Chris and Mellisa,
I am gonna offer you a little advice, whether you take it or not is up to you, but I have followed up on alot of your posts and you both have lots and lots of questions. First things first, trying to get a guy or gals honey hole out of them is damn near impossible. I am not saying that you can't get it sometimes but it is pretty rare. Names like the Cowlitz and the Hoh are as popular as Coke and Pepsi, everyone has experienced it at least once. I am not putting down the Cowlitz or the Hoh but you have to understand that with big names comes big crouds. If you don't mind fishing in crouds then there isn't a problem, but for those of us that like to have some peace and quiet like to venture out and find our own little river all to ourselves. I would have to say that if you want to hook fish with out alot of experience the Cowlitz is probably a good bet, with the large numbers of fish in that system, once you master your skills you can go out and go after the rivers with few fish in them and the fish that are there are hard to catch. When you reach that point you know you have accomplished alot since you began. You ask alot of questions on what to use. First start off with the best gear that you can afford, no you don't need a new Loomis and Chronarch reel but you will want one after you play with one for a trip. Fishing for summer runs is an experience. Often times conditions are low and clear and you need to use light gear. I would start off with a 4 foot 6 pound leader with tandem #4 Gamakatsu hooks, put a small orange cheater inbetween the two hooks and run small dime size egg clusters. This is the norm on the Cowlitz for the guides. You don't need the tandem hooks but it will increase hook ups for begginers. There shouldn't be a fish in the river that will be scared of that setup. You will loose alot of fish with the 6 pound leader at first, but you will get the hang of it. Jigs are also a good bet. More and more people are fishing jigs and floats each year, why? because they are real effective. I hope this helps you out a little bit and if you have any questions you can email me at answer@techline.com

Thanks,
Andy Matthews http://The_Steelhead_Solution.homestead.com

Andy,
Well, first off I would like to say I like to ask questions to know more about the rivers, steelhead, bait and other fisherman. Second of all I don't know if you are talking bad to me or not. I like to think of myself as a friendly guy. I like to ask questions to learn more stuff I am sorry that affends you. Also, thanks for the info.
Here is another question for you how is the Nooch doing?

Chris

Hey Chris and Pink Corky, I have to agree with Andy, but I think you misread him a bit. What he basically said is what I've stressed in some posts on here. Don't go to where you've heard the fishing is (ie Nooch, Hoh, Cowlitz), unless it's a river you plan on mainly fishing. It takes more then a trip with one person to figure out a river (though floating with someone experienced will help). Actually, if you find someone on here that will truly tell you ALL the details on a river, they've either 1. heard it from a 2nd source, or 2. are lying about it. Someone who exclusively fishes a river will tell a river level report, but will rarely tell how many fish they caught and how many fish they saw in a river except to close friends. (Plus, how many times do people lie about catching to make them more of a fisherperson?) The best thing to do you two is to figure out what rivers you want to fish. Then go and explore them. Take advice on tackle, most people won't lie there, and go find that honeyhole. I mainly fish the Nooch, Humptulips, Hoh, and a few misc. rivers that few people fish, so I won't divulge them here. Its not arrogance, it's knowlege of history that keeps someone who catches fish truly "lockjawed" about fishing rivers. Say it this way, I know alot of rivers well, but I can rarely tell you slot names and such, since I don't discuss them with people. I know some, only due to common names (Black Creek, Blue Creek, Crossover Bridge, etc etc) But I know places by landmarks, not names. I don't mind taking people for floats, but once I get to know them or if they already know where I'm fishing. All the rivers I know I've either learned with my Dad how to fish, or have explored on my own. It's more fun and you can have some quality time with Ms Corky that way too. I'm sure your big problem is you may not have a boat, but nothing that time won't fix pretty quick (my first big expense upon graduation from high school was a boat) so get to it. If you have any questions about gear, or finding a boat. Email me at Steelheader69@prodigy.net . I'm actually very willing to help, especially since you're younger and I'd assume your parents must not fish, or have time to. It's just that once you get older, you'll get a bit jaded about your favorite river. It's funny to fish a river exclusively for a year straight, and what the flux of anglers can be depending on what the reports have been. Good luck to you and Pink and maybe we'll be in touch. Tight lines...Jerry

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you haven't lived til you're rowed a cataraft. Friends don't let friends run Outcasts.

