when you hear..."Hey, hold my beer and watch this"

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#272756 - 09/27/04 05:30 PM Re: Do you feel a draft?
Theking Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 4756
Loc: The right side of the line
looks like paranoia from liberal teachers.

Lets say it is going to happen.

So we should oppose a draft because our kids might be called upon to do what millions have done in the past? Defending the country is not worth it?
_________________________
Liberalism is a mental illness!

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#272757 - 09/27/04 06:28 PM Re: Do you feel a draft?
Rory Bellows Offline
Three Time Spawner

Registered: 09/11/03
Posts: 1459
Loc: Third stone from the sun
Sky-guy,

You should have noted in your post that the bill(s) being introduced to re-institute the draft were written and submitted by DEMOCRATIC representatives (D-Charlie Rangle and the Michael Moores favorite D. senator from N. Dakota).

That's kind of an important fact to keep in mind when the author of your post falsley suggests that the 'White House is trying to sneak this legislation through'.

Those on the left are floating this E-mail and rumor that the White House is behind these bill(s) to needlessly scare and fool easily manipulated people (apparently with some succses), when actually it's just a Democratic bill and trick.

Also, it should be noted that the 28 million that was 'added' to selective service is just a play on words---that's their annual budget and has been for years.

Was this piece put together by someone at CBS or the Kerry campaign?

As recent 'uncovered documents' have taught us--you can't believe everything you read.
_________________________
"Yes, I would support raising taxes"--Kanektok Kid

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#272758 - 09/27/04 07:19 PM Re: Do you feel a draft?
kjackson Offline
Spawner

Registered: 06/12/01
Posts: 557
Loc: Port Townend, WA
Here's an article I posted in the "drafted" thread last weekend. It speaks to the e-mail you received specifically and addresses some of the points made in what you posted.

Keith


Saturday, September 25, 2004 - Page updated at 12:00 A.M.

Fears of draft reinstatement persist despite official denials

By Wayne Woolley
Newhouse News Service
NEWARK, N.J. — The phones at the Selective Service System ring more frequently these days. Some callers are nothing short of hysterical.

Officials at the federal agency that would be responsible for running any future military draft say they have been receiving thousands of calls in recent months from people who are under the impression that mandatory conscription is imminent for men and women ages 18 to 26.

Janice Hughes, a public- and intergovernmental-affairs specialist with the agency, fielded one call from an American woman calling from Italy on a cellphone. "She heard there would be a draft of women, and she didn't want to come back," Hughes said.

Hughes gave her stock reply: "It's not true. We would know."

The calls keep coming even after repeated assurances from the White House, the Pentagon and Capitol Hill that there is no desire, need or plan for a draft.

That may be because fears the draft will be resurrected after 31 years of dormancy continue to be stoked in Internet chat rooms and chain e-mails. Most recently, on the presidential-campaign trail, surrogates of Democratic candidate John Kerry — former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean and former Georgia Sen. Max Cleland — suggested the possibility of a draft if President Bush wins a second term.

At a campaign appearance in Oregon last week, Vice President Dick Cheney said the all-volunteer military remains America's best option and it would take a crisis "on the scale of World War II before I would think that anybody would seriously contemplate the possibility of going back again to the draft."

Kerry flatly opposed a military draft at a campaign stop Wednesday in Florida.

The Vietnam-era draft ended in 1973. The Selective Service System was created in 1980 to keep a database of men ages 18 to 26 in the event of a future draft. Women are not eligible to be drafted under current law.

Barry Zellen, 41, a Boston technical writer who created the Web site StopTheDraft.com in 1999, has watched visits to his site rise. But he gives little credence to current rumors that the government will restart the draft on June 15, 2005.

"The Internet is helping propagate the myth that there is a secret government plan," Zellen said.

The first catalyst came in January 2003, when Rep. Charles Rangel, D-N.Y., and Sen. Ernest Hollings, D-S.C., introduced separate bills calling for draft-age men and women to perform military or civilian government service.

Rep. Jim McDermott of Seattle, one of four Democratic co-sponsors of Rangel's bill, introduced before the March 2003 invasion of Iraq, said the legislation was intended to ensure that the burden of military service is not borne disproportionately by the poor and some minority groups.

"I believe that if those who are pushing for war knew that their children might be required to share the burden of that war, there might be a greater willingness to work toward peace and a diplomatic solution," McDermott said at the time. "If, despite our best efforts, we end up in armed conflict, then fairness dictates that the sons and daughters of all classes participate."

