Hi everyone

This was sent to me by a friend. I had no idea this was in the works, even here in Washington. HOUSE BILL 3359


Ammunition Accountability Legislation

It has already started...

Ammunition Accountability Legislation



The bill that is being pushed in 18 states (including Illinois and Indiana ) requires all ammunition to be encoded by the manufacture a data base of all ammunition sales. So they will know how much you buy and what calibers.



Nobody can sell any ammunition after June 30, 2009 unless the ammunition is coded...

Any privately held uncoded ammunition must be destroyed by July 1, 2011. (Including hand loaded ammo.) They will also charge a .05 cent tax on every round so=20 every box of ammo you buy will go up at least $2.50 or more!

If they can deprive you of ammo they do not need to take your gun!

This legislation is currently pending in 18 states: Alabama, Arizona, California, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Kentucky, Maryland, Mississippi, Missouri, New Jersey, New York, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, and Washington.

Send to your friends in these states AND fight to dissolve this BILL!!

To find more about the anti-gun group that is sponsoring this legislation and the specific legislation for each state, go to:

http://ammunitionaccountability.org/Legislation.htm

Gee . . Obama moves fast. He's only been in office 1 day and already has this on the ballot in 18 states.

wingnuttery strikes again

LOL

Talked to a local state rep on Tuesday about this. THe bill is dead in Olympia and will not gain traction. The ass clowns who are promoting this legislation are a company based in Tacoma who manufacture the technology. Same exact bill in every state.

Best investment advice I've heard all day

That bill is from last year (biennium)...wouldn't be surprised to see it again though.

You can follow bills introduced that impact firearms here

Its not Obama A.S.S.lick Its our state leg.

Peace
Fly

The NRA sent me a letter last year ( because I had been a member 20 or more years ago ) That said the United Nations was holding a conference ( on a ship in New York Harbor .. within miles of the sight of 9/11.. where they were going to vote that hand gun sales be banned in the United States of America.. forever,, and that I was not even going to be able to voice MY opinion... UNLESS.. I sent the NRA money fast so they could foil this evil plan )

I have been getting told somebody was going to take my guns away since I got my first one at age 10 and 38 years later I still have it.

I would like someone to explain to me a couple of things:

1. How does this contravene the 2nd Amendment?
2. What is the problem with this regulation?

Aunty, I know we have a fundamental disagreement on virtually all things gun related - but the questions are still relavant.

Both of my questions can be boiled down to one: How does this regulation take the ability to buy ammunition (therefore defacto restricting the use of firearms) away from people?

eddie:

How does "coding" individual pieces of ammunition deprive you of the ability to purchase ammunition? It doesn't directly, Joe's and Cabela's will still carry ammunition...the issue will be the price of ammunition. The cost of coding individual pieces of ammo is astronomic (sorry, I can't provide a per unit cost), that cost will be passed along to you, the consumer. It is simple cost accounting actually. By increasing the cost of ammunition (which the left has been trying to do with ammo taxes for years) will limit a certain segment of the population's ability to purchase ammunition.

If that is the case, then where do we draw the line? Should guns and ammo be granted at no charge to anyone who wants? Should the Govt. subsidize the price of guns and ammo to make them more affordable? Just because I have the right to do something does not mean that I am not expected to pay money to exercise that right IMHO.

What is amazing is that the same people that think the patriot act disolved all civil lib have no problem with this(and yes I think the patriot act was B.S.). Dont you dare listen in on a phone call from outside the country in from know bad actors but take the ammo in my house and track and register everything I do with my hunting rifles. Use taxes to make my ammo to expensive to buy, limit the amount I can have, track every shell, register what I do so they can keep me safe from myself.
What a bunch of crap.....rant and rave against one B.S. law because it was put up by one party and stand up for the other B.S. law because it comes from the other. Follow the flock sheep but you better watch out for the wolves.

Electing a Democrat has been a boon for the gun industry...the amount of ignorant and scared gun owners (inflamed by a smart industry) running around and buying everything that can shoot is probably making the industry leaders laugh their asses off over three martini lunches since November.

eddie, it's a slippery slope...ban 50cal. machines from city libraries and you'll wake up tomorrow with illegal rubber bands, too.

Oh, no! Better run out and stock up on rubber bands!

Fish on...

Todd

Yes Todd the gun shops have been busy from over reaction about BO. Is he planning to take our guns.....no I do not think so. I think he respects the second ammend and until he does something that proves otherwise he has my support on the issue.
Do I think that Reid and pellosi have any respect for gun owner ship.......no I dont. They could care less about the 2nd amend and you know it. This is a slippery slope and you are smart enough to know that. Start registering this, taxing that, taking this coarse, filling out that form and making things all around more difficult and over time is becomes not worth it anymore. It turns off the new generation of people who like to hunt. Make people jump through enough hoops that the benefit no longer is worth the cost and they give up. You truely are one of the sheep if you think this legis is OK and feel the need to call others "ignorant and scared" because they dont.

I can't support this legislation, or those poli's that support it.

It's a clear intrusion by the government where they don't belong, and as you might already know I consider out own government as much a threat as any terrorist. I think the Patriot Act is an outrageous granting of power to the government that they shouldn't have, and I think this proposed legislation is another intrusion.

Aunty, if one of the issues is the increased cost of ammo, then the question is fair, should the Govt. subsidize? Should they make it free? What is the magic number that takes away the concern over increased cost? If the govt. subsidized this program and make it cost neutral for the consumer, would that be OK?

