Ok I presently really dislike Slade, but when I drove though forks the other day I saw signs supporting him in the local tackle store and some businesses. Being of the open mind sort that I am...Tell me why I should vote for him over the opposition.

Tight Lines



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Marty
Steelheader.net marty@steelheader.net

marty,
I am finally to the legal voting age and I am very excited to put my vote in against him. Well, I thought I would tell you my opinion.

Chris

Marty,

If you read the comments section of the WDFW Proposed Rule Changes, you'll see that the Forks locals love to rank on Bob (or Robert Ball, as they refer to him) for his support of C&R regs on the Forks area rivers. So it's no surprise to me that they'd love a guy like Slade Gorton. You hate for your state to lose seniority (power, in other words) in the US congress, but Slade is one guy I'd love to see take a vacation from office.

The question is, are his opponents also net-lovers, but from the liberal side of politics? In that case, I'll have to consider my vote VERY carefully. Oh, hell, who am I kidding, I'd vote for a chimpanzee before I could bring myself to vote for Slade "I never met a dam I didn't like" Gorton. Just my $.02


Fish on........

The dams have to go and so does Slade!!!!

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Tight Lines!!

Dan S. There it goes again the stated sentiment that nets are the big problem! Get it straight will you its pollution, dams, and riparian zone degradation, not nessecarily in that order that have brought the fisheries resources of this state to the sorry situation that exisist.
Slade Gortons opposition to meaningful changes in forest practices and agricultural and grazing rights curtailment are easy to read about. He is always voting with the western block of big development oriented legislators for additional funding of water projects that continue the decline in fish populations.
His stead fast support of riders on appropriations bills is killing the taxpayers as a whole, I could go on for days about ths jerk. Lets end it with the thought do you really want to have as your senior Senator the former Attorney General of Washington State that lost the Boldt Decesion.
Now this ia a RANT!

You are right about the other three, but I would still put NETS at the top of the list. Anyway, Slade must go he is a crook.

The Sierra club is on a mission to educate the public about slade. I have heard of his "ack room deals" and hope to vote him out of office. Anyone know who we could vote for?
In response to the net comment: It is very easy to lay blame on nets. Blame is why nothing gets done. Everyone wants to say that "I have no affect on fish" but when it comes down to it we all do. Yes even us fisherfolk!
Also when you make a statement like "nets are the only problem" You immediately put some people on the offensive. Those people will then quit listening to what you say.

VOTE THIS BUM OUT! Cant say it any clearer. Example: I asked him about the dams on the Elwha (spelling?), and he said "I dont see any real need to remove them", (I.E. benifit). If you pay attention to what goes on in the newspaper from time to time, you will see a trend with this guy. Supports mining companys with no environmental monitoring, see's no bendfit to dam removal, wants increased logging with no restrictions, not around, not seen on high seas drift nets, just today in the paper he opposes money for parks, and on and on and on. Get rid of him now!

Native Boy,
This is just a friendly question: do you think that nets don't do anything to the fish population. The only thing that effecteds the fish are ripariam zone degradation, dams and pollution, in your opionin.

Addict: To answer your question on alternatives to Slade, there are two Dems in the running -- Maria Cantwell (former Congressperson) and Deborah Senn (current state insurance commissioner). The primary will decide which one goes against Gorton, but either would be an improvement!

Native Son,

The dams in question are of questionable economic value. The case made to keep them intact is not strong enough to outweigh the damage they do to the fish, in my opinion. And the Elwha dam issue is laughable. Yeah, let's throw up a dam to power a pulp mill and wipe out a run of some of the largest Chinook in N. America. And once the fish are on the brink of extinction, let's refuse to admit our mistake, for fear that someone might accuse us of being an "environmentalist" GASP!!! Sorry if you don't see it that way, but I do. Tell you what, why don't you just head to the polls and cancel out my vote for whomever or whatever is running against Slade? That's how it's done, so we'll see in November.

And as for the nets, here's my opinion for you. The Native comercial harvest is provided in the treaties and isn't even a factor here. Every returning fish has already survived the dams, habitat degradation, ocean conditions, bids, etc. Now it's a question of how much of the pie goes to sports anglers and non-Tribal commercial netters. In the past and in this case the netters pay least and take most. I want sport fishing to get more at the expense of NON-TRIBAL COMMERCIAL NETS. Is that clear enough? Nets, dams, anglers, habitat all have something to do with it. I'm addressing just two of the issues here. They just happen to be the two issues that are easiest to address. Unless, Native Son, you have a proposal to regulate: urban growth and devlopment, water usage, high seas dumping of chemical waste, bird predation, transportation, nuclear waste storage, logging, road building, farming, and everything else facing these fish runs.

Fish on........

[This message has been edited by Dan S. (edited 07-19-2000).]

Chris, I personaly find the use of gillnets and for the most part siene nets to be under regulated in the State of Washington. The use of a gear type in the prosecution of a fishery is only good if it is done with effective monitoring and enforcement by competent managers and adequate enforcement personel. I am getting a pretty clear picture that we might be lacking here in Washington in this regard. As to which is worse on fish, nets, or all the other problems facing salmon in the northwest one only has to look up north to Alaska where annuual harvest by the various users is measured in millions of fish and then walk the streams after all those netfishers trollers and sport fishers have been fishing and look at the millions of salmon that are choking the unlogged undamned unpolluted streams.
To many times people in general tend to look at the other guy, the other tribe if you will to give up the little of what is left so he she they or I can have the little thats left. This whole thing about attacking everybody else to get the last fish will get us just that "The Last Fish"

Steelhead Addict, maybe you would like to explain to us why the Sierra Club didn't support the "Ban All Nets" initiative.

