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#964086 - 09/08/16 12:32 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Sky-Guy]
FleaFlickr02 Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/28/09
Posts: 3339
They do care about conservation; they just prefer to let us bear the burden.

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#964089 - 09/08/16 01:07 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Sky-Guy]
Carcassman Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7592
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
Clearly. And the courts, so far, support them in that view.

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#964093 - 09/08/16 02:27 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Sky-Guy]
GodLovesUgly Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 1249
Loc: WaRshington
_________________________
When I grow up I want to be,
One of the harvesters of the sea.
I think before my days are done,
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#964094 - 09/08/16 02:32 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Sky-Guy]
bhudda Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 04/06/11
Posts: 219
Loc: S River central
Release all live WILD Chinook..
-good luck Chinook!
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#964100 - 09/08/16 03:48 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Rivrguy]
deerlick Offline
Spawner

Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 560
Loc: around
Originally Posted By: Rivrguy
Quote:

This is all wrong, there was nothing but skinny, depressed, starving coho coming from the ocean this year, how can this be ?


Where did you get that information from? From what a lot of guys found was Coho in numbers and in good condition. Keeping in mind numbers relative to the forecast. It has been Chinook that tanked from the git go so I am trying to figure out the disconnect.


I believe I read the same thing right here from smalma

"It is interesting how many salmon management experts are on this site and taking part in this thread.

I wonder how you folks would have fared say last year if you were in charge of the management of our salmon. As many of you no doubt recall the coho fishing this time of year last year was off the charts. The various beach fisheries were about as good as it gets and the creel checks also indicated exceptional fishing. Presumably if we are going to make early in-season adjustments in fish runs the sport catches are were we would likely look; with high catch rates (especially if there is substantial effort) would equate a large run (more fish??).

As you may recall the Snohomish forecast for wild coho (driven by record estimates of wild smolt abundances) was approximately 50,000 fish. By all counts the coho fishing last August and most of September was exceptional and the creel checks at Everett confirm that excellent fishing. Huge number of boats being checked with high catch rates. In fact in the last 30 years those kinds of numbers have been seen only twice. In both of those years the wild coho escapement on the Snohomish were in excess of 1/4 million spawners. Also keep in mind that the wild smolt numbers were 3 million and the parent escapement (the spawners that produced the 2015 adults was 130,000). Would you internet biologist updated the 2015 run size to something larger than 50,000???

Most of you seem more than willing to adjust this year's run size on much more shaky information - incidental angler reports and number of jumping fish. The harsh reality is that the only potential in-season coho model run size adjustments (especially for wild fish) require terminal net catches (tribal) in late September and early October to make any realistic update. Does anyone think with little harvest in front of the terminal areas that early returns might be skewed from past years?

The other issue is that folks seem to have problems with the 2016 forecasts. Again looking at the Snohomish wild coho where the 2015 escapement was 13,000 with a potential total runszie of between 18,000 and 26,000. Given that the ocean conditions in the spring of 2015 (the year that this years adults went to sea as smolts) was much the same as 2014 and the total number of wild smolts were less than 60% of the 2014 numbers (1.6 million verus 3 million) what would you have forecasted.

Anyone willing to offer up their 2015 updates or 2016 forecasts which surely would be substantially better than those produced be the co-managers?

Curt"

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#964107 - 09/08/16 04:47 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Sky-Guy]
Take-Down Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 02/29/08
Posts: 112
This is unacceptable.

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#964116 - 09/08/16 06:18 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Sky-Guy]
GodLovesUgly Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 1249
Loc: WaRshington
Just call and ask Sunset Falls how their counts are looking? Those are real numbers.

Average (AVERAGE) fish size = 8 lbs. numbers are "promising".
_________________________
When I grow up I want to be,
One of the harvesters of the sea.
I think before my days are done,
I want to be a fisherman.

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#964122 - 09/08/16 07:00 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Sky-Guy]
COOPDUCK Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 151
Loc: Lake Stevens
Sad state of affairs. I guess I'm a glass half empty kind of guy, but this thread is a great example of why I just don't have much hope for the future of our salmon. First we're outraged the tribes are fishing on depleted stocks, and with the next breath we're demanding recreational openings up and down the sound. Can we really look at ourselves and say it's all about conservation? When Lake Washington opens in a week or so, how many rod hours will inevitably be spent getting OUR share? I'm not pointing fingers, I want to fish as bad as any of you, and chances are good I'd be out there too. Just a general observation that we're all going to be fighting over the last fish.