Most of our Constitutionally protected rights (with the exception of the 2nd) have no direct cost to the citizenry. The 2nd is unique in this aspect. So, if part of the concern is over cost (and it appears to be so judging by comments) then these questions are entirely appropriate and deserve to be answered.

Eddie,
Tell me you kidding with that logic. Almost all the protected rights could be argued to have a direct cost to the citizenry. it depends on which side you fall.
Lets take the 18th on prohibition for one.
How about the 21st repealing prohibition. A hell of a lot more deaths due to alcohol than firearms in the US.
Now lets go for income Tax for a literal one with the 16th. That costs the citizenry directly.
23rd with electorial college......we all see that has no cost.
25th with voting age costs our youth their voice.
every amend has a cost and benefit depending on your side. Cost of ammo is only the beginning of the problem with this law.

That way, when the starving, bankrupted, homeless masses storm dick Cheney's compound to lynch him, he'll be able to afford to 'protect' himself.

Think of this another way people - Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nicols were traced down because they bought fertilizer. If the government was tracking that back in the '90s, ammunition is a no brainer. We like to belittle the government, but they are way ahead of us all when it comes to internal security. And anyone that screams 9/11 as a response should remember that safeguards were in place to prevent those men from getting on those planes, but no one acted to stop them.

Personally, I probably can't afford ammo anyway right now

Illegal wire tapping....ok
Authority to search my home without a warrant or even notifying me that it happened...what have I got to hide?
National database...well it's probably for the best
Searches in ferry lines...whatever keeps us safe
border patrol road block/checkpoints....might get a terrorist
indefinite imprisonment of US and non-US citizens without charges or trial....if they say they are bad they must be
Torture...as long as it's not me

gun law....WHAT? WHAT? ARE YOU F'ing CRAZY? THIS IS AMERICA!!! WE HAVE RIGHTS!!!!

When I was talking about direct costs, I meant direct costs - $'s coming out of our wallets. And I should have been more clear, I meant that the 2nd is the only one of the Bill of Rights - the first 10 amendments, that has a direct cost to us in order to exercise the right.

I understand the privacy arguement and I tend to agree with it in principle. And Aunty, even though I am absolutely not in favor of the 2nd Amendment, that does not mean I want to overturn it. I believe that a repeal of the 2nd Amendment or a significant curtailing of the rights inherent, are a political non-starter. But, the courts have ruled that there can exist "reasonable restrictions". We can't own machine guns, or nuclear devices. Clearly, I am not a gun owner, but the only arguement that I have heard in this thread that portrays this as an unreasonable restriction is the cost issue. If ammunition is used in the commission of a crime, I would like to make it easier for the police to trace that ammo and potentially lead to the perp.

+10,000

Fish on...

Todd

P.S. doc, chill the hell out...go back and find where I expressed an opinion on this topic...or let me save you a minute, and tell you that I haven't expressed one on this topic at all...I just expressed my opinion on the fear mongering by the gun/ammo industry, and the willingness to eat the fear hook, line, and sinker by the gun advocates.

I have several guns...not surprisingly, no one has ever taken them.

That's the funny thing that everyone is missing. Small business owners--smart entrepreneurs, albeit misguided--come up with something that will make them money, then lobby the hell out of some politicos to mandate it. But the knee-jerk reaction is to jump on the Dems for trying to repeal the Second Amendment.

So since it won't legally limit your ability to own weapons or buy ammunition, the question is: why do you hate the small business owner?

Because they are taking advantage of the small business owner quota, and that's reverse discrimination. I think.

Wow, people cry like babies that GW was listening in on their 1-900 calls, but tracking how many shells I purchase in a hunting season, thats ok.. I suppose the next step is filling out a form after each shell is fired, so they know how many I have on hand? When legislation like that passes. we are one very small step from being a military state.

Attempting to circumvent our rights through taxation seems contrary to some of the lefts core beliefs. For one, you would be taking guns and ammo out of the hands of the poor first. Followed by the middle class with the last still holding firearms being the rich. Lucky for us, there all sane, law-abiding citizens! We all know that'll put an end to firearm related incidents in the US too.

All we need is more regulations cause the ones we already have dont seem to be doing the trick. Maybe if people start "self-reporting" when they shoot someone, it'll be easier to enforce! Hell, make "self -reporting" a law too!

The problem I have with is is that today I am a legal citizen and if this passes I become a criminal at some time in the future.

Also, criminal will not abide by this law, just like they don't abide by other laws. This law only affects law abiding citizens by further restricting their rights. I would have to choose between giving up literally thousands of dollars worth of ammo, or becoming a criminal.

I shoot some whacky calibers, and I have literally purchased a sufficient amount of bulk components to last me and my boys a lifetime of reloading.

"Just give up the Jews. Nobody will miss them....." is what the Nazi's said as they eroded people's rights away one by one, then it was the mentally retarded, the gypseys, and then anyone else they didn't like.

So I am not going to abide by them when the say "just give up your rounds", because without them my guns are useless.

Those who give up liberty for security deserve neither.

People ought to be asking what is the point of this legislation, besides making money for the business that has the technology to mark ammo. That is, how many shooting crimes go unsolved that would be solved if only the ammo had an identification mark? I don't read of many shooting crimes that go unsolved in this country. This prospective legislation might be an answer out looking for a problem that is either non-existent or minimally so.

Sg