Personally I don't think the "usual and accustomed" argument will hold water. Reservation boundaries would be clearly defined and only within those would these LEO's in accordance with what has been mentioned above.

They can certainly claim that these hunters were a danger to the public and they intervened as such, but they better make a damn good case of it to convince any reasonable jury or judge that this was indeed the case. It doesn't seem as though such claims have been part of their "defense" thus far. Truth still matters regardless of whether they carry badges or not.

Irie1:

ColeyG provided the link to the Oliphant case in an earlier post. Please read it as it is the definitive decision in this. Each tribe hires its own LE personnel who are answerable to their tribal employer which, in turn, is responsible for its officers' actions (BUT FOR the issue of tribal immunity). Again, in order for tribal officers to become cross-commissioned the individual tribe must waive that immunity and post a bond to ensure that if one of their officers goofs up that the aggrieved citizen has a civil remedy available to him/her.

This was more than unlawful detainment according to all of the reports and the pictures available from the press. The citizens were apparently approached at gunpoint while dressing/loading the elk. They were subsequently handcuffed and held for two hours. I make that trespassing, assault with a deadly weapon, kidnapping, and interfering with a lawful hunt (Mike Cenci???). Keep in mind the tribal LE did not have jurisdiction. Suggest that you look at the tribal guys as plain old citizens and think what would have happened to you if you had taken these same actions.

Krijack: No excuses for these guys. They fully know the bounds of their jurisdiction (or certainly are expected to know it) and they were some 10 miles from the res. Given the small population of that tribe my guess is that they know all of its members. Also note that the elk was already down and was being loaded into the truck so no excuse that they, as a citizen, were stopping an illegal/dangerous event.

Nope, these guys are in the (elk) soup.

One of teh tribal LEO's was also a captain, so he should have no excuse.

Is it likely that this case, like so many others in the past, simply gets turned over to the tribal courts? Then nothing is heard of the outcome again? Soverign nation ie: Above the Law?

grizz1:

Don't think that will happen on this one. Occurred off res, involved non-tribal members, "violent crime" against State law and lots of visibility in the local papers and among the general population. Also, WDFW and Jefferson County Sheriff have investigated and will be sending findings to the county prosecutor has this on track for formal criminal charges.

County jail or the big house?

At least things are being investigated, and apparently objectively. The outcome, however, is very much up in the air, IMO. With the lovely Gov's ties to the Tribes, I have my doubts that much of anything will happen beyond an out of court settlement. That's my guess.

Yah Know, this discussion here has given me an idea The whole problem under discussion here has been whether or not "Tribal Entities" have any Legal Authority with Non-Tribal personnel. Why not through the Initiative Process preclude any Tribal Entity from EVER having any LE Authority, i.e., overturn the OlympiaTard 's (Sorry Sonntag, you're now have to share that title) legislation that allows Cross-Deputization, just make it a No-No????? Makes sense to me.

Plus it would De-incentatize Generalissimo Christine from "Dippy" into the Casino Cookie Jar.

Has anyone here Googled Up what the Port Gamble S'Klallam Tribe's economic interests are????? That way we who are outrage would have a "Focus To Boycott" those interests. Well, I'm off to Google Land, will post Economic Tribal Interests Later

Well it LQQKs Like the Tribe has two, possibly three Economic Interests that could be boycotted. First the "Biggie" that would hit them square in the pocketbook (Short Hairs -- Hearts and Minds following Quickly) is the:

Point No Point Casino
7989 Salish Lane NE
Kingston, WA 98346
Phone: (360) 297-0070


That is probably the "Financial Engine" that funded those two Natural Resource Ossifers. If anybody spends even a nickel there, you should be banned from here. The other Economic Entity of the tribe is:

"Salish Business Park
Our 30 acre Salish Business Park offers unique tax advantages as well as close proximity to major Puget Sound cities, government facilities, airports, and colleges. We can provide construction financing options and build-to-suit facilities to almost any type of business user, including those clients needing high-speed broadband services. We can also provide architectural and engineering services. In addition, employment and work force services are available through the Tribe."

Somebody should probably go there ad check out the businesses who rent there and post their names so we can boycott them and let them know "Why!!!!!!!"

