I agree.



I also agree.

The handwringing and righteous indignation when other countries do exactly as we do...exactly, to a tee...is always entertaining, and not in a good way.

Fish on...

Todd

Obama is completely inept if it were WW II we would be speaking Japanese or German . If it were the Cold War we would be speaking Russian . Think about the luck of this fuker . No army strong enough to challenge us and he is lucky that his ineptness in Syria and Ukraine ends up being to our benefit. If GW , Reagan or Clinton were president we would have four wars going.

At one time, not long ago, your statement might have been correct.

Yeah - being in four wars would be nifty, you fuckin' idiot.

Why don't you just shut your fuckin' hole, Choad? Maybe it's YOU that's inept, bein's that Obama is the POTUS and you're just a sh!t stain that runs the world from your keyboard.

I also agree but am confused by that last statement. Are you saying the US regularly sends troops into sovereign nations without a flag patch? If so that's chickenshit too and scares the hell out of me. Without out that patch aren't you just a spy and eligible to be shot on the spot and outside any protections of the world court?

I've noticed that our drones don't have a flag or a US star on them and have always felt that too was chickenshit!

The CIA has been doing this for decades. Some say it's a necessary evil, some say it's just evil. ymmv

OK-I did a little research. Seems that the dog tag is the determining factor if the soldier is acting within international laws and not the uniform.....

"Those who are given an opportunity to observe or talk with prisoners of war should ask to see the identification documents. Not only is the card evidence of the person’s status under the laws of war, its absence is evidence that the captor is not in full compliance with the same laws. The presence of the identity disks and the identification card is a ready and visible means of determining some minimal level of compliance with the laws of war concerning prisoners. - See more at: http://www.crimesofwar.org/a-z-guide/511/#sthash.bhQMw5d9.dpuf"

Spies are not protected by international law. They can be shot on sight and are never considered POW's. Terrorists have more protections within the law then spies. Which is one reason why the uniform thing jumped out to me.

Wild ass guess here...but I suspect we've sent more un-tagged and un-official troops into sovereign nations to interfere with their sovereign activities far more...perhaps by a factor of 100...than we've ever sent in "officially".

Fish on...

Todd

The various spook arsonists have been torching sovereign nations at an ever increasing rate with both impunity and the approval of their masters holding the moral high ground in the eyes of their respective, blissful populace. For the first time, the district firefighters show up and the recidivist arsonists et al get their tighty-whities in a twist, calling the firefighters unlawful belligerents when the flames are doused without loss of life. Maybe congress and the UN will hold a vote in response. The irony of these most recent events is just rich....

History holds that currency wars generally degrade into shooting wars. Russia has the lowest national debt of the other G-20 corporations with a correspondingly low debt:GDP. Iraq and Libya, like the BRIC nations, moved away from the USD for international commerce. Wars are always a balancing of accounts and consolidation of interests. After the crash of 1907 came WWI, after the crash of 1929 came WWII. Perhaps 1939 Poland = 2014 Ukraine?

What? I thought wars were about "terrah", "they hate our freedom!", and the protection of human rights?

If they're really just about money and theft of resources on a massive scale then I guess I'll have to change my whole worldview.

Fish on...

Todd

P.S. Just kidding.

One theory being floated is that Syria, Ukraine, Venezuela,Iran others are designed fires to keep Putin busy and using massive resources at great expense much like we did the USSR. We won the Cold War by bankrupting them . The CIA spent 5 billion to light this latest fire that will cost Putin 100, of billions . They hope he will cut of gas to Europe so the Saudi cartel will pipe it in and keep them in the US sphere.

All because the Ukrainians wanted to get rid of a corrupt President.

Pretty sad but I agree with most of the analysis here.

Corruption and oil money may very well start another shooting war. Really sad as it sounds like Ukraine has enough shale oil to eventually become an exporter. Ain't in anybody's interest to bake a new pie for Ukraine when there is still money to fleece out of the existing pies.

With the internet and YouTube I wonder how long it will take for people to figure out that none of this has anything to do with freedom or ideology?

Again it's sad as this all just seems so 20th Century.

