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#955945 - 04/19/16 03:00 PM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
OncyT Offline
Spawner

Registered: 02/06/08
Posts: 511
The Tribes and State are meeting again right now.

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#955953 - 04/19/16 05:08 PM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: BroodBuster]
Lucky Louie Offline
Carcass

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 2267
Originally Posted By: BroodBuster

If it was the tribes killing all of our ESA listed fish in Canada and Ak we, the sports fishermen, would be taking the exact same stance that they are!

I hear what you are saying but doesn’t this issue not only affect the Puget Sound tribes but also the Puget Sound sport anglers and the Puget Sound NT commercials?

Shouldn’t all three entities wanting more fish to come back to Puget Sound be working together on this issue instead of what is going on right now?
_________________________
The world will not be destroyed by those that are evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything.- Albert Einstein

No you can’t have my rights---I’m still using them





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#955955 - 04/19/16 06:44 PM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
Todd Offline
Dick Nipples

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 27838
Loc: Seattle, Washington USA
WDFW to seek federal permit for Puget Sound
fisheries after talks with tribes end

OLYMPIA – State fishery managers have decided to separately secure the federal permit required to hold salmon fisheries this season in Puget Sound.

The decision was made Tuesday after negotiations over salmon seasons with tribal leaders again came to an impasse. The Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW) and the tribes last week could not reach an agreement during the annual season-setting process.

“We had hoped additional conversations with the tribes would result in fisheries that were agreeable to both parties,” said Jim Unsworth, director of the department. “Unfortunately, that did not happen, but our door remains open to further discussions.”

WDFW officials said it is uncertain whether the department will have the permit in time to hold recreational and non-tribal commercial salmon fisheries in Puget Sound through much of the season. The permit is necessary to hold fisheries in Puget Sound where there are fish stocks protected under the federal Endangered Species Act.

Tribal fishery managers are expected to separately seek federal permits from NOAA Fisheries for salmon fisheries in Puget Sound.

Over the course of negotiations, the department proposed fisheries that maintained some fishing opportunities and met conservation objectives, said Ron Warren, head of WDFW’s Fish Program.

“This isn’t the outcome we had hoped for, but we will do our best to obtain a federal permit as quickly as possible,” Warren said.

******************

Fish on...

Todd
_________________________


Team Flying Super Ditch Pickle


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#955962 - 04/19/16 08:32 PM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Todd]
fishbadger Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 03/06/01
Posts: 1190
Loc: Gig Harbor, WA
Originally Posted By: Todd
WDFW to seek federal permit for Puget Sound
fisheries after talks with tribes end

OLYMPIA – State fishery managers have decided to separately secure the federal permit required to hold salmon fisheries this season in Puget Sound.

The decision was made Tuesday after negotiations over salmon seasons with tribal leaders again came to an impasse. The Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW) and the tribes last week could not reach an agreement during the annual season-setting process.

“We had hoped additional conversations with the tribes would result in fisheries that were agreeable to both parties,” said Jim Unsworth, director of the department. “Unfortunately, that did not happen, but our door remains open to further discussions.”

WDFW officials said it is uncertain whether the department will have the permit in time to hold recreational and non-tribal commercial salmon fisheries in Puget Sound through much of the season. The permit is necessary to hold fisheries in Puget Sound where there are fish stocks protected under the federal Endangered Species Act.

Tribal fishery managers are expected to separately seek federal permits from NOAA Fisheries for salmon fisheries in Puget Sound.

Over the course of negotiations, the department proposed fisheries that maintained some fishing opportunities and met conservation objectives, said Ron Warren, head of WDFW’s Fish Program.

“This isn’t the outcome we had hoped for, but we will do our best to obtain a federal permit as quickly as possible,” Warren said.

******************

Fish on...

Todd


. . . .strike two. . .

fb
_________________________
"Laugh if you want to, it really is kinda funny, cuz the world is a car and you're the crash test dummy"
All Hail, The Devil Makes Three

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#955966 - 04/19/16 08:58 PM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
stonefish Offline
King of the Beach

Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 5187
Loc: Carkeek Park
I'm still pleased WDFW didn't agree with the tribes on no PS season this year.
I'm sure there are some upper end politicians in Olympia that aren't pleased with WDFW right now, especially considering where some of their political support and donations come from.
If you'd like to let Jay Inslee know your thoughts on these negotiations if that is what you'd call them, here is link that will let you voice your opinion to him.
I sent him a note letting him know I back WDFW's decision not to agree with the tribal demands of having no PS fishing season this year.
Even if we end up with no season, I commend WDFW for having the backbone to say no to the tribes.
SF

https://fortress.wa.gov/es/governor/
_________________________
Go Dawgs!
Founding Member - 2023 Pink Plague Opposition Party
#coholivesmatter

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#955973 - 04/19/16 09:39 PM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
GodLovesUgly Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 1249
Loc: WaRshington
In the words of the great Bart Simpson,

"You're damned if you do, you're damned if you don't."


Agreement or no agreement it doesn't really fvcking matter. We aren't fishing. The tribe gets their cake and'll eat it too.


