"I did not say it was a "proven" gateway drug, but it's commonly the first drug people start with and then it leads them up to worse drugs. Agreed?"

No, not agreed...I'll be that right now there are way more alcoholics that turned into cokeheads and junkies than there are potheads that have turned into cokeheads and junkies...

People start out with all kinds of different drugs, and I'll guarantee you that drinking in high school causes more addicts and junkies than smoking pot ever has, does, or will...

Fish on...

Todd

FH07,

No, I don't agree either. Tobacco and alcohol are the typical gateway drugs for the vast majority of people.

If you just graduated from high school, you haven't been around for very long. Some of us are 3 times your age, plus or minus, and have seen - and used and abused - a thing or two.

What do you mean by "losing your best friend to weed?" Do you mean that he or she is using it or actually died from it? BTW, last I read on the subject, no one has ever been documented as dying from smoking pot. Not many other drugs you can say that about, including the legal ones.

As you mature and gain a little life experience, and if you do a little research, you'll discover as most of us have that the gov't. screwed up royally by getting its panties all in a wad over pot and catagorizing it in the same class as heroin, which is beyond flat out stupid. But then that's gov't. for ya'.

Please do yourself a favor and research this topic before you jump into a discussion like this again. You'll have a much better time when you're well informed.

Sincerely,

Salmo g.

I think it's more of a problem because it makes certain people violent AND stupid. I'm thinking of the rapes, assaults, and accidents I've seen where alcohol was involved.

I generally don't see people who are placid, flacid, and stupid come into the ER. The trip from the couch to the kitchen is at worst an ultra low impact collision with a wall or door.



On this I think we might find some agreement. It's not so much the drug, as the people who a potential abuser associates. But there's a huge chunk of middle suburban America who are out smoking pot maybe once a month or so. And who are otherwise holding professional career jobs, managers, or such, and who pay their bills, and who attend their kids soccer games and PTA meetings. They smoke, probably the same way you drink. On their own time, and without putting others at risk.



Did he turn into such a pothead you didn't want to hang around with him? I'm guessing it wasn't an overdose. I don't even think it's possible to die of an overdose from MJ. It is probably possible to have a chronic MJ user die because their wife couldn't take their BS anymore and beat them to death. But a direct overdose death, not so likely.

And that whole "the law is the law" thing...LE uses a tremendous amount of discretion over what they decide to enforce, and what they let pass. Although ultimately it's the citizenry that must give the final guidance and mandate through changes in legislation, to those who uphold the law.

I think some changes are long overdue.

Thanks FishHunter for the chance to have a friendly debate on the subject.

VHawk


BTW, Before some jackass complains to the nursing board that I'm always high. I stay clean cause I have to pee in a cup, but more importantly because I don't have desire to blow my free time doing anything other than fishing, playing poker, and making whoppee. Pot is not a performance enhancing drug.

haha i love the legalize the sticky icky vibe im gettin off this thread

think of all the underfunded gov't programs that could benefit by legalizing pot. Education and healthcare come to mind. I'd like to see our tax burden decreased too. I am tird of being taxed to subsidise these programs as well as to pay to house these so called "criminals" that sell dime bags of weed.

More kids at my school smoked the herbs before the cigs.

Plugs up prisons? Really? Nationwide .7% of inmates are in on marijuana possession only. .3% are first timers busted for marijuana only. .3%! hardly a plugging. This is nationwide. I couldnt find stats for Wa. but it would have to be less than that. My experience would tell me that the majority of that .3% is happening in the south and not anywhere on the left coast.

If you are arrested for being in possession of less than 40g in Wa. you are never going to see the inside of a prison. Maybe a day or two after the third or fourth arrest. If you get busted three or four times, you are an idiot and have killed way to many brain cells already and should stop smoking.

I think that Fishhunter meant he lost a friend to weed, from choking on a Pop tart....

Salmo,
By gateway drugs I've been referring to those that are illegal. I haven't been including alcohol and tobacco. I do agree, alcohol has a bigger impact and so does tobacco on our society then weed. I do not disagree there....

Second of all, we are misunderstanding each other and I am well informed of the issue. Please don't say "research it more and you'll have a better time." No one needs that. It's the internet... That's a main problem with this site is that people's ego's are way too big and they put people down to try and act superior...


Losing my friend to weed: No he didn't die, but those facts that no one have died from weed are skewed. That's the "pro-pot" side of the road...