I'd like to thank you guys for your thoughts, but I really just like to talk about fishing with people and when I ask questions it is just to learn more about you people and get to know the rivers around here. Sorry, but I didn't know how "sacred" some of these fishing holes are. Chris and I have fished a lot around here, but we're just looking to expand our horizons, we won't try to steal your fishing places.

Thanks,
Melissa

Exploring a place and finding fish and mastering it that is the fun part for me.I,m willing to share the basics with anyone but as far as my favorite hole I dont even tell my best friends. If you do the exploring you will find them on your own and that is very satisfying. Try it you guys just pick a river and explore its a kick!

Chris,
I am just trying to help ya out. I am not talking bad to you at all. Just thought I would put my .02 in. The Nooch is slow and with this rain it is up and moving, can you say they weren't there and now they came and went? I am sure there are fish there but they are on the move, and moving is the only thing they have on their mind. I would go elsewhere, possibley the Cowlitz.

Andy

Thanks guys. I will put it to use. As you guys might know I live in poulsbo. There is not much river fishing up here and I just want to learn how to fish. Andy,Steelheader69, bbouncer thanks for the in put.
Well see you on the river sometime.

Chris

Chris and pink corky your are right the only way to learn is to ask questions. I know some people dont like to be asked alot of questions about when and where there fishing.
But there are some that dont mind at all and getting the truth out of them is a whole different storie.. As for the Nooch it was very slow maybe this major blow out will help. Good luck and maybe i'll see the two of you on the river sometime.

Steely Slammer

Melissa/Chris:

My background--born Seattle, raised in Kent and Redmond areas. 3 yrs. army, 5 yrs. with Standard Oil of Ca., married in 63, went to S. Dakota for a teaching degree but when I started looking for a job.....I knew it was going to be in Wa. State. Now with that background what I did....got a map out, looked where the activites that I most liked would be....then applied for jobs in those areas. Lucked out, got a teaching job in Aberdeen....now retired.....spent 100's of hours learning rivers, watching others, listening, trying different things, bought 2 kinds of boats(jet and drift), thousands of dollars in fishing tackle, read as many books, magazines(Salmon and Steelheader, have all from 1977 to 2000), go to trade shows. Bottom line have spent the time and effort to really enjoy my pasttime.

Don't like to see anyone give information as to "what rock to stand on, what exact gear to use, what exact bait to use, what exact river to go to, etc."

Have seen what happens when papers, sporting goods stores, hotlines, people, etc. start pushing a certain river or area. Everyone wants to go where the fishng is the "hottest" the problem is...many of the rivers JUST CAN'T stand that kind of pressure or the mess that often gets left behind.

Remember I chose to live where I do for the outdoor activites...fishing, clamming, berry picking, etc.......too many want the "good life" then want to go where the fishing is....sorry.....don't expect help from the locals!!!!!!!!!!

Well, steelie slammer thanks for being a good guy. I can tell that you are one of the friendly fisherman.
Drifterwa,
Hey man if i affended you by asking questions I much say sorry. I just got a drift boat and I am learning it. I don't want which rock to stand on, I just want to know where people are catching fish. You said " Bottom line have spent the time and effort to really enjoy my past time." This forum is kind of like the research you did. I did not ask for peoples background I I just asked were is good fishing? I can tell you were a great teacher (treating kids this way.) Do you think that I should be able to ask questions? What else is there to do on this forum? I enjoy most of the people on this forum. I guess i made the wrong one mad.

