Aw Vince. You are making me blush! I kope I can shake that image soon. Now if we only knew more about your memory and abrasion resistance . . .

Snake: Remember when this thread strted I said many guys don't care about facts - they will stick with what they always use. Thanks for prooving me right.

Bro-sierre? Great work, VHawk. You confirmed what I knew about my line, but will try others. What's great about what you did is you're sponsored by "NO ONE". ...... You suppose if I go around to all the breweries and ask for a sample in the name of research they'd comply?

Dave,

I had the same impression, but actually have been surprised/impressed at the number of cultists who were willing to give something new a try. And yes, there will be some folks who refuse to even try something new, regardless of any evidence.



Snake,

I've said if you don't have problems with breakoff now, don't make any big changes. But I would recommend spooling up a spare baitcaster with PLine xtra, and a spare Spinning outfit with Sufix Elite.

I do highly recommend the use of the palomar knot when possible. I was really surprised at how much better it was versus the Trilene knot, and double clinch.

The Stren xtra is also a good line, but a bit stiffer than the Elite. Probably just as good on a baitcaster though as anything else.

Vhawk

Thanks Vince for the tip on the Elite, I'll probably give that a try. But for my level wind...Max UG, just feels like an old friend. I've always use the "improved double clinch" knot and never break at the knot. I've seen guys try new knots and on their first cast......bye bye lure. It also could have been because they had too many Kokanees.

Snake: I resemble that remark!

I do know what you mean about a certain line that you are comfortable with.

As far as line and preferences it can be a personal thing. My friend Clint, who is one of the best anglers I know, absolutely loves Stren Clear Blue Fluorescent. I try to bring him some whenever go up there, as it's hard to find in B.C. Another friend down here absolutely hates the stuff. Go figure?

As far as knots the Palomar is tops. The only problem is trying to tie it when using a big lure or long leader.

VHawk you are a manchild !! I bet you can tie one kicka$$ palomar knot by now, eh?

Some surprises in there and some confirmations. Great work.

I'd suggest to the moderators in this joint to bookmark the first post in this thread. . .I'd wanna reference it many times in the future months/years.

fb

Thanks Vince! Appreciate the research. Next time I see ya I'll buy ya another beer or two.

Oh, has the Troll been banned yet?

hey vince, nice work! if i may be so bold as to make a suggestion for round 2: see if you can get some IGFA class rated line. be curious to see how it stacks up to the ratings and would help to "calibrate" (maybe) your device. if, say a IGFA line @10# class broke at 12# on your device or similar, you could add a correction factor. just a thought.....

thanks for the info!

willy

Not just bold, but brilliant. I wish I had thought of that sooner. I'll be picking up some Seaguar, and if I can find it somewhere, IGFA rated line. Unless someone out there wants to send me some IGFA line. I'd love people to send me small filler spools of whatever
line they want tested. That way as my testing becomes more refined, I'll have samples to go back and retest.

Someone else mentioned to me that even the same line can vary from batch to batch. If I have 2 or 3 samples of the same line, that'll reduce the likelihood of that affecting the results.

I think the real standout was the palomar knot. I never really used it much because it just seemed that a knot so simple couldn't really be that strong. I was a fool. I still am, just now I'm a fool with a stronger knot.

And lastly, how come I don't have a rating for this thread yet? Thats really the only reason I did all this was for those little stars to show up on the topics list. Dang, defeated again.

VHawk


line samples can be sent to

Vince Hawkins
7411 Fairview RD SW #23
Olympia, WA

If your sending something other than a spool, please include full name of the line, when you purchased it, what test its rated at, and the stated diameter.

Thanks VHawk

VHawk, thank you for your efforts, i think we all will be seeing line a little differently. I definitly will be trying some new lines in the very near future. Seems like i will have to relearn the Palamor Knot as well. Oh well, like they say, anything to catch more fish. Your posts are almost always very well written, and usually contribute to the better good of this community. Again thank you.

