I am sure that many of you saw Wednesday's article by Carol Ostrom in the Seattle Times regarding the "proposed" new rule for Wa. State medical cannabis patients. Well, it's a load of garbage, and is only going to make life worse for some very sick people.

After a years worth of research, study and public meetings, the WA. Dept of Health had recommended (based on science) that a patient could have up to 35 oz. in possession, and up to 100 square feet of "plant canopy".

This is NOT what the Gov. has released...no, she took it upon herself to interrupt the Rule Making process and come up with her own figures. Her figures are NOT going to work. Period. Not so much the amount (24 oz.) but the plant limits are not achievable.

Why?

Because the restrictions they have placed on the "plant count" are impossible to achieve. It can't be done, and as a result even MORE horribly sick people will be arrested, be jailed, have their personal lives ruined and their possessions taken all because they are sick, and the only medicine that seems to offer them any relief is medical cannabis.

If you ain't figured it out, yer damn right I am an advocate for these people! My own illness left me few options, and I found that medical cannabis was the only medicine that could/would control the violent vertigo attacks I get with my illness.

I am still able to live a fairly normal life, but I have several friends with cancer, late stage Hep. C, Chrons disease and others that barely get from one day to the next. They can't take the opiates or other med's for pain any longer as their livers and other organs are all but destroyed by "modern and safe" medicine...and compared to most any other medication cannabis is fairly harmless, and can not be overdosed.

Essentially (in the short form) here is what happened in WA.

Last year: The Legislature directed the Stete Dept. of Health to define what a "60 days supply" is for a patient.

(this was not defined under our current law...the current law says "patients may have a 60 day supply", but until there was a definition of that amount LEO continued arresting sick folks!)

Well, that report by the DoH came out Tuesday, and as we suspected, the true villain in this whole scenario is Governor Christine Gregoire.

This is taken from a note from Steve Sarich, the Exe. Director of CannaCare, the largest voice for MMJ users in WA State.:

"...(speaking of the Governor) "The current problems we have with law enforcement stem from her days as the state attorney general. She gathered law enforcement together in Olympia after I-692 passed and told them they could enforce whatever they wanted to in their counties...and that's what they've been doing ever since. The whole time she's been claiming that she "supports medical marijuana"...and I have some nice swamp land for you if you believe that one."

Basically, the Governor took what the DoH had developed under the Rule Making directive from the Legislature (a legal process for making new laws), tossed it out because SHE didn't like the amount the DoH was suggesting based on their extensive research, scientific and medical evidence as well as public input at 4 separate "town hall" meetings around the state, and then cut a deal in the backroom with her Law Enforcement friends so she can get their voting support when she runs for re-election this year.

NOT GOING TO HAPPEN!! We are going to fight her at every turn, including filing multiple lawsuits asap. We have the paper trail of the entire matter, clearly showing where the Gov. has interfered in the legal Rule Making process.

She just tossed out the science, facts and research that was accurate and honest, and basically gave us a rule that is impossible to follow, and a duplicate of Oregon's law. Makes me wonder why the hell we (taxpayers) paid for the meetings, all that proper research at the DoH, and the rule making process if they had no intention of using the data?

Folks we need your help. This is not a bunch of teenage "stoners" out to have a good time, but mature adults (average age of a WA. MMJ patient is 50) who have serious illnesses that are helped by no other medicine, in many cases they are dying, and could use some support so the Gov. does not toss out their health and quality of life to get a few more votes in the re-election campaign.

It's just not right.

Please, take a moment to comment on the issue at the DoH website, https://fortress.wa.gov/doh/policyreview/AddComment.aspx?ID=486

or call Governor Gregoire's Office at 360-902-4111. Please tell them the patients NEED the ruling the Dept. of Health suggested, and NOT what the Gov. came up with in her back-room deal with Law Enforcement.

Just for clarification, I have -0- issues with Law Enforcement. I respect the hell out of cops, but they are not doctors, and have no basis in medical science for their position. Nor does the Gov.

I'll explain what the issue is with the Proposed Rule" in the next post. Here is Carol Ostrom's article:

"24-ounce limit proposed for medical marijuana

Patients authorized to possess or grow marijuana for medical reasons under Washington law would be limited to 24 ounces of harvested marijuana...

By Carol M. Ostrom

Seattle Times health reporter


Patients authorized to possess or grow marijuana for medical reasons under Washington law would be limited to 24 ounces of harvested marijuana, plus six mature plants and 18 immature plants, according to an official draft rule filed by the state Department of Health today.

The filing of the draft rule starts a rule-making process and a public-comment period. A hearing has been scheduled for Aug. 25 in Tumwater, Thurston County.