Chris

My .02 Try the nooch on friday or saturday should be good after the rain we had.

The counts are looking good for going to Bonneville and fishing for SHAD. Thats where I will be this weekend....if anyone else goes, I am always wearing my MIAMI DOLPHINS hat, stop and say hi!

Chris,
I along with others have offered you advice on what to ask and how to approach someone with these types of questions, heres another tip, drop the damn attitude, we weren't complaining about you asking questions at all, where do you get that from? I was just giving you a chance at some free info, and drifterWa's advice you should take, he's been fishing longer than most of us, what is it now Bill, like 100 and some odd years? Chris if you are going to have this attitude don't look for me for any tips.

Andy

Andy,
Ok, fine you guys win. I will not ask anymore questions. Don't you think that Drifterwa gave me a little attitude telling me his whole life story. Fine let's just drop it ok. I won't ask as many questions. I wanted to learn more about fishing thats all I didn't want to offend you. Drifter should know: Asking questions + listening to responses = knowledge.

Ok This is bothering me. I don't like it when people are mad at me. Can we please drop this. Sorry I gave a attitude. I want everyone to think of me and my girlfriend as nice aand friendly fisherpeople. Ok, sorry and thinks for the info I will use it wisely. Is everyone cool with that?

Drifterwa: Sorry that i was a little disrespectful.

Christopher

Ok you guys want to know where the fish are? Like was mentioned in an earlyer post. Look into SHAD fishing!!!! I havn't done it yet but from the sounds of it I am going to give a try. I hope to get out this weekend for the first time. from the sounds of it it's allmost a gauranteed thing. and it sounds cheap. exept for the drive. you live a little farther than me but if you wanna have the fun time of catchimng lots of fish give it a try.

You say you have a drift boat. then you should give the Cowlitz a try. like others have said in the past. it's a good river for beginers and with a little beginers luck you could catch something.


dcrzfitter

It doesn't matter if you tell somebody where
the fish are what to use,remember 10 percent
of the fishermen catch 90 percent of the
fish anyways.

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Chris: Asking questions + listening to responses = Knowledge, HMMMMMMMMMMMM I give you an (A) for the day. Oh and Andy i think your right about Bill fishing for 100 and some odd years,him and that baby fish killer of his.Thats why there isnt many fish around.LOL

[This message has been edited by steely slammer (edited 06-12-2000).]

Steely Slammer,
I see that you are from G.H. do we know eachother? Just curious on who you are.

Thanks,
Andy

Thanks that is probably the only "A" I will get this quarter. I am glad tomorrow is our last day.

Chris

Randy, I see you're hitting the Bonneville for shad. One shred of advice -- fish the rough side. I've hit it three times over the last two weeks, and that's where it's happening! P.S. I think my legs have finally gotten used to climbing out of that blasted canyon, while packing my two out.

To all,

Here's my advice if you want to get into shad at the Bonne. Use standard terminal tackle, i.e., pencil lead, swivel etc. I used a 9' Lami rated for 2-6 lb test. I spooled on 6 lb and used about a 3 foot leader. The key though is the lure - a plain, undressed shad dart on about a size 6 hook. By plain I mean brass hook, no skirt, no paint, no feathers - you get it. Throw out about 30 feet (max) quartering upstream. Don't go for the steelhead style bump, bump, bump drift action - you'll lose way too much gear. But you will want to contact bottom every couple of seconds. Let it swing, and set the hook (not too hard) when it stops. It pretty much doesn't matter which rock you stand on 'cuz at peak there'll be literally about a million of 'em below the dam. I gladly give this advice 'cuz I no longer live in Washington. Hope some of you find success with this method. Good luck.

Hoh--

Zip it!!

