#655506 - 01/18/11 01:59 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: IrishRogue]
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Poon it! Poon it! Poon it!
Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 1714
Loc: Yarrow Point
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I would propose we get our best and brightest to craft a carefully built response, and then we all send our support for that. Or better yet, let's go visit them .. I'm quite sure they would take a sit down meeting more seriously than spamming from us...
Ray's is an icon, if we can get them onboard, it's a big deal.
Edited by IrishRogue (01/18/11 02:00 PM)
_________________________
The charm of fishing is that it is the pursuit of what is elusive but attainable, a perpetual series of occasions for hope. -John Buchan
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#655512 - 01/18/11 02:08 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: SkykomishSunrise]
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Steelhead Hitman
Registered: 02/10/09
Posts: 1952
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This is what I received a couple of minutes ago from the executive chef at Ray's Boat House: Thank you for your concern regarding the Olympic Peninsula Steelhead that we are currently offering as a special in our restaurant. We agree 100% with your position that serving unsustainable, endangered and threatened fish is damaging to the future of wild fish and our environment. We actively support organizations, such as Long Live the Kings and Puget Soundkeeper Alliance, who work toward preserving our natural resources. The Olympic Peninsula Steelhead that we are serving has been sustainably caught by the Quileute Tribe from the Quileute River and purchased through Key City Fish. The Steelhead is a combination of both hatchery and wild stock that has spawned naturally. Since November 1, 2010, we have served about 134 fish. Many Steelhead populations are indeed endangered or threatened and should absolutely be completely avoided, such as those on the California Coast, Oregon Coast, Snake River, and Puget Sound. However, the Olympic Peninsula Steelhead population is healthy, robust and absolutely not threatened. For confirmation of this please visit NOAA’s website at: http://www.nwr.noaa.gov/ESA-Salmon-Listings/Salmon-Populations/Steelhead/.The Quileute Tribe is closely partnered with the Washington Department of Fish & Wildlife to aggressively manage this fishery. The state and tribe worked together to produce the Salmon Stock Inventory (SaSI) in 1992. The SaSI is a critical document for wild fish recovery and definitively identifies the status of each wild stock in categories ranging from extinct to healthy. The state and tribe actively works with citizens to catalogue details about habitat and map fish stock distributions. I can assure you that everyone involved, from tribe to state to restaurant, has a vested interest in the preservation of this fish. There is considerable conflict between sport and commercial fishermen regarding the regulation of steelhead fishing and we completely understand the frustrations of both sides. We want to stress, though, that the Olympic Peninsula Steelhead we have served was sustainably and legally caught according to the regulations set forth by the Washington Department of Fish & Wildlife and is not endangered or threatened according to NOAA’s National Marine Fisheries Service. Ray’s Boathouse would absolutely never serve endangered or threatened fish. Thank you for your feedback. Please let me know if you have any further questions. Best, Peter Birk, Executive Chef | Ray’s Boathouse, Café & Catering 6049 Seaview Avenue NW | Seattle, WA 98107 206.789.3770 | www.rays.com | rays@rays.com This is the exact same crap sent to me by Pike place fish last year. This is just regurgitated info sent to them by the fish broker where they are getting this fish.
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#655529 - 01/18/11 02:41 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: Fast and Furious]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 12/30/07
Posts: 3116
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Which tribe fishes that area and then also fishes the Chehalis?
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#655530 - 01/18/11 02:43 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: Brant]
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Spawner
Registered: 06/09/07
Posts: 655
Loc: MA 5, 9, 10
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My Reply to Peter:
"Thanks for the note Peter, I do appreciate the reply.
As you can see from the chart, MOST (12 of 15) river systems on the west coast ARE listed, and I am trying to keep the OP rivers from joining the list. Surely, you can see the trend, where 20 years ago, none of the rivers were listed, and then fast forward to where 80% are listed today.
I don’t blame this decline wholly on restaurants or tribal fishing. Rather, we each have to do our part or take the blame for when the OP rivers are listed.
134 fish might seem like just a few, but consider I have never killed a wild fish, but participate in the hatchery fishery 100%, and I suggest Ray’s do the same. For rivers that are listed, it was legal for wild harvest at one time, and look where they are now. Their Fish and Wildlife programs failed to protect the resource, and our WDFW is following their footsteps. Don’t believe their charts and bureaucracy. One reason we are not listed is that the WDFW sets an “escapement goal”. These OP numbers have not been adjusted since the 1980’s, and do not take into account increased development, logging, hatchery impact and new science. After all, if WDFW properly managed the resource on the 12 other river systems, those 80% would not be listed. Also note, I cut the following from the charts NOAA gave you: “DPS STATUS AND DESCRIPTION: Listing not warranted on August 9, 1996.”, demonstrating why these should not be used.