Edited by GodLovesUgly (04/19/16 09:40 PM)
_________________________
When I grow up I want to be,
One of the harvesters of the sea.
I think before my days are done,
I want to be a fisherman.

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#955985 - 04/19/16 10:30 PM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
fishbadger Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 03/06/01
Posts: 1190
Loc: Gig Harbor, WA
Yup they beat us this year. We're easy to beat. Bunch of one-on-one dribble-drive stuff, very little ball movement. Not playing team ball.

If the rec's could get together as a user group we'd be formidable; way more money and upside than the opponent. But we just don't play team ball. Maybe we need a new coach, or new uni's,

fb
_________________________
"Laugh if you want to, it really is kinda funny, cuz the world is a car and you're the crash test dummy"
All Hail, The Devil Makes Three

Top
#955993 - 04/20/16 06:45 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
RUNnGUN Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 1394
It was brought up to seek a Federal permit to recreational fish PS. It also was stated the permit process might take longer than the season itself, which still would mean no fishing. The Tribes have stated they would also seek a Federal permit to fish. My question? Would or could their permit process take just as long preventing them from fishing? This almost seems like an end around to negotiate in good faith, by either party. No agreement, no fishing for anyone, period!


Edited by RUNnGUN (04/20/16 06:46 AM)
_________________________
"Life moves pretty fast. If you don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it.” – Ferris Bueller.
Don't let the old man in!

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#955994 - 04/20/16 07:07 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
toobad Offline
Fry

Registered: 11/22/15
Posts: 25
I read somewhere,maybe here,that the tribes get precedent on approval because of the treaties and ESA listings.To me it kind of looks like a game. WDFW is pretending to stand up for the license buyers and will ultimately blame the closed season on the feds. WDF is playing us.Hope I am wrong but no saltwater money from me this year and letters to Unsworth and Inslee saying why.

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#955995 - 04/20/16 07:18 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: RUNnGUN]
Lucky Louie Offline
Carcass

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 2267
Originally Posted By: RUNnGUN
The Tribes have stated they would also seek a Federal permit to fish. My question? Would or could their permit process take just as long preventing them from fishing? This almost seems like an end around to negotiate in good faith, by either party. No agreement, no fishing for anyone, period!

Both sides could be in jeopardy of being shore bound in Puget Sound and not fishing without an agreement, according to the NOAA's letter regarding "going alone."

“In addition, a separate tribal plan could require a new NEPA assessment by the BIA. While NOAA Fisheries believes proposals for tribal only fisheries could receive ESA approval so long as conservation objectives were being met, it is likely that the analysis and review of the newly-structured proposals would be time consuming, and might not be completed before the proposed fisheries would be over.”

If it really is NOAA’s intent to have both parties come to an agreement then they could help that process by applying equal measures like warned in the the letter.
_________________________
The world will not be destroyed by those that are evil, but by those who watch them without doing anything.- Albert Einstein

No you can’t have my rights---I’m still using them





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#955997 - 04/20/16 08:24 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Lucky Louie]
Rivrguy Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 4498
Loc: Somewhere on the planet,I hope
Quote:
If you'd like to let Jay Inslee know your thoughts on these negotiations if that is what you'd call them, here is link that will let you voice your opinion to him.
I sent him a note letting him know I back WDFW's decision not to agree with the tribal demands of having no PS fishing season this year.
Even if we end up with no season, I commend WDFW for having the backbone to say no to the tribes.


Well deep in the bowls of the Governors staff one might try JT as she pulls most of the strings. I doubt if this Governor has any real feel for the issue other than staff reports.
_________________________
Dazed and confused.............the fog is closing in

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#955999 - 04/20/16 09:06 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Rivrguy]
stonefish Offline
King of the Beach

Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 5187
Loc: Carkeek Park
Originally Posted By: Rivrguy
Quote:
If you'd like to let Jay Inslee know your thoughts on these negotiations if that is what you'd call them, here is link that will let you voice your opinion to him.
I sent him a note letting him know I back WDFW's decision not to agree with the tribal demands of having no PS fishing season this year.
Even if we end up with no season, I commend WDFW for having the backbone to say no to the tribes.


Well deep in the bowls of the Governors staff one might try JT as she pulls most of the strings. I doubt if this Governor has any real feel for the issue other than staff reports.