The draft reduces amounts earlier considered by the health department and revealed in a "talking points" memo used to brief Gov. Christine Gregoire in February. Health-department officials said in the February memo that they planned to recommend 35 ounces of harvested marijuana plus 100 square feet of plant-growing area.

Gregoire's staff told health-department officials the amount appeared to be on the high side, and that law enforcement and medical providers should be consulted. The health department convened an advisory panel that included law-enforcement officials, advocates and a single doctor — a public-health HIV/AIDS expert who does not care for patients directly.

Law-enforcement officials have said their main concern is being able to distinguish legitimate patients from those who are hiding behind the law to grow and sell large amounts of marijuana. They said they consider 3 ounces a reasonable amount for the 60-day supply specified in Washington's law, passed by voters in 1998.

That law allows patients with certain chronic, fatal or debilitating diseases to possess a 60-day supply with a doctor's authorization.

Carol M. Ostrom: 206-464-2249 or costrom@seattletimes.com"



ISO

ISO-

Just to add to your disgust, Federal law overrules state law, so no matter what your state gets enacted, the feds can arrest you and/or shut down your business. They've also been blackmailing various groups (politicians/police) in California to "get with the program" or lose federal subsidies. Their latest tactic has been to go after landlords where pot clubs lease space to get the clubs out of commision.

Have a better day and good luck.

Mike,

I appreciate your support, and yes, Federal Law still supercedes State law according to the Fed's. In my experience they (Fed's) are only targeting the people doing huge grows for profit (aka Commercial growers). Unless a patient is really being foolish the Fed's will not bother them at all.

In many counties in WA. law enforcement leaves the patients alone, providing they are not flagrant in their growing or use. I don't grow, but I know of others in my county that have been talked to by LEO, but never arrested or had their plants destroyed. Seems pretty cruel huh? Destroy a sick and dying man's only helpful medicine? Yep, happens every day in WA., sadly.

What has happened in Calif. is a travesty. The law was passed for sick folks, not commercial growers.

IMO that should have no relation to Medical Cannabis...people get busted selling pills illegally, too, as they should, but it doesn't mean the government has any *right* to take away a sick persons medicine because someone else does something stupid.

ISO

Ok, here is the issue:

The new proposed law allows for 24 ounces of cured, usable bud (medicine to us), and that can be smoked, vaporized, and most commonly used in foods for ingestion, a much safer and more effective method. Problem is, to make "Cannabutter" it takes several ounces at a whack...24 ounces doesn't go far, but we "could" live with it providing they change this insane plant count idea!

Keep in mind that these folks are not only sick, but are forced to raise their own medicine (or pay out the butt for it on the streets). It's hard enough to just get by when you're taking chemo and radiation treatments, let alone learn how to grow MJ.

6 mature plants (defined as ANY plant over 12" in height or width) will not yield 24 ounces to the average gardener...more like 6-10 ounces if they are lucky and all goes well, meaning there were no problems or pestilence that destroyed the crop before it matured.

It takes approx. 60 days to flower a MJ plant, but you can only have 12 "immature" plants (this includes rooting cuttings). Keep in mind ANY plant over 12" is "mature", and you can only have 6 of those.

So, you plant seeds and get 6 plants growing...so far so good...BUT WAIT...likely 2-4 of them will be MALES, and must be destroyed...now you are down to 2 or 3 mature plants flowering for 60 days. (which may yield 1-3 ounces ea. in most cases, depending on strain)

So, you take 6 female clones from the best one (which can only be taken up to about 10 days into the flowering process), and you root those and begin to grow them. In most all cases that plant will be 12" in sight of 3 weeks...but wait...you can't let them get bigger or they become "mature" plants...but you still have at least a month to go on the others in flower!!

WAAYYYYYYY too complicated, and there is no feasable way any patient could maintain a 24 oz. supply by this rule. Impossible to do.

I have never grown even one plant, and always received my medicine from benefactors or, God forbid, I have gone to the streets and had to pay outrageous prices ($300+ an oz) for medication that lets me live like a fairly normal person.

Others are not so lucky, and suffer every day as a result of the Governor's political wrangling! (Don't believe me? How about I introduce you to a few good people that are suffering and miserable only because of the ignorance and political aspirations of others?)

All patients are asking is that the Governor accept and pass into law the ORIGINAL REPORT from the Dept. of Health that was based on SCIENCE and MEDICAL FACTS, not political aspirations . In all honesty, while it is not enogh, most all patients could get by on the 24 oz. ruling, but they need to CORRECT that plant count algothrym before this goes into law. If not, it will only get worse for patients, not better.

So please, if you comment on the DoH site, or call the Governor's office in our support, please remind them it is not a bunch of kids out there having "fun"...just folks with serious diseases and we wish she would stop playing "Political Football" with our health!