I’m happy to hear steelhead was popular at your restaurant since Nov. 1, but from this point forward, you’ll most likely be serving 100% wild fish. The hatchery runs are finished. If only 10 competing seafood restaurants each sold 100 wild fish (as steelhead is still offered on the menu), that’s 1000 fish. The Quillayute River System Escapement goal is 5900 wild fish. Therefore the impact of just 10 restaurants equals 16% or 1/6th of the whole escapement number. Just from 10 restaurants. I think you’ll see we’re soon on the list.
The point: There are ways that hatchery steelhead can be harvested without killing wild fish, and you can still offer steelhead on the menu. None of your diners can tell the difference of wild vs. hatchery when it’s on their plate. Ray’s participation in the way things are done now will get us on “The List” eventually. I’m doing what I can to not let that happen. Is Ray’s?
Again, thanks for your consideration...
Edited by ned (01/18/11 03:08 PM)
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#655540 - 01/18/11 03:11 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: ned]
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Returning Adult
Registered: 02/22/10
Posts: 433
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Good response except for your math in this statement.
If only 10 competing seafood restaurants each sold 100 wild fish (as steelhead is still offered on the menu), that’s 2000 fish.
Not trying to put you down or be negative. Just proofreading. Thank you for taking the time to fight the good fight for us.
I agree with DNW that this is a form letter supplied by the fish broker. Highly doubt a chef or buyer for the restaurant would take the time to draft such a letter.
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#655543 - 01/18/11 03:19 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: Driftfishnw]
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Spawner
Registered: 12/20/10
Posts: 950
Loc: the moon
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This is what I received a couple of minutes ago from the executive chef at Ray's Boat House: Thank you for your concern regarding the Olympic Peninsula Steelhead that we are currently offering as a special in our restaurant. We agree 100% with your position that serving unsustainable, endangered and threatened fish is damaging to the future of wild fish and our environment. We actively support organizations, such as Long Live the Kings and Puget Soundkeeper Alliance, who work toward preserving our natural resources. The Olympic Peninsula Steelhead that we are serving has been sustainably caught by the Quileute Tribe from the Quileute River and purchased through Key City Fish. The Steelhead is a combination of both hatchery and wild stock that has spawned naturally. Since November 1, 2010, we have served about 134 fish. Many Steelhead populations are indeed endangered or threatened and should absolutely be completely avoided, such as those on the California Coast, Oregon Coast, Snake River, and Puget Sound. However, the Olympic Peninsula Steelhead population is healthy, robust and absolutely not threatened. For confirmation of this please visit NOAA’s website at: http://www.nwr.noaa.gov/ESA-Salmon-Listings/Salmon-Populations/Steelhead/.The Quileute Tribe is closely partnered with the Washington Department of Fish & Wildlife to aggressively manage this fishery. The state and tribe worked together to produce the Salmon Stock Inventory (SaSI) in 1992. The SaSI is a critical document for wild fish recovery and definitively identifies the status of each wild stock in categories ranging from extinct to healthy. The state and tribe actively works with citizens to catalogue details about habitat and map fish stock distributions. I can assure you that everyone involved, from tribe to state to restaurant, has a vested interest in the preservation of this fish. There is considerable conflict between sport and commercial fishermen regarding the regulation of steelhead fishing and we completely understand the frustrations of both sides. We want to stress, though, that the Olympic Peninsula Steelhead we have served was sustainably and legally caught according to the regulations set forth by the Washington Department of Fish & Wildlife and is not endangered or threatened according to NOAA’s National Marine Fisheries Service. Ray’s Boathouse would absolutely never serve endangered or threatened fish. Thank you for your feedback. Please let me know if you have any further questions. Best, Peter Birk, Executive Chef | Ray’s Boathouse, Café & Catering 6049 Seaview Avenue NW | Seattle, WA 98107 206.789.3770 | www.rays.com | rays@rays.com This is the exact same crap sent to me by Pike place fish last year. This is just regurgitated info sent to them by the fish broker where they are getting this fish. Are you serious? That's BS. The fact that the distributor has a canned pitch like this is sick. It's even more shitty that Rays used it. They officialy don't deserve any remorse. They're probably just gonna copy and paste this in all the responses. Two of the same responses have already been posted. Someone needs to get the job done and call them or go in there.
_________________________
All of my thoughts are sophisticated and complex.
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#655564 - 01/18/11 04:05 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: MPM]
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Spawner
Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 510
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The link also has a letter to Ray's discussing the current population trends and suggesting a more cautious approach. It appears that the actual exploitation rate on NOR's has not been that high, but the productivity (R/S) has been less than 1.0 (self-sustaining) in 5 out of the last 7 years. Not a good trend.