Who is JT, Inslee's chief of staff or something like that?
If so, got an email address?
I've been on an email binge.....
Thanks
SF
_________________________
Go Dawgs!
Founding Member - 2023 Pink Plague Opposition Party
#coholivesmatter

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#956000 - 04/20/16 09:11 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: stonefish]
Rivrguy Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/03/09
Posts: 4498
Loc: Somewhere on the planet,I hope
JT Austin
Policy Advisor
(360) 902-0638
jt.austin@gov.wa.gov

JT AUSTIN – POLICY ADVISOR 360.902.0638 JT.AUSTIN@GOV.WA.GOV
AGENCIES
Agriculture, Department of
Fish and Wildlife, Department of
Natural Resources, Department of
Recreation and Conservation Funding Office
State Parks and Recreation Commission
WA State Conservation Commission
ISSUES
Columbia River BiOp
Culverts Case
Farmland Preservation
Fish Consumption and Public Health
Fisheries Management
Forest Management
Genetically Modified Organisms
Marine Spatial Planning
Mining
Outdoor Recreation
Salmon Recovery
Treaty Rights at Risk
Voluntary Stewardship Program
Wildlife/Wolf Management
Working Natural Lands


Edited by Rivrguy (04/20/16 09:32 AM)
_________________________
Dazed and confused.............the fog is closing in

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#956001 - 04/20/16 09:43 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
Sky-Guy Offline
The Tide changed

Registered: 08/31/00
Posts: 7083
Loc: Everett
What you wont read in the news releases are how the meeting went down yesterday.

The story I have heard second hand is that the meeting started with the Puyallup Tribe representative standing up and saying there would be zero sportfishing allowed in the Puyallup River and no sportfishing anywhere in PS should have any impacts on Puyallup Chinook this year.

Then The Muckleshoot Tribe stood up and demanded no Fishing in MA 10, and only in the northern half of MA9 for Chinook only(this is new) and no fishing in Elliot Bay, the Lake, etc.

Director Unsworth then got up and said (and I paraphrase) I guess we dont have anything to discuss here after hearing those ultimatums, and the meeting adjourned.



We must all stand behind the Director and WDFW staff 100% for saying "No Deal" to completely unreasonable demands!
_________________________
You know something bad is going to happen when you hear..."Hey, hold my beer and watch this"

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#956009 - 04/20/16 10:13 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
BW Offline
Spawner

Registered: 04/04/00
Posts: 749
Loc: LAKEWOOD,WA,USA
As a PSA South Sound board member I have been waiting for some kind of statement to come out after the email that we received yesterday.

Fact is there was a unanimous vote of the Puget Sound Sportfish Advisors for WDFW, CCA, PSA, and some other sports groups to go forward with the "No Agreement".

The new Director and his staff them went into the meeting with the tribes and you know he rest.

The director has stuck his neck out for us and is under a tremendous about of pressure because of this and we need to step up and stand behind him. I'm sure there will be more about this by others further up the chain than I and I'm sure I will hear more tonight at our chapter board meeting.
_________________________
Everyone's superman behind the keyboard

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#956010 - 04/20/16 10:19 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Rivrguy]
stonefish Offline
King of the Beach

Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 5187
Loc: Carkeek Park
Originally Posted By: Rivrguy
JT Austin
Policy Advisor
(360) 902-0638
jt.austin@gov.wa.gov

JT AUSTIN – POLICY ADVISOR 360.902.0638 JT.AUSTIN@GOV.WA.GOV
AGENCIES
Agriculture, Department of
Fish and Wildlife, Department of
Natural Resources, Department of
Recreation and Conservation Funding Office
State Parks and Recreation Commission
WA State Conservation Commission
ISSUES
Columbia River BiOp
Culverts Case
Farmland Preservation
Fish Consumption and Public Health
Fisheries Management
Forest Management
Genetically Modified Organisms
Marine Spatial Planning
Mining
Outdoor Recreation
Salmon Recovery
Treaty Rights at Risk
Voluntary Stewardship Program
Wildlife/Wolf Management
Working Natural Lands


Thank you for the info Rg.
Email will be sent tonight in support of the director and his staff.
SF
_________________________
Go Dawgs!
Founding Member - 2023 Pink Plague Opposition Party
#coholivesmatter

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#956011 - 04/20/16 10:21 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
Todd Offline
Dick Nipples

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 27838
Loc: Seattle, Washington USA
My understanding is that Dir. Unsworth has the full support of Gov. Inslee for everything he has done thus far.

Fish on...

Todd
_________________________


Team Flying Super Ditch Pickle


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#956014 - 04/20/16 10:31 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
BW Offline
Spawner

Registered: 04/04/00
Posts: 749
Loc: LAKEWOOD,WA,USA
I have taken some comments from the email that went to members. After the meeting tonight and if there still has been no statement from those at the meeting I will post the entire email in the morning.
_________________________
Everyone's superman behind the keyboard

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#956015 - 04/20/16 10:36 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: Sky-Guy]
Todd Offline
Dick Nipples

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 27838
Loc: Seattle, Washington USA
Tom Nelson from the Outdoor Line talked to the Governor's Office on a conference call yesterday and was told just that..that the Governor supports Dir. Unsworth in walking away from the table and going straight to NOAA-F.

Fish on...

Todd
_________________________


Team Flying Super Ditch Pickle


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#956016 - 04/20/16 10:37 AM Re: North of Falcon/PMFC update [Re: ]
wsu Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 06/23/04
Posts: 419
Originally Posted By: Myassisdragon
" My understanding is that Dir. Unsworth has the full support of Gov. Inslee for everything he has done thus far. "

???

Where did that come from? That goes opposite from what few of the folks close to this are saying...


My understanding is that unsworth now has the governors support but that wasn't necessarily the case prior to this past weekend.

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