ISO

24 ounces is a lot of weed.

ya cupo thats what i thought, if you smoke that much bud in two months you should be plenty high 24/7...cheers

Damn, 24 ounces. That is a lot of buds. Or one "gigantic" cola bud. one way or another I would like to see it. And yes it is B.S. that it is not legal as a medicine. You can prescribe oxy's, morphine, even the caines but not cannibis. Those guys at the top must be starting to believe there own B.S.

The plants I've seen that the growers in N.California use to provide the medical marijuana are literally the size of Christmas trees...each one. They, too, have a limit on how many plants that can be grown per license, and the plants are frickin huge.

I can understand wanting it to be easier to obtain the amount necessary for a medical user, but I think this is less of an issue than it's being presented as...and a pound and a half of bud is helluva lot of pot, and twelve mature plants can easily produce way more than that, if the plants are anywhere near the size of the ones the dudes in N.Cal are using.

Fish on...

Todd

Bask in the glory of the Queen.

Hey, Andy...who you votin' for?

I guess for a recreational user 24 oz. is a lot of smoke, but consider that it takes 3-4 ounces of that just to make 2 lbs. of butter for cooking purposes.

In that case your 24 ounces doesn't go far for someone who's dying of pancrease cancer. Believe me, getting "stoned" is not even on their radar...not feeling the pain is.

The issue is really about the insane plant limits. As I said earlier, most patients can live with the 24 oz. rule (and there is an allowance in the new proposed alw that allows for more if the MD approves it). The ISSUE is the plant count, and that it is not sufficient for anyone to be able to maintain that level.

Basically, the 24 oz. is OK with most patients, but this rule needs to be changed to allow them to grow as many plants as needed to maintain that level. Call it 100 sq. ft of growing area, or 100 sq. ft. of plant canopy...but either way the current offering is no solution.

BTW, I am not even addressing the huge amount of political corruption that has gone on over this. For me, this year, IT IS ANYONE BUT GREGOIRE!

Mike

Todd-

There is no feeling as exhilarating as walking along a small, shaded creek on a hot summer afternoon, then stepping from the creek into a small clearing filled with those "christmas trees."

Until you regain your senses and remember that you're deer hunting and standing in the middle of someone's pot field near harvest while holding a rifle.

Don't know yet. Another lesser of two evils choice. Maybe I'll write myself in.

My neice worked as a "trimmer" in an operation in CA for a few months last year for a MMJ club. Rather interesting stories of size of the operation and such. Of course she insured me that she didn't inhale.

Maybe we can get Ron Paul to run for Governor?

Mikespike...the good thing about those Christmas tree sized plants is that they throw off enough stink that you'd have to be wearing serious nose plugs to blunder into 'em...you can smell 'em about a mile away in that warm N.Cal air.

It's the little renegade fields around here, espeically on cloudy days, that you can walk right into!

Fish on...

Todd

Todd-

If you're insinuating that I can't smell, well, you're right. That was also a little over twenty years ago before anyone ever heard of "medical marijuana".

An interesting side note on that story - I wound up meeting the grower. He paid his income taxes, listed himself as a farmer, and never got busted during the four seasons we hunted in that area. He also told me that deer hate the taste of egg yolk, so he sprayed his crop with it as a pesticide. Probably not a good tip if you live where it rains throughout the year though.

PS I've never touched the stuff.

I think the newer stuff is a lot smellier, too...lots stronger, I guess.

I have some friends who own a couple dispensaries in the Bay Area, and they get hassled some, and their landlord gets hassled, but nothing overt has happened to them. The feds send operatives into their shops every once in a while to make sure they are checking ID's and medical cards, but apparently the "operatives" are pretty obviously just that.

Fish on...

Todd

Getting the munchies just reading this.

Interesting discussion and all, but I was really hoping to get a few folks that understood what MMJ can do for a terminal patient, or someone in long term pain that they don't want to (or can't) take Methadone or other opiates for. (Yep, as dangerous as it is, there are MD's prescribing Methadone for severe long term pain patients....(and they think Medical cannabis is bad? ROTFLMAO!)

I've fished with a lot of you in past years, and you likely know me as a fairly straight, conservative kinda guy, and I still am. I wish I could, but I don't fish so much anymore because 1) it usually gets me sick or too worn out for 2 days after, and 2) there was a lot of sick folks out there with no one (credible) stepping up to the plate for them.

So, if any of you can drop a note to the DoH site asking nothing more than they do not make this into law without fixing the issue with the plant counts. We can live with the 24 oz. rule, but that plant count idea hasn't worked in Oregon and it won't work here either. I can assure you, there are some sick folks out there would really be appreciative.

I've never been one to ask much of anyone, but these folks can sure use some help.

Many thanks,

ISO

Todd: "Smellier"? (is that a word?) It isn't any "smellier" overall, but there are a few more odiferous strains that seem to be making the rounds.