Rangel and Hollings also were vocal opponents of the Iraq war, and both conceded that neither bill had a chance of coming to a vote in the Republican-controlled Congress.

The second catalyst came less than a year ago when the Selective Service System issued a call for volunteers to fill vacancies on local draft boards.

Richard Flahavan, a spokesman for the Selective Service System, said the people propagating the rumors apparently didn't realize that local draft boards have been in place since 1980 — and the roughly 10,000 board members serve 20-year terms, which have expired.

Flahavan said the draft warnings also cite inaccurate government figures. Most of the Internet draft warnings say $28 million has "been added" to the Selective Service System budget this year. That figure actually was the total budget the agency requested this year. Congress approved a $26 million budget.

Most e-mails warning of impending conscription begin with the words: "Mandatory draft for boys and girls (age 18-26) starting June 15, 2005, is something that everyone should know about."

Even members of peace-advocacy groups have grown weary of calls about the rumor.

"That e-mail doesn't die. It's got a lot of inaccuracies in it," said Bill Galvin, a counseling coordinator with the Center on Conscience and War, a conscientious-objectors organization in Washington. "We're getting so tired of answering questions about the stupid thing."

That doesn't mean Galvin is unconcerned that a draft might be a possibility, but he doesn't believe it would unfold in the way Internet rumors predict.

Still, unease persists on college campuses, which have been blanketed by e-mails warning about the draft.

At Rutgers University, Newark, Eugene Heimur said his mother read the e-mail.

"She freaked out," said Heimur, 19, of Rutherford, N.J. "She told me I could get drafted and I was like, 'Are you serious?' It's crazy."

Kenneth Campbell, a University of Delaware political-science professor who served as a combat Marine in Vietnam, said college students would weigh heavily in any political calculus of reinstating a draft.

"A draft would create a firestorm. These campuses would explode," he said. "That's what's kept a lot of kids quiet about Iraq. They weren't under the gun."

Details on McDermott were provided by the House Web site (www.house.gov).

Copyright © 2004 The Seattle Times Company

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#272759 - 09/27/04 08:26 PM Re: Do you feel a draft?
grandpa Offline
Three Time Spawner

Registered: 08/18/02
Posts: 1714
Loc: brier,wa
The draft legislation is a Democrat show all the way. I think it is purely a partisan attempt to toss this out and then blame the president. Typical phony crap we have come to expect from the democratic party of 2004.
_________________________
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www.pugetsoundanglers.org

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#272760 - 09/27/04 10:25 PM Re: Do you feel a draft?
stlhd_dreaming Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 04/07/04
Posts: 393
Loc: maine
Oh Man how much more do we have to listen to you grandpa You are not impressing me with the knowledge you think you have oh my god
_________________________
Just remember that people are giving there lives over seas when you start bickering about a photo of a fish out of water !!!!!!

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#272761 - 09/28/04 01:19 AM Re: Do you feel a draft?
Fisherdan Offline
Juvenille at Sea

Registered: 12/12/00
Posts: 186
Loc: Auburn, Wa, USA
Sky-Guy,

I appreciate your posts, especially on the fishing board, but you've been duped on this one.

Look at the sponsors. The sponsor (Rangel) is a far left Democrat, and all 14 co-sponsors are Democrats. In the house, it reads like a who's who of the liberal far left. Rangel, Conyers and McDermott.....Hastings, Jackson-Lee, Jackson, etc.

In the senate, it was introduced by Fritz Hollings, again a far left Dem with no cosponsors at all. Zero. Nada. Zilch.

You can't stop these guys from introducing legislation, but nderstand that neither the administration nor the DoD asked for this. If Bush and pals wanted the draft, they sure wouldn't have asked Rangel to submit it....

This thing is obviously partisan politics (not that my party would be above partisan politics, but that's another matter).

I guess the bottom line if you fear the draft is: VOTE REPUBLICAN because it's the Democrats that are trying to re-instate it.....
_________________________
Thanks,

Fisherdan

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#272762 - 09/28/04 11:18 AM Re: Do you feel a draft?
John Lee Hookum Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/12/01
Posts: 2453
Loc: Area 51
I think a draft would be a good way to help bring in all the Chicken Hawks that refuse to serve, while advocating that others continue to take the risks in an un-necessary War. It is sure to help the hollier than thou Chicken Hawks of this board to rethink and enlist. Chicken hawks take a look at the following and put your actions to your words. Love this war, then go enlist. The article speaks for itself.
-----------------------------------------------------------

Updated: 10:28 AM EDT
Former Soldiers Slow to Report
500 Ready Reservists Seek Exemptions From Reactivation, Risk AWOL Status

By Tom Squitieri, USA TODAY

(Sept. 28) - Fewer than two-thirds of the former soldiers being reactivated for duty in Iraq and elsewhere have reported on time, prompting the Army to threaten some with punishment for desertion.