The third "Possible" interest from their website is "Tribal Chairman Ron Charles shakes the hand of DNR's Doug Sutherland after the Tribe won the bidding for the three parcels of DNR land." I would deduce that the tribe has a "Close Working Relationship" with the State DNR, i.e., Generalissimo Christine's Hands are Deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep in the Casino Pocket. I think extremely close examination of any future Bidding by this tribe with anything to do with the State DNR should be done.

They (Tribe) also has a "BroadBand" service that may or may not be exclusive to the Tribe and it's entities.

See, Google is Our Friend

The DNR sale to the tribe was an arm's length bidding transaction that didn't have anything to do with what you are suggesting. I heard this from somebody that was in the bidding but wasn't willing to pay as much as the tribe. You are wrong on that point.

Any informational picketing might be more effective if these guys skate (civil suit) on the tribal immunity trump card.

Contaminated Food? = Sorry, No Recourse
Injured? = Sorry, No Recourse
Cheated? = Sorry, No Recourse
Assaulted? = Sorry, No Recourse

Tribal = NO RECOURSE!!!

Please watch your step when entering.

What I am suggesting is that Non-Tribal Folks start scruntinizing the DNR Tribal transactions a whole lot more frequently and closer. Kinda like turing on the Light and watching the Cockroaches scurrying for cover. If the Tribe was able to pay more than average, then that further strenghtens my line of thought, i.e., boycott that @#%^&*( money factory they have, the CASINO. If that Casino started losing money due to boycotting, you can bet the Tribe would throw those two Tribal Cops/Resource Ossifers under the bus in a NYC minute.

I, personally, am not willing to make this a tribal issue, unless there is an open attempt to "lie it away". This is an issue about two guys who went too far.....
Let's just wait and see how this developes.

I won't condemn the Tribe for the actions of two.

Slab----Have you seen the Tribes' attempt to legitamize this screw up? 'cause they have....

Yes, I did, but I would expect any outfit to do that.....
Now let's see if they pony up.

Here's the options I see....
They can condemn the actions of the two, apologize, and pay off the victims ....
and regain respect, which might be both the most advantageous monetarily and socially.
OR
They can play the Poor Indian card.....which may be acceptable in some arenas, but I'd hazard a guess that their phone lines would be tied up tight with "well wishers", and more importantly they would lose respect, both within the Tribe and locally.

We'll see how the elders handle this.

Sutherland is a good man. The DNR transaction was legitimate.

Everybody makes mistakes, but it is how you recover from it that shows your true colors.

Wow.....10 pages of bigotry and hate, 7500 reads and almost 200 posts. Thank goodness for the few posts of reason, thank you.

War? Boycots? Treaties? Is it any wonder that the tribes acting as co-managers are reluctant to act in sport fishers favor?

Come on guys.... if this was a WDFW screw up, would you be calling for war and succession from the State? Or even boycot of license fees?

I have spent far more than 2 hrs combined tied up next to WDFW and Coast Guard in Puget Sound over the last 20 some odd years while they verified I was legally operating my vessel and fishing within the regs. No outrage there, infact most here support that.

I say these hunters should receive an apology, get some casino bucks and be allowed to harvest an elk on the reservation. Then, we should hire Port Gamble S'Klallam LE to patrol area boat launches to prevent break ins and thievery and these officers should have to do it as community service. ( only half serious here)


I clearly support these individuals right to restitution. I don't support a police State in any circumstances, but this is being blown so far out of proportion that it is pathetically sad. Some times it is honestly embarrassing to admit I am a sport fisherman.

Hitting the tribe where it hurts $$$, or ANY tribe for that matter can and has worked before. Case in point, Northwood Casino in Lynden, WA was built against strong public opinion, opposition from the state liquor control board and the county, due to the county roads. The casino was built on alledged "Indian Trust land" on a small piece of tree'd swamp ground no where near any reservation. They were banking on on canadian's flocking to gamble their loonies and local business.
Well turns out, their plans were a little short sighted. The "If you build it, they will come" philosiphy didn't work so well. Build a casino out in the sticks, people won't come apparently.

Now the tribe is in default of their loan and being sued:

http://www.bellinghamherald.com/102/story/1120972.html