Last time I watched the straw polls it was fairly close. been watching this aol poll get up around 100,000 votes and its pretty lobsided this election year.

http://news.aol.com/political-machine/2008/07/14/aol-straw-poll-july-14-21/

A lot of stunned silence here.

In-tar-web Polls get spammed and arent accurate in the least. The nutjobs from Stormfront or GoonsNet probably got wind of it.

Looks like AOL is using the Diebold voting machines too!

Pew/NY Times poll has it at 45-39 for Obama...

Rasmussen has it 48% Obama 45% McCain, Rasmussen Daily Tracking Poll

It all comes down to the electoral college. Rasmussen electoral college poll

The only numbers that will matter won't be out until November. Until then it is all BS. Isn't Dogfish voteing for Ron Paul?

oops looky now

You're right about that, Hank...McSame does have a really bad habit about FlipFlopping...he flips more than the cooks at IHOP.

1) Was against the Bush tax cuts; now is for making them permanent and even bigger.

2) Was against the GI Bill; now is for the GI Bill.

3) Was for immigration reform; now is against immigration reform - and repudiated his own prior position on immigration reform.

4) Opposed the McCain-Feingold campaign finance reform bill - which had his name on it.

5) Was for gay marriage, and then opposed gay marriage.

6) Was for Roe v. Wade, then was against Roe v. Wade; then for it, sort of; then against it, sort of.

7) Was for storing nuclear waste at Yucca Mountain; then was against it.

8) In 2000 was for military action against rogue states; now is against it, EXCEPT for Iran….which he sings about bombing and says it's good to sell them cigarettes so we can kill them.

9) Negotiating with North Korea; was against it; then for it, especially when Bush did it.

10) Negotiating with Castro's Cuba - in 2000 was for it, now against it.

11) No negotiating with terrorists except when Colin Powell went to Syria in 2002 and when, in 2006, said we'd eventually have to deal with Hamas.

12) Unilateral military action against terrorists in Pakistan - against it when Obama said it was good; for it when Bush did it in the spring of 2008.

13) Warrantless wiretaps - against them 6 months ago; for them now.

14) Torturing detainees - always against it; since he was tortured he should know. Now, in favor of torturing detainees.

15) Perpetual detention of detainees - bad a few years ago, good now.

16) Iraq - the right course in 2004; stay the course in 2005 and now he was always against the flawed strategy - especially when Rumsfeld was there.

17) Estate tax - for it in 2006; against it now.

18) 2004 - for privatizing Social Security; 2008 against privatizing Social Security.

19) February 2008 promised a balanced budget in 4 years. April 2008 said it will take 8 years. June 2008…..back to 4 years. [And, since he is now for the Bush tax cuts, balancing the budget EVER will be impossible.]

20) In 2008 - first glad to look at oil windfall profits tax; then it's a bad idea - Jimmy Carter's bad idea.

21) In 2000 - no new offshore oil drilling; now, just very recently, it's a great idea.

22) In 2000 - attacked Bush fundraising leaders; in 2006 had some of the same people co-chair his own fundraisers.

23) In 2000 - Jerry Falwell was an "agent of intolerance"; in 2006 McCain delivered the commencement address at Falwell's Liberty University and in 2008 McCain was big buddies with Rev. Hagee and Pastor Parsley.

24) Opposed and voted against the Martin Luther King holiday; now says he was for it.

25) 1986 - opposed South African divestment to attack apartheid; June 2008, praised it.

26) In 2000 - defended South Carolina's Confederate flag as a symbol of heritage; in 2002 said it should come down and it was an "act of political cowardice to not take it down."

27) 2000 - against teaching creationism in schools; 2005 - alternatives to evolution should be taught.

28) Was "for" being married to his wife, but then cheated on her and dumped her for his current trophy wife, who happens to be hot and rich, both of which are good Christian "family values".

McLame is pandering to the RWWJ's so badly that it must hurt...maybe as bad as it hurts his face to keep putting on that skeleton rictus you see him with every time he sees a camera.

He's about as "maverick" as french toast, too...he keeps trying to distance himself from the dipshit in office right now, which is a good idea considering what a failure and a disgrace he is, but "trying" and "distancing" are clearly two different things, since he keeps saying he's for "change", but is really just for doing the same ol' same ol' that has embarrassed us and our country for the past seven and a half years.

Fish on...

Todd

I might be.....

Stever, are you familar with Dan Quail?

Anyone listen to the two big speeches that McCan't and Obama made this past week?

Obama gave an hour long speech about all the things he would do, a lot of particulars about his plans and ideas...McLame spent 45 minutes talking about...Obama.

This is going to be McSame's "platform"...don't talk about anything that he believes or holds dear, because that will change with the ebbing and flowing tides of the Radical Religious Right, which means it will change about as often as he has to change his Depends...instead, he'll just keep talking about Obama.

It's pleasing to the sheep to hear unsubstantiated horseshit about Obama, because it makes them feel oh so good inside...it's a good thing they don't actually require that FreddieMacCain actually have any principles or plans beyond just "staying the course" for another four or eight years, because besides talking about Obama, it's all he's got...

Fish on...

Todd

Also, I'm tired of hearing him and the RWWJ's tell us how great "the surge" has been.