Chris & Pink Corky
As posted else where in this thread some of us hold certain places sacred. This is the nature of the beast. My advice is to learn what you can from others and then develop your own style. As a 3rd generation native of WA. I learned alot from some execllent fishers, but the most fun I've had is exploring & finding my own "honey holes". Getting to new places is almost as much fun as fishing new waters. Enjoy what a awesome place this is. Go out and purchase a Washington Atlas/Gazetter. I'm on my 4th copy and it goes with me everywhere. Also buy a copy of Washington Fishing Guide. This book list 99% of lakes & streams in Wa. & what fish live there. I remember being young as you 2 are and look back at those times as my apprenticeship. Anyone who does not tutor an apprentice should. After all we started at the same place. Without asking questions and trial & error we would not have honed our skills. Fishing is a life long adventure and you never know it all. Who knows maybe some where in the future you will be able to take what you all have learned and turn it into a profession. The worst day fishing is still better than the best day working, unless you guide. Then you have the best of both worlds!!
Tight Lines & Smilin' Faces

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Tahnks I will go and get one.

Chris

Chris/Pink,

Look at it this way. Some guys won't give you any info, some guys will show you whatever they know. Learn all you can from the guys that will share info, and forget about the others. No sense in worrying what they think of you if they aren't willing to give advice.

Keep asking questions. Those that want to offer info will, those that don't want to offer any info shouldn't be any concern to you.


Fish on.......

Chris:

Didn't view it as "disrespectful"....I tend to get on "my high horse" sometimes.

Now that I'm retired I see things happening that is not good for fishing in my area. Less fish in other areas, means guides, and other fisherpersons...go to where they think the fishing is better or so they've heard. Observation shows that I've seen more "guide stickers, on more boats, in the past 3 yrs., in this area, than I saw in the previous 29.

"Hang in there"....if you have a "thin skin" many of the rednecks that fish, surely will stick many a pin in it. Sometimes I say things just to "stir the pot", then I turn up the heat.

Looked up Knowledge....sure not defined the way, you saw it......I'd sure put, trial/error, reseach, in there with the questions, listening...

Have a great day!!! Remember "The worse day sport fishing, is better than the best day working"

Steely Slammer:

Nice that you would give someone a "A grade" sure was something you didn't get in high school.....lol Do you even remember being in school?????

See you on the river!!!!....maybe take you for a run in my "fish killer" jet boat...river is on the drop......big time.....ohhhhhhhhhhhh fish on..again!!!!

Lighten up on Hoh, Backlash. EVERYONE already knows the Wind R. canyon is plugged with springers. EVERYONE!

Right on guys!!!!!!!

Schools out by the way.

Chris

Fishtick--
It has got to be uncomfortable sitting that way, with your head up your.....nevermind. You're the one who needs to lighten up. It's incredibly obvious from the amount of people that it's no secret. Apparently my attempt at sarcasm was lost on you...figures.

[This message has been edited by backlash2 (edited 06-14-2000).]

Chris and Pinkie you need to understand this,people on this BB for the most part are always full of advice, most of it good.The problem here lies ( in my opion) this modern thing we call the internet, makes everything faster especialy information...Thats the problem... most of us had to learn the hard way... years of watching and listening I've seen technices shared on this BB that took me years to figure out and then explained in about a minute,everyone does'nt want to wait.Basiclly we can give all the advice in the world but you are still going to have to pay you're dues...bottom line we all did ,there is no replacement for experience.You guys hang in there and good luck...Tight Lines...Mike

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Row Quietly and fish a Cataraft }<<(('>----<'))>>{
Release all Wild Fish

Agree with Big Jim ---It doesn't matter if you tell somebody where
the fish are what to use,remember 10 percent
of the fishermen catch 90 percent of the
fish anyways.

I agree with Osprey-this web page makes access to info----easy. I have friends that have recently started fishing, and its hard to give up info that you/I have discovered by by bushwacking&ripping waders into a honey hole or oops walk out to a spot that just dont fish--reroute "where's my truck?" or thanks to taking a trip with a guide you have learned $$.Some spots are better untold, eh.

[This message has been edited by Coho (edited 06-14-2000).]