Native,

You can not directly compare the returns to alaska with those of WA. I agree that Dams, logging, riperian disturction (grazing), siltation, and netting are some of the couses of the reduced escapement number. Elimination of netting is simple going to be the quickest way to begin enhancement of returns. For cutlural reasons dip nets should work in most regions with a little open communication.

thick

Salmontackler, I'll answer that on the skinny that I have. The Enviromental movement although late to the party when it comes to fisheries has recently been effective in working with fisheries organizations in Alaska. Tongass and Chugach National forest reform,riverine protection, oil tanker safety, offshore drilling regulations, and even the Marine Mamal Protection Act, are all partly the result of various groups working together.
After having worked with groups who represent commercial fishing intrest it is not really Kosher to jump on the band wagon of an initative (with no chance of succes), that is stated to kill the jobs of the same people you just won with on all the other issues.
Also in the recent past, early 90's ,the organization S.E.A.C.O.P.S. was started funded and staffed almost entirely by commercial fishers. The sole purpose of the organization was to provide information on the high seas interception of North American Salmon by Asian Driftnetters on the high seas. In that goal the organization was quite successful and alliances were informaly created once again between fishing organizations across the spectrum with many of the enviromental organizations.
Shortly after the United States, Soviet Union, and Japan, got the United Natons ban on highseas driftnetting passed as a law of the sea sport fishing groups siezed upon the concept of painting small scale domestic gillnetters with the same brush. This relly pissed off the gillnetters and sieners and they demanded that the enviros back off on any support for a ban on small scale domestic commercial fishing.
Then there is also the view held by many that the whole net ban disscusion is a "Red Herring" and well meaning folks are being duped into supporting it in lieu of getting focused on the real problem dams, logging, mineing,(sic) and agriculture.
Once again I really hope to make this issue clear and my only purpose in these post is to try and get information out there. I read this board for along time before I started posting and I must say the majority of the members appear to have the fishes intrest at heart but if you don't have all the information it makes it difficult to tell fact from fiction.

Just to add on to Native's post:
I voted for the initiative, but I regret it now ( even though it didn't pass)> The idea was to get rid of nets, but the initiative on the ballot was to stop all commercial fishing, both net and trawl. This in my opinion is why the initiative didn't pass

What the heck? Maria Cant-do anything-well or Deborah Senn? I don't want to get off on a rant here but if you folks think that a couple of nanny state socialists will in any way improve life or fishing in this state you're all licking frogs. Who has appointed the last few WDFW chiefs? Liberal democrats. Who has run this state into the ground financially, morally, educationally? Liberal democrats! Deborah Senn is personally responsible for the cost of health insurance in this state doubling over the last 6 years (ask your boss!) and the number of insurers going from over thirty to TWO. Yeh, that is freedom of choice. Liberal democrats have cost this state over thirty million dollars is DSHS settlements this year alone!!!!!! How much fishing opportunity could that buy??????? Slade is no saint I admit, but he is a far cry better than someone who thinks they know better what kind of car you should drive (a public bus), how you should raise you kids(on ridlan in a failing public school unable to read)If you think you can raise your kids, just swat one on the behind at a mall and see how long it takes CPS to visit your home, how much of your money you should be able to keep(inflation 2.5% property tax increase 20% in 2000, 13% in 1999)What you can eat(recently introduced "fat tax" to discourage meat eating), how much fuel you can buy($0.43 PER GALLON gas tax), how free you can be(2 sheriffs for 720 square miles in graham with 40 mph roads, that means a one hour response time and Maria and Deborah don't think we can be trusted with weapons to defend our families, in an area with the highest concentration of meth labs in the state!!!!!!) What you can own(if you think you own your home, truck, boat just stop paying your lease payments to the gov't(TAXES,FEES,TABS) Hell, us peasants can't even fish for pleasure without PAYING FOR THE PRIVELEGE(paying for certain, unalienable rights) If you guys want to be single issue voters, go right ahead. If you really want to make this a better country for EVERYONE (not just me,me,me) vote for MORE freedom, LOWER taxes, LESS gov't intrusion in our lives. If you don't like Slade, vote for a conservative libertarian. Remember, those dams were there for a long time BEFORE the fish runs went to hell. Idaho steelhead travel over 8 dams and they still have good runs most years. (yes I know they also have the largest hatchery)

When looking back at Slade Gorton's track record, I do not know how anybody who is somewhat concerned not only about having fish to fish for but also about the air that their children breathe and the water their children drink can vote for Gorton.
I would rather have a femi-nazi women telling what to do then have no fish to fish for, not have clean water to drink, not have clean air to breathe, not have parks to walk in, not have forests to hike through etc. etc. etc. ...you get my point.
wit45cal: Swallow your redneck pride and put the fish first, I do not honestly believe the democrat forerunners are bust into your house and take away your kids for spanking them nor are they going to take away your cars and make you ride the bus especially considering that Wa. State DSHS cant manage to protect parents from killing their kids let alone spanking them.

--Ryan

Slade must go anybody who supports fishing with nets and keeping useless dams that block hundreds of miles of spawning ground does not care about the fish. enough said
RAMPRAT

Thanks for the responses. I must admit I did like one of slades proposed intiatives. He wanted to make it legal to sue the tribes. Presently we have no legal recourse if we disagree with the tribes. But of course he switched his position on that one too after some back door deal. The native americans are putting a all out assault against him this coming election. Ever wonder why? Guess he should have followed though with his initiatives instead of switching at the last minute. Thanks again for your insights.

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Marty
Steelheader.net marty@steelheader.net