When it was first being sold to the American public, we were told that the surge was necessary to make space for accomplishing the goal of political discourse amongst the warring factions in Iraq, because everyone knows that there is no such thing as a "military victory" when there are a handful of groups vying for supremacy in a civil war.

The escalation took place, and attacks on Americans in Iraq dropped...a good thing by anyone's estimation...but no political progress took place at all, not one iota of it...so the ultimate goal of the surge, as it was sold to us, did not happen...it, too, failed...just like most every other BushCorp policy aimed at "winning" this war.

Fish on...

Todd

It's part of why it's so hard to get a Senator elected...they've voted on so many things, even in a short Senate career like Obama's, that they're bound to have either voted on both sides of an issue, or to have voted against the interests of every single American, eventually...or more than likely, both.

That, of course, is a totally different subject than changing "deeply held" principles based on the polling numbers of your most current "base"...that's just plain ol' hackery and pandering.

On a somewhat related note, referring to my #28 on the list, how is it that the party that owns the most adulterers, divorcees, gay sex scandals, etc., still call themselves the party of "family values"...or is that what the Republicans really think "family values" are?

I have my own opinion as to what they really mean when they say "family values", and why the Republican party owns the title, but I'm curious as to what others might think...and don't bother arguing with the premise, as there are far more felons, divorced (often more than once), and adulterers among the current crop of Republican politicians...by far...than there are amongst the Democrats...easy public records, just try Google.

Fish on...

Todd

Hankster - I appreciate your comments. We disagree on some fundamental levels politically, but it's refreshing to have opposing opinions discoursed thoughtfully and with obvious intelligence.

+1

Well if you ever make it up our way we'll have to make that happen. Todd will argue with you until your ears bleed, and I'll row the boat and make timely, precise wisecracks.

If he just concentrates on rowing the boat instead being a smartass, I'll spend most of my time fighting fish rather than talking politics...we'll all throw rocks at KK as we float past some barren gravel bar that he's vainly waving his 15 foot magic wand over...

On the other hand, maybe we'll just pull up and have him make us lunch...mf'r can cook.

Fish on...

Todd

He likes good wine, too...and sometimes brings it fishing.

Have him make you smoked ribs if you fish with him.

Thanks for pointing out my spelling error. I tired it the right way but that didn't look correct either.

+11

I appreciate that you use actual sources for info and not ditto-head speak.

You mentioned that Mother Jones is a liberal source, but I think of them as an independent source as they do not employ a writing staff with a specific agenda and they are not beholden to a corporate parent or sponser. Still, I always check the author's credentials for each story - there will always be bias to some degree.

Where's AuntyM?

"Where's AuntyM?"
She got dissed fairly bad a couple of weeks ago and asked to have her posts deleated. Haven't seen her post since. Couldn't even find the thread where she said it either.

Go over to gf.com and see her spreading her "centrist" views on the politics page there...she's about as "centrist" as Atilla the Hun, and only moderately more likely to have an actual conversation regarding politics...

Fish on...

Todd

Well, everyone has an opion on the matter and usually they only make sense to the person that is thinking it. That is why I try to avoid conversation about the politics of this country, religion, affirmative action and womens rights. I always seem to piss someone off. Sometimes there are things better left alone.

Anyone that prefers the company of the tweekers, poachers, and scammers 'over there' to this place certainly has my welcome to stay there.

Todd-

Why would I want to go to any website other than this one?

I am less concerned about what other people say is the only way to be (politically, religously, life, etc.) than findng out a different viewpoint. My wife pointed out to me last night that I often play devil's advocate for stuff I don't believe in. Here on the dark side, they are just words on a screen, if you take a deep breath and stand back from it all for a minute. I don't agree with what many people say on this site, but that's what makes it interesting. I hope AuntyM comes back. I also enjoy "guest appearances" by BigStick, so maybe I'm not on my meds right now.

Oh yeah, there's all the fish porn and tips and advice!

I don't really care if she comes back, or not...it's a fairly public forum, and she can come and go if she pleases...but until she notes that she is the common denominator in most of the caustic discussions around here history will just continue to repeat itself and she'll end up leaving again.

I'm sure folks have noticed that the political discussions have continued unabated without her, yet have mostly contained actual discussions of the topics rather than backbiting and bitching...

Fish on...

Todd

There is no doubt that Aunty is a very strongly opinionated person. But on the same note, she does not hinder to appease the masses. Which in my book is alright. Even if I don't agree with what she is saying. Which does happen. Alot of people fold like lawn chairs to try and avoid making people mad. Whether anyone wants to hear it or not is another story. But then again, that is why these kind of things are around. So everyone can put the collection of things together. It is really up to the person to decide what is worth something and what is not. I guess that would be formed by the type of ideals a person has. Obviously they are not going to conincide with everyone elses. In my short time I have tried to respect that everyone is entitled to their opinions and that I am not always going to agree with them. And to try and avoid scolding them for it. There is a difference between an intelligible person and a jackass that throws some words around they read on another site and then proclaims to be knowledgeable. I rather enjoyed the fact that she seemed to have a source for her facts everytime and was more than willing to provide them to the masses.

I am not saying she is always right. I am saying that it is nice to have folks around with some resolve. That is a commodity which seems to be in short supply today due to the fence riding liberal indecisive population of most of the Northwest. But that is just my opinion.