One friend (different one then the lost friend) of mine had a heart attack after smoking some weed. And this happened about a day after he smoked. That was a shock to watch him drop on the ground unconscious at a teriyaki restaraunt after complaining of heartburn and then wake back up 10 seconds later. Sure, it was most likely laced with something, but those sorts of incidents aren't included in those facts, nor are people who have been driving after smoking. That's liking taking all the DUI's out of the alcohol-involved death counts.

The lost friend though, no he didn't die, he became the biggest s**thead you could imagine. 3 years ago we were hanging out every day either playing golfing or fishing and enjoying high school, but shortly after that, weed was introduced to him and he went downhill from there. Fast at that... Soon enough, he started hanging out with shady kids and stealing stuff and breaking into houses and what not. Not to mention blowing us off after we tried to hang out with him. Most of the time he blew us off to go make a few bills by dealing weed instead of going through with his prior plans which were us. We would be like "Where are you man we were supposed to chill today???" His response: "Nah man I had to make a deal man I made a couple hundred on this one man you understand me right?" And I can't imagine how many times he pulled the "Im done with weed" card and tried to get back on our good side.....He's also never done anything worse then weed. So you can't say he's a cokehead or methhead...

Not cool in my opinion...

If you have a problem with the government spending so much time and money on trying to get rid of pot, I'd suggest taking political action about it...Complaining about it is one thing, doing something about it is another. I do not know if you have taken any action about trying to change it, so I can't say your only complaining...If you are complaining and acting on it, then that's completely ok, cause your fighing for something.

So that makes 1% of inmates in prison because of marijuana? Assuming that those facts are true, that is hardly a problem...

I was saying that if only 1% of inmates are in for weed, then that's not a problem, referring to the inmates plugging up prisons...


About the kid who had the heart attack: He stopped right after that. After having his life like that on the line, he quit it. Didn't even do it much. Occasionally at parties and such. Guess where he got that from? The pothead "lost" friend...

That kid didn't do anything else. I've heard from all his shady friends that all he would do was weed...

Anyways, I'm not saying that the responsible users of weed are the problem in our community. It's the guys filtering it into schools. I've heard of plenty of adults who do some occasionally tree blowing and are successfull, responsible, people...

FH07,

Usually I'm all about the internet research thing, but in this case your experience over the next 10 years of your career will probably push your thinking on this one closer to the guys on the board who are flipping you sh.et about this.

We don't agree on this issue, but good job keeping your cool. Maybe we'll revisit this argument again in 5 years.

Peace...

VHawk

Sorry to hear you lost your friend. I too lost my best friend and roomate to alcohol and cocaine. One night after returning from the bar very drunk he couldn't get a hold of his dealer so he stuck a 9mm in his mouth and pulled the trigger. I saw the mess and had to call the cops.

Your argument sucks!

Some of us would be a danger to society WITHOUT weed.

When someone refers to "losing a friend to drugs" it doesn't mean they quit hanging out with them because they became total losers, it means the fu*ker died from an overdose, burned to death in a Methlab explosion, tried to rip off the wrong mofo's, got loaded and drove, got popped by Dudley Doright and got azz-punked to death in prison, had a psychotic episode and ate a bullet, or got some nasty infection from a needle they found in a wastebasket.

If losing a friend to dope only meant they turned into total losers then I could say 98% of my high school class was "lost" to dope.

By the way the aforementionned scenarios all happened to people I was aquainted with.
Oh yeah, one more thing: Comparing weed to Coke and crank is like comparing Laughing Gas to Zyklon-B and Phosgene.

the 1% argument is BS. A single person in prison for pot is one too many. I think some would be surprised that Nevada used to have some of the nations strictest laws. If I remember right you could get 20 years for a single joint not that many years ago. In our state in the 70's state patrol officers vacuumed your auto carpets for seeds. Over time Fish Hunter you'll realize that a free society should mean letting people do what they want as long as they aren't harming others. You want to shoot heroin go right ahead. Steal in order to get it you go to prison.

FH07 - I know how you feel man, I lost a couple of my friends to NASCAR.

One day I am talking with my bud and I asked him when we were going fishing again and he said "Not this weekend its the Outback 400 at Chupasequa Raceway, Little E is going to take it". I was like "Noooooooo!".

The last time I saw him he was in Wal-Mart with one of those faux racing jackets with the name brands of all kinds of stupid-sh!t all over it, looking for a foam cooler and a replacement tail light for his house.

What do you mean by free society? Do what ever you want with no consequences?

I used to be a Republican too Fish Hunter.
Somewhere in the last 6 or so years I changed my mind. I was even a R who liked to smoke.
Libertarian...it's where it's at.

Do you think that we should have that type of a free society?