Wouldn't it be cool if recs could impose our own self restraint and principle and didn't partcipate in whatever the state throws our way?
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#964123 - 09/08/16 07:14 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: ]
Speyguy Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 07/09/01
Posts: 274
Loc: Bellingham
Originally Posted By: Myassisdragon
Oh this can't be true! These "Actual" fish counts must be jumpers seen by someone at the locks and counted as real fish, or the old plunkers are providing anecdotal count evidence that fish are moving past the boats at Shilshole!

This is all wrong, there was nothing but skinny, depressed, starving coho coming from the ocean this year, how can this be ?

------

Speaking of total closures and your loss of fishing opportunity, lets try this well practiced Cedar River management model quote -

" Doesn't look good as of last month from the WDFW staff for opening the Cedar for steelhead this year, "but may be looked at next year."............................................................................
The Coho in the ocean(and the one's currently being landed by Lummi's) are anything but skinny/depressed/starving......10lb average on one boat. Saw a tote of Lummi fish yesterday that was all big/healthy. Saw a commie gillnetter on Monday who didn't get any, but his friend's had said that they saw a few last week that were pigs (big guy being 18) fishing Samish Bay. Apparently the tribes/white commie's can fish, but we can't. Seems like a really late/normal run to me. King's just starting to filter in....Had a monster on for about 30 seconds on Monday....Assumed it was a king.


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#964129 - 09/08/16 08:44 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Sky-Guy]
Lucky Louie Offline
Carcass

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 2267
WDFW NEWS RELEASE
Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife
600 Capitol Way North, Olympia, WA 98501-1091
http://wdfw.wa.gov/

September 8, 2016
Contact: Kyle Adicks, (360) 902-2664

Lake Washington to open for coho fishing Sept. 16

OLYMPIA – Anglers will have the opportunity to fish for coho salmon in Lake Washington starting Sept. 16, state salmon managers announced today.

The Washington Department of Fish and Wildlife (WDFW) initially planned to keep Lake Washington closed to salmon fishing due to the low number of coho forecast to return to the watershed this year.

However, the number of fish passing through the Ballard Locks in early September indicates a much stronger run of coho than anticipated, said Kyle Adicks, salmon fisheries policy lead for WDFW.

Earlier this year, state and tribal co-managers agreed to consider allowing a fishery in Lake Washington if more than 10,000 coho were expected to return. The co-managers had projected a run of 4,414 coho to return to Lake Washington this year.

"We now expect far more coho to return than forecast to Lake Washington, allowing for some salmon fishing opportunity," Adicks said.

Tribal co-managers also plan to hold coho fisheries in Lake Washington.

The recreational fishery will be open Sept. 16 through Oct. 31, as it has been in previous years. Anglers can keep two coho but are required to release chinook and sockeye salmon. More details about the fishery are available on WDFW's fishing rule change website at https://fortress.wa.gov/dfw/erules/efishrules/erule.jsp?id=1861

State and tribal co-managers also are evaluating the run of coho returning to the Green River. Similar to Lake Washington, the river has been closed to salmon fishing to protect coho.

WDFW and tribal co-managers likely will make a decision soon on whether to hold coho fisheries in the Green River, Adicks said. Any announcements on the recreational fishery will be posted on WDFW's fishing rule change webpage at https://fortress.wa.gov/dfw/erules/efishrules/


Edited by Lucky Louie (09/08/16 08:46 PM)
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#964146 - 09/09/16 12:48 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Sky-Guy]
Winterun Offline
Spawner

Registered: 11/07/02
Posts: 955
Loc: Tac/Puy
By chance did anyone find out/observe how the "test fishery" went the past couple of days???

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#964147 - 09/09/16 12:51 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Sky-Guy]
Sky-Guy Offline
The Tide changed

Registered: 08/31/00
Posts: 7083
Loc: Everett
I'll find out tonight
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#964152 - 09/09/16 05:28 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Take-Down]
tydy Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 09/08/10
Posts: 130
Loc: Snohomish.,Wa.
Friends, Sport fisherman who ran from everett north, around the bait box on Possesion and shipwreck to Pt.Wells and all the other typical september Coho fishing areas(to see and document for themselves.) are reporting so many fish on the fish finders, unlike anything seen for years. especially north of the tulip bubble area near Spi-be-dah. straight out in the middle, thick,thick runs. all waiting for the rains to push them up river (or be gill netted)
this Bs management by our state is costing the local economy huge coin. Lets do some test fisheries immediately similar to Chinook test fisheries and lets see. open the sound now!!!
If the tribes get 3-weeks & 2-3 days per week, give us some days at least. I think the Sportees should do a one day protest fishery for coho C&R only. at least bring some attention to what the tribes are doing or not doing.