Vince-
One work....AWESOME!!! I have been using a couple of the lines mentioned in your study and have loved them. I have been using both the Pline Flouroclear, and xtrastrong for a while and have had no problems. I really feel like the xtra-strong stuff is tuffer than Maxima UG of any other line for the matter and your testing proved it. Thanks for all the time that you obviously put into this.
Tim

Good job Vince.

Still only going to use UG - but I said that before you started. I'm just too lazy to change.

I just went out and bought some P-line xtra at the Kennewickd Sportsman's. I'm a fairly dyed in the wool Maxima cultist, however VHawks numbers have me convinced to give the P-Line a go.

I'll probably be sending in a sample of Ande, which is a cheap line that I have used with great success for years. I only use the stuff on species and populations that I don't feel will really test its breaking strength, however I've nailed a few nice steelhead in the 14 to 17 pound range on 12lb test line.

Thanks Vince, excellent work!

If you haven't tried the Palomar knot, you need to do so. I've been using it for the past 6 years or so. A lot easier for my tired eyes to see and when my hands turns to claws due to cold temps I just tie a bigger loop. It makes life on the water a lot easier.

VHawk

I found the fishing magazine that mentioned earlier with the exclusive 20-Pound Line Test. The name of the magazine is "Sports Fishing", October 2001, article by Doug Olander. this link on has a portion of the article but worth a peek. I will provide details that the link don't cover as it is 9 pages in the magazine and it is well done.
http://www.sportfishingmag.com/article.jsp?ID=23589&typeID=347&categoryID=262

The following is the introduction: by Doug Olander

20-Pound Line Test

Our Test of 85 lines rated "20 Pound" reveals surprising results.

Take a llok at most and ad for fishing line or any line manufacturer's Web site. You'll see pretty much the same claims made over and over: Cast father! Better knot strength! Smaller diameter! Strongest monofilament we've ever made! Superior abrasion resistance! Supersoft and limp! and, always, quality!

It's easy to get tangled up in so much rhetoric. But waht does it really mean? Where can an angler go to sort it all out? Nowhere, in fact.

Quite simple, no industry standards exist to help consumers sort the qualities of fishing lines; no laws require manufacturers to reveal and particular products information. Or, put another way, line manufacturers can pretty much make whatever claims they want. Then it becomes caveat emptor, baby - you pays your money and you takes your chances.

But without reliable line-testing machines, educated dicision-making gets pretty dicey for the average fishing-line consumer.

That's why we elected to undertake the most comprehensive line test ever. We chose a common line size useful for many applications - 20-pounds - and subjected 85 different lines to identical testing procedures. We assessed the two parameters we could measure objectively: tensile (break) strength and abrasion strength/resistance, as well as measure the actual diameter of each line with calipers. We also tested for knot strength; the sidebar on page 74 explains why we decided not to publish those findings, In all, we performed nearly 1,200 seperate tests over three long days of testing.

We didn't test limpness or softness: Although these qualities are important to anglers, they're hard to quantify. Moreover, unlike break or abrasion strength, limpness or softness is pretty easy to assess just by the line' feel.

In another post I will add more from the article. If the interest is there, I will type the entire article including the names of the 85 lines tested an all of the results. It will take some time but I can get ur done eventually as time permits.

hey vince,
ifound a thread (not much info tho) of a discussion of IGFA ratings. http://www.igfa.org/board/viewpost.aspx?cat=general&postid=181 i think that ande is supposed to be IGFA rated line. i'll look to see if i can dig up some more info.


willy

Pretty impressive Vhawk. Looking at your logs in the pic just gives me a headache. Glad you did it though. Good info.

I would like to see that myself.-AA

looks like ande, penn and suffix all make igfa rated lines. seems like they all come in spools of about 5000 yards, tho! i think that they have the suffix at tackle direct...pretty cheap for all that line



willy

IGFA will also pretest any line you send them to be sure it breaks under the line class you have in mind. I have a friend who fishes only with Stren. It is NOT an IGFA line per se but he knows what each will break at. i.e. It may say 8lb test, but he know is will brrak at 10 or less. He has a ton of records. His name is RalieghWwerking. I think you can see all the IGFA records online - but it may be you have to be a mamber.