The former soldiers, part of what is known as the Individual Ready Reserve (IRR), are being recalled to fill shortages in skills needed for the conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Of the 1,662 ready reservists ordered to report to Fort Jackson, S.C., by Sept. 22, only 1,038 had done so, the Army said Monday. About 500 of those who failed to report have requested exemptions on health or personal grounds.

"The numbers did not look good," said Lt. Col. Burton Masters, a spokesman for the Army's Human Resources Command. "We are tightening the system, reaching the people and bringing them in."

Masters said most of the requests for exemptions are likely to be denied: "To get an exemption, it has to be a very compelling case, such as a severe medical condition."

The figures are the first on the IRR call-up. They reflect the challenges the Pentagon faces in trying to find enough troops for ongoing operations and show resistance among some servicemembers who returned to civilian life.

The ready reserve is an infrequently used pool of former soldiers who can be called to duty in a national emergency or war. On June 29, the Army announced it would call 5,674 members of its IRR back to active duty this year and next.

Several of those who received recall notices have already been declared AWOL (absent without official leave) and technically are considered deserters. "We are not in a rush to put someone in the AWOL category," Masters said. "We contact them and convince them it is in their best interests to show up. If you are a deserter, it can affect you the rest of your life."

Fourteen people were listed as AWOL last week; six subsequently told the Army they would report. Punishment for being AWOL is up to the unit commander and can include prison time and dishonorable discharge, said Col. Joseph Curtin, an Army spokesman.

With a force that generals say is stretched thin, the Army is considering $1,000-a-month bonuses to ex-soldiers who volunteer to return for overseas duty.

Ready reservists are soldiers who were honorably discharged after finishing their active-duty tours, usually four to six years, but remain part of the IRR for the rest of their original eight-year commitment. The IRR call-up is the first major one in 13 years, since 20,277 troops were ordered back for the Persian Gulf War.

09/28/2004 07:04

? Copyright 2004 USA TODAY, a division of Gannett Co. Inc. All Rights Reserved.
_________________________

Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of
Truth and Knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter
of the gods.

-- Albert Einstein



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#272763 - 09/29/04 09:33 AM Re: Do you feel a draft?
B-RUN STEELY Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 02/08/00
Posts: 3233
Loc: IDAHO
Chickin hawks !!! thats too funny. Just an observation but there is a large segment of the populaton that falls into that catagory. A lot of young people I know are very much for the war in Iraq. These same people have never been in the service, have never had anyone close to them killed or wounded, have never had to deal with anything more unpleasant than say a mean gym teacher in their young lives. They really like to throw the word "WE" around... We should do this, we should do that. At the same time, they sit in their little cubicle with the college education that their parents paid for while having no concept that they get paid right out of school about the same amount as the avg Major in the Army or Marines makes with 15 years in service ( who also has a college education)...

As a veteran, I see nothing wrong with the draft. I do have a problem with little arm chair quarterbacks who have big opinions on issues while they have no first hand concept of the conciquences...

Paris Hilton... How would that Ho get out of it ??? Don't go to school, does not have a job ??? Sounds like a perfect candidate to me.
_________________________
Clearwater/Salmon Super Freak

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#272764 - 09/29/04 02:26 PM Re: Do you feel a draft?
Rory Bellows Offline
Three Time Spawner

Registered: 09/11/03
Posts: 1459
Loc: Third stone from the sun
Ratherbiased.com (whose site is down now) and Little Green Footballs detail how CBS News last night used discredited documents to attack President Bush:

In a story that was a textbook example of slipshod reporting, CBS reporter Richard Schlesinger used debunked internet hoax emails and an unlabeled interest group member to scare viewers into believing that the U.S. government is poised to resume the draft. At the center of Schlesinger's piece was a woman named Beverly Cocco, a Philadelphia woman who is 'sick to my stomach' that her two sons might be drafted. In his report, Schlesinger claimed that Cocco was a Republican and portrayed her as an apolitical (even Republican) mom worried about the future. Schlesinger did not disclose that Cocco is a chapter president of an advocacy group called People Against the Draft (PAD) which, in addition to opposing any federal conscription, seeks to establish a 'peaceful, rational foreign policy' by bringing all U.S. troops out of Iraq. Like Schlesinger's Cocco, the group portrays itself as 'nonpartisan' although its leadership seems to be entirely bereft of any Republicans. The group's domain is registered to a man named Jacob Levich, a left-wing activist who in a 2001 essay compared the Bush Administration to the totalitarian government portrayed in George Orwell's 1984. CBS News also reported that there are two bills in Congress to reinstate the draft, but failed to mention that they were both introduced by Democrats
_________________________
"Yes, I would support raising taxes"--Kanektok Kid

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#272765 - 09/29/04 04:48 PM Re: Do you feel a draft?
John Lee Hookum Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/12/01
Posts: 2453
Loc: Area 51
Quote:
Originally posted by B-RUN STEELY:
Chickin hawks !!! thats too funny. Just an observation but there is a large segment of the populaton that falls into that catagory. A lot of young people I know are very much for the war in Iraq. These same people have never been in the service, have never had anyone close to them killed or wounded, have never had to deal with anything more unpleasant than say a mean gym teacher in their young lives. They really like to throw the word "WE" around... We should do this, we should do that. At the same time, they sit in their little cubicle with the college education that their parents paid for while having no concept that they get paid right out of school about the same amount as the avg Major in the Army or Marines makes with 15 years in service ( who also has a college education)...

As a veteran, I see nothing wrong with the draft. I do have a problem with little arm chair quarterbacks who have big opinions on issues while they have no first hand concept of the conciquences...

Paris Hilton... How would that Ho get out of it ??? Don't go to school, does not have a job ??? Sounds like a perfect candidate to me.
-----------------------------------------------------------


That is true in so many ways. \:D
_________________________

Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of
Truth and Knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter
of the gods.

-- Albert Einstein



Top
#272766 - 09/29/04 05:24 PM Re: Do you feel a draft?
Theking Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 4756
Loc: The right side of the line
JLH,

Maybe this will help you.

Man-shaped pillow for solo sleeper
By Kaori Hitomi in Nagareyama, Japan
29sep04
AFTER a long night at work as a radio DJ, Junko Suzuki likes to snuggle at bedtime - and she says she's found the perfect partner: a man-shaped pillow.

Linen maker Kameo Corp.'s new "Boyfriend's Arm Pillow" - which consists of a headless torso and a stuffed arm that curls around the sleeper - might make some people uneasy.

But not Ms Suzuki, or about 1000 others in Japan who have bought the pillow, which Kameo says is the first of its kind. The product went on the market last December.

"I like to sleep holding someone's hand," Ms Suzuki, 34. "And this pillow makes me feel relaxed because I can hold the arm and feel something warm at my side."

Kameo, based in the southern Japanese city of Fukuoka, says the pillow is not only an emotional comfort, but that its shape keeps the body balanced by supporting the sleeper from both sides.

Sleepers typically curl up in between the body of the pillow and the crooked arm, with the sleeper's head resting on the pillow's "bicep."

"My grandmother used to say that there is nothing more comfortable pillow than human," Kameo President Tomoki Kakehashi said. "So, I thought that maybe women would want to sleep on an arm-shaped pillow."

The pillow is only on sale in Japan, where customers can buy one for Y8500 ($106.8). Covered in a shirt-shaped pillow cover, it comes in blue, pink or green.

For Ms Suzuki, who is estranged from her husband, the pillow has definite advantages: It doesn't squirm or thrash in the night, and you know it'll be there in the morning.

"It keeps holding me all the way through," she said in her home outside of Tokyo. "I think this is great because this does not betray me."

One-size pillows do not fit all.

So Kameo is working up new models: muscular pillows for sleepers who like their pillows well-built; slender models for those after a more sensitive, vulnerable partner.

The company also has a prototype for its next big project: a female pillow for men. This one will be shaped like a woman's lap, with a "skirt" cover.

"I always thought someone's lap would the best pillow for me," Mr Kakehashi said.
_________________________
Liberalism is a mental illness!

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#272767 - 09/29/04 07:26 PM Re: Do you feel a draft?
John Lee Hookum Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/12/01
Posts: 2453
Loc: Area 51
Elvis, you can do whatever you want to do in your bedroom, but please don't do it in the streets and frighten the horses. \:D
_________________________

Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of
Truth and Knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter
of the gods.

-- Albert Einstein



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