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#964157 - 09/09/16 07:29 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: tydy]
blackmouth Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/05/04
Posts: 2572
Loc: right place/wrong time
Originally Posted By: tydy
I think the Sportees should do a one day protest fishery for coho C&R only. at least bring some attention to what the tribes are doing or not doing.

Good idea. When?
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#964180 - 09/11/16 12:40 AM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: Todd]
Sol Duc Offline
April Fool

Registered: 06/18/01
Posts: 15727
Originally Posted By: Todd
The State needs to open Puget Sound to sport hatchery coho retention immediately, and probably open the Sky and the Skagit, too.

Fish on...

Todd


This is a no brainer, so it wont happen.
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#964189 - 09/11/16 04:04 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: ]
Bucket/Good Sport Offline
Kitsap's Crankiest Contractor

Registered: 11/24/03
Posts: 2268
Loc: Poulsbo
Originally Posted By: stam
Originally Posted By: RowVsWade
Did anyone actually believe that the Indians GAF about conservation? Why would they not fish? There are no repercussions for them or any of the lawless things they do. There are 2 distinct classes of people in this state and 2 sets of completely different rules.

In the meantime expect to pay a lot more for a lot less while the Indians fu.ck this state into a barren wasteland and WE pay for it.


Bonus for the savages being... when it's all done and over they get to play some flute music, bang a tom-tom and blame it all on the whites while the average joe lines up to suck them off and apologize.


BINGO--we have a winner!!!
_________________________
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#964190 - 09/11/16 06:23 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: blackmouth]
tydy Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 09/08/10
Posts: 130
Loc: Snohomish.,Wa.
i say do it Saturday 9/ 17 en mass area 9, 10 & 11. everyone go out and troll with gear, no hooks. lets not risk our boats, lets just show of force the numbers of sports fisherman that are out there. its like we don't exist to the state fisheries managers. our whole state government from the governor on down mismanages absolutely everything they touch. when will it stop??

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#964192 - 09/11/16 08:00 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: tydy]
paguy Offline
Juvenile at Sea

Registered: 04/15/11
Posts: 113
Boy, The water off Port Angeles sure looks fishy right now. Pretty sad that I'm one of the second class citizens of this state that cant go fishing.


Edited by paguy (09/12/16 04:35 PM)

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#964197 - 09/11/16 10:15 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: tydy]
Bay wolf Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 10/26/12
Posts: 1057
Loc: Graham, WA
Originally Posted By: tydy
i say do it Saturday 9/ 17 en mass area 9, 10 & 11. everyone go out and troll with gear, no hooks. lets not risk our boats, lets just show of force the numbers of sports fisherman that are out there. its like we don't exist to the state fisheries managers. our whole state government from the governor on down mismanages absolutely everything they touch. when will it stop??


I'm in, unfortunately though, I don't have a boat. But I will contact all the news agencies letting them know what's going on. I can also fish ( or pretend to) from shore or ride along if anybody participating has an empty seat.
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#964221 - 09/12/16 03:41 PM Re: Their 50%: Central sound tribal Coho Fisheries [Re: tydy]
stonefish Offline
King of the Beach

Registered: 12/11/02
Posts: 5187
Loc: Carkeek Park
Originally Posted By: tydy
i say do it Saturday 9/ 17 en mass area 9, 10 & 11. everyone go out and troll with gear, no hooks. lets not risk our boats, lets just show of force the numbers of sports fisherman that are out there. its like we don't exist to the state fisheries managers. our whole state government from the governor on down mismanages absolutely everything they touch. when will it stop??


Just a thought if you plan to organize a fish in.
Why not the weekend of the 24-25th rather then the 17th.
The 24-25th would have been the Everett derby. I'm sure some folks that work weekends may have requested vacation days to fish the derby prior to the announced agreements and closures.
If the derby was on, a lot of folks would have planned to be on the water that weekend anyway.
Just a suggestion.
SF
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