And like I said in my first post. Putin scares me. I think he's a psychopath. Some of the stories I hear from my Russian buddies are eye opening.

I've come to the conclusion that it's the natural order of humanity, in general, for psychopaths to rise to the top leadership positions because they have no moral restraint or compassion for others. They will do whatever is necessary to get power with no regard for the consequences to others. That gives them the advantage.

Just spent a few minutes looking at Google maps. Only the Russians can look at CP and think that's a good place for a navy. In order to get anywhere they got to go thru downtown Istanbul. You could take potshots with a 30-30 from your couch.

And that just gets you to the Mediterranean.

Broodbuster,

Take a look at all of Russia's "waterfront." The Black Sea port of Sebastopol is one of its best. The North Sea port isn't all season serviceable I think.

Sg

Salmo,
I knew that but had never really looked at how poor their options really were. Looking at the black sea that sure doesn't look like a great place to have a navy but I do understand they have to make do with what they got.

Best line ever used today to describe Kerry as he heads out to fuk up foreign policy some more , " a haircut in search of brain"

From the Gourdian..........

Russia is using a display of force combined with intense psychological pressure in an attempt to disarm Ukrainian military units in Crimea, according to accounts of several confrontations relayed to the Guardian.

On a day of confusion and rumours, Russian troops without insignia were still surrounding almost every Ukrainian military installation in Crimea, and an unsuccessful attempt was made to entice naval officers to defect to the Russian side.

In one tense confrontation, one of Russia's most senior army officers told a group of angry Ukrainian marines that he was carrying out Vladimir Putin's instructions to disarm Ukrainian forces. Igor Nikolayevich Turchinyuk told the marines at Feodosia that he wanted them to lock their weapons in a warehouse and surrender to Russian guards, according to an audiotape of the encounter obtained by the Guardian.


One marine asks: "Am I a terrorist? Are we causing a threat to the Black Sea fleet of Russia?" Turchinyuk replies: "We have an order, which we are carrying out. The goal of me coming here … is to carry out the task given by the president of the Russian Federation in agreement with your legitimately elected president [Viktor Yanukovych]."

During another encounter at the headquarters of Ukraine's fleet on Monday morning, Ukrainian navy officers rejected pleas for them to defect to the self-declared Crimean government.

The naval head, Denis Berezovsky, who on Sunday announced he was defecting to the Russian-backed Crimean authorities, addressed officers at naval command in Sevastopol to try to convince them to follow suit. But his replacement, Serhiy Haiduk, was also present and appeared to win the day.

The officers broke into applause as Haiduk read them an order from Kiev removing Berezovsky from his position, and told them that Berezovsky was facing treason charges. When Haiduk had finished his dry but compelling address, the officers spontaneously broke into the national anthem, and some were seen to cry. Berezovsky showed no visible sign of emotion.


"I know my men will stay loyal to their oaths," Haiduk told the Guardian before the address. "What Berezovsky has done is a matter for him alone. When he brought intruders in here, we did not offer armed resistance as would have been our right, in order to avoid any provocations the other side would like."

Officers at the HQ said Berezovsky had been guilty of treachery twice, the first time when he broke his oath, and the second time on Monday morning, when he requested permission to enter the headquarters and let several Russian special forces officers slip in behind him.

When Berezovsky requested questions from the officers, a chorus of criticism broke from the ranks. "In what way exactly did foreign powers intervene in Kiev, compared to the way they are intervening now in Crimea?" asked an officer to applause. "Don't ask provocative questions," Berezovsky barked back.

"We are resolving the matter by peaceful means, but we will never surrender our weapons," Haiduk said.

Berezovsky refused to comment to the press. In the end, he left the building accompanied only by his guards.

While the navy was asked to defect to Crimean authorities, those at bases in Kerch and Bakhchisarai said they had been asked by the Russians not only to defect to Crimean authorities but to the Russian army itself.

At Bakhchisarai, Lieutenant Colonel Vladimir Dokuchayev said: "There were suggestions that we joined the 'Crimean people', whatever that means, but first and foremost they asked us to join the Russian army. There was no talk of how this would work logistically, it didn't get to that. We said no, obviously."