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#655571 - 01/18/11 04:31 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: MPM]
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Dazed and Confused
Registered: 03/05/99
Posts: 6367
Loc: Forks, WA & Soldotna, AK
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FB page hit  Since the canned letter seems to be making the rounds ... I'll make sure my letter to the Chef concentrates on responses he "makes".
_________________________
Seen ... on a drive to Stam's house:   "You CANNOT fix stupid!"
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#655575 - 01/18/11 04:51 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: Bob]
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Poon it! Poon it! Poon it!
Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 1714
Loc: Yarrow Point
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We are missing a BIG opportunity here. We shouldn't be in "BOYCOTT" mode because that's adversarial--and it's unwarranted at this point. If we can get there, show them we're reasonable, and we have good, recent, data, then we can have a HUGE impact. Getting Rays off of gillnetted steelhead is a story, maybe not mainstream media, but it's a step.
*I* will volunteer to do the meeting, I will set it up... Happy to have a wingman, but me + 1 at most...
What I could use is a pointer or two to the best/most recent data on the rivers, the link above is a great start....
Post here/PM me if you're interested, or have good additional info.
_________________________
The charm of fishing is that it is the pursuit of what is elusive but attainable, a perpetual series of occasions for hope. -John Buchan
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#655577 - 01/18/11 05:00 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: IrishRogue]
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Returning Adult
Registered: 12/09/03
Posts: 399
Loc: Seattle
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I agree with what IrishRogue said about speaking directly with the people at Rays and educating them rather than threatening them with a boycott. In my experience, Rays is usually genuinely concerned about food sustainability issues. For example, they have local, organic grass fed beef on their menu and I believe that at least one meat CSA operates out of the Ray's parking lot. Perhaps they just need some education rather than threats.
IR, send me a PM if you want someone to head to Rays with you. Would need to have some current data. Anyone here want to provide that?
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#655583 - 01/18/11 05:26 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: IrishRogue]
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Dazed and Confused
Registered: 03/05/99
Posts: 6367
Loc: Forks, WA & Soldotna, AK
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I would propose we get our best and brightest to craft a carefully built response, and then we all send our support for that. Or better yet, let's go visit them .. I'm quite sure they would take a sit down meeting more seriously than spamming from us...
Ray's is an icon, if we can get them onboard, it's a big deal. Yes, it is, and a visit may be in order ... perhaps in front of property with some informational flyers. I sent a note off to the WSC folks to see if we can work on getting these fish on the 'Avoid' list for the seafood watch cards as well. I have sent a note off to Peter stating the importance of healthy fish stocks to the Forks community and as President of the Olympic Peninsula Guides' Association - to our members and their families that live here. I pointed out that only serving hatchery fish is a bad idea as well because of the fact that these fisheries intercept the few early fish that remain ... and that WDFW has seen enough issue with them to keep them off limits to sporties for the first time as well. I also mentioned that data is only provided by those hired by the tribes and that previous employees have come forth and told they were instructed to fudge their numbers. I am also asking all of you to avoid eating at Ray's until which time they are removed from their menu as I mentioned in the letter and will also pass this word along to all OPGA membership to pass along to their clientele base at our next meeting. That's many thousands of people ... All about the buck for them it appears.
_________________________
Seen ... on a drive to Stam's house: "You CANNOT fix stupid!"
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#655588 - 01/18/11 05:43 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: Bob]
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River Nutrients
Registered: 08/14/06
Posts: 2463
Loc: edmonds
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I am also asking all of you to avoid eating at Ray's until which time they are removed from their menu as I mentioned in the letter and will also pass this word along to all OPGA membership to pass along to their clientele base at our next meeting. That's many thousands of people ...
All about the buck for them it appears. Enough said, facebook reply sent to Ray's...
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#655601 - 01/18/11 06:30 PM
Re: Rays Boathouse wild steelhead
[Re: RognSue]
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Poon it! Poon it! Poon it!
Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 1714
Loc: Yarrow Point
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Okay, I just got off the phone with the Exec. Chef, Peter. I will be visiting him on Thursday AM, to briefly run through the data.
The key will be delving into data much more recent than the 2002 SaSI (now almost 8 years old), the Aug 19, 1996 (14.5 years old) ESA protection "not warranted" assessment. The data show populations are changing rapidly in these rivers, and 5 years is a long time...
Feel free to pass along/post any comments/ideas. I'll update you all along the way and after the meeting.
_________________________
The charm of fishing is that it is the pursuit of what is elusive but attainable, a perpetual series of occasions for hope. -John Buchan
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