There is tremendous pressure on the troops, surrounded as they are by Russians, and many of them have their own domestic pressure. Many ethnic Russians in Crimea favour the idea of a union with Russia, and some of them are sending messages to friends and relatives in the army urging them to desert.

"Many of us are receiving messages and calls from friends and family," said Dokuchayev. "Of course, that is never going to work for officers, it's pointless, but it has worked on some of the rank and file. We don't obstruct them, if people want to leave, they can."

He admitted that some had taken up the offer, but would not say how many, except to claim it was "a small number". A Ukrainian television journalist present at Bakhchisarai begged an interior ministry representative to ask authorities in Kiev to make more public statements in support of the troops in Crimea.

"We've had a lot of people calling in, they are terrified, they want to keep their oath but they don't know what is happening and are worried about getting proper support from Kiev," he said.

Among the officer class, however, even those who are fans of Russia are refusing to budge. One voice on the tape from Feodosia says: "From my childhood I have lived right next to Russia, we have always looked at Russia like an older brother or a helper, and we always were thrilled by your courage in different wars and operations, and saw you as a defender and expected help in any situation. Nobody could have imagined that such an awful time would have come to our country, but in our weakest moment, you have decided to do this. Do you not think your current behaviour will ruin not only our country but yours?"

The general responds with a long answer about Russia's greatness, which culminates in an ode to the Winter Olympics, held last month in Sochi. "The international community trusted Russia to hold the Olympic Games, and not every country in the world is trusted with something like that," he says.

In Sevastopol, officers listened sullenly as Berezovsky tried to entice them over to the newly proclaimed Crimean fleet he now heads – assuring them they would retain their ranks and that there would be no interruption of salary payments. "Viktor Yanukovych is the legitimately elected president of Ukraine," he told them, arguing there would be no breach of oath if they served Crimea. "The seizure of power in Kiev was orchestrated from abroad," he said.

Timur, a Ukrainian frigate captain who declined to give his last name for fear of threats to his family, said: "I will stay true to my oath and I am sure this is also true of my fellow officers."

Not helping matters is the fact that despite the fact that the well-organised and heavily armed troops are arriving in vehicles with Russian military plates and introducing themselves inside the bases as Russians, a bizarre pretence is still being maintained that the men are some kind of locally inspired volunteer unit.

At Bakhchisarai, Vladimir Mertsalov, a representative of Crimea's newly proclaimed authorities, said he had no idea who the Russian troops were. "I don't know if they are Russians. I can't tell you who they are, I have no idea, I haven't asked them, but all I know is that they are guaranteeing our security here," he said.

Later, in Sevastopol, the head of the local branch of the pro-Russian "Russian Bloc" party, Vladimir Tyunin denied there were any Russian forces present. "Where are Russian troops here? These are our local self-defence units," he said, pointing to the masked and heavily armed soldiers standing behind him in front of the Navy HQ gates.

Away from the stand off at the Navy HQ, there was also a quiet but ominous standoff in Sevastopol bay, between Ukrainian naval vessels and the Russian Black Sea fleet.

On Monday, Russia's Black Sea fleet was seen to be blocking the mouth of the harbour, by anchoring a cable-laying ship in the channel on the inside of the breakwater, and positioning a corvette in the channel outside the breakwater. Ukrainian ships are alongside but manned and ready to sail for Odessa, according to the source.There were rumours of an ultimatum from Russian forces to Ukrainian units to surrender by 5am local time on Tuesday or face a storm, but although the defence ministry in Kiev appeared to confirm them, local sources on the ground said they had heard nothing, and the Russian ministry of defence denied any ultimatum had been given.

Gonna be a shooting war by Thursday night. I don't think the Ukranians are going to buckle. I saw in another article the size of Ukrains active military and it was pretty sizable.

And for the record I still believe that not wearing Russian uniforms is chickenshit! Once they figure out the military Ukrainians aren't going to be traitors they'll blow something up and blame it on terrorists or extremists. I guess that play book has already been written.

This has the potential to get ugly