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#268169 - 06/16/04 02:21 PM Help for the libs after Nov.
Theking Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 4756
Loc: The right side of the line
FDA Panel Backs Implant To Counter Depression
washingtonpost.com - June 16, 2004
A surgical implant that stimulates the brain should get government approval to treat chronic depression, an expert panel of federal experts said yesterday -- marking the first time an implanted device has been recommended for the treatment of a psychiatric disorder.

Using a technique known as vagus nerve stimulation, the device uses electrodes implanted in the neck to activate brain regions that are believed to regulate mood.

The decision by an expert advisory panel of the Food and Drug Administration came after a day of clashing scientific opinions about whether the data submitted by the manufacturer were adequate for approval. Proponents of the device prevailed, citing the desperate need of patients with chronic depression that does not respond to existing treatments.

"We lost four of these individuals in the last 2 1/2hours," said A. John Rush, a psychiatrist at the University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center at Dallas, basing that figure on the high suicide rate among patients with resistant depression.

The verdict by the advisory panel came after FDA scientists and some panel members argued the data presented by the manufacturer to show the device works were not convincing.

The agency is not required to follow the guidance of its advisory committee but usually does.

The device has been used in the United States since 1997 to control epileptic seizures. The manufacturer, Cyberonics Inc. of Houston, hopes to expand its market: Fifteen to 25 percent of the 19 million Americans with depression may not respond to available treatments, Rush said.

The implant involves connecting a wire to the left vagus nerve in the side of the neck; a battery is implanted high in the left chest or under the armpit, and the amount of current can be regulated externally. Typically, the implant sends a 30-second pulse of current followed by a five-minute pause, 24 hours a day.

Karmen McGuffee of Garland, Tex., told the panel she had tried virtually every antidepressant drug on the market before getting the device. Improvement came within weeks, she said.

"My mother said she wasn't looking into the eyes of a dead person anymore," she said. When people asked why she was willing to get an implant, she replied, "I had nothing to lose."

McGuffee was paid by Cyberonics to testify. Rush, who was paid to conduct some of the clinical trials, said there are 30,000 suicides a year in America, about 80 percent of them attributable to depression. Half of those are among patients with treatment-resistant depression who had tried multiple therapies and were still not better, he said.

In response to suggestions by some panel members that the company conduct another trial, Rush warned, "In the time to do another trial, we will lose another 1,000 patients a month, 36,000 if the trial takes three years."

Still, at least two members of the eight-member panel said the company had not provided sufficient evidence.

"It's possible this is a viable treatment; it is also possible it is not a treatment," said Richard P. Malone, a psychiatrist at Philadelphia's MCP Hahnemann University. "I'm not sure it is ethical to give a treatment for which there is not substantial evidence."

Malone and another panel member, statistician Jonas Ellenberg, nearly convinced other panelists that the company should conduct another trial, but the proposal was shot down after a tense vote, with one panelist changing her mind. The chairwoman of the panel, Kyra Becker, a neurologist at the University of Washington School of Medicine in Seattle, cast the deciding vote.

The panelists mostly agreed that the data presented by Cyberonics had problems but were swayed by the lack of alternative treatments and the evidence that the device is generally safe, based on its widespread use to reduce epileptic seizures.

Cyberonics' central study was a randomized trial involving 221 patients. All received implants, but the power was turned on for only half the group.

Of 111 patients getting stimulation, 17 showed an improvement of at least 50 percent on a psychiatric scale of depression after 12 weeks. Of 110 patients getting "sham" treatment, only 10 showed similar improvement. The difference between the groups was not statistically significant, however.

The company conducted a separate analysis with patients in another study. This group involved 124 patients who were similarly ill but were not getting vagus nerve stimulation. The company showed trend data that over 12 months, patients with the device were significantly better compared with those getting drugs or electro-convulsive therapy.

Malone, Ellenberg and the FDA's statisticians expressed worry that the two groups of patients were not comparable and the apparent benefit might be statistically spurious. Cyberonics officials argued that conducting a new trial would be problematic because of the special needs of this patient group.

For more news, or to subscribe to the newspaper, please visit http://www.washingtonpost.com

Copyright 2004 washingtonpost.com
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#268171 - 06/17/04 09:59 AM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
stlhead Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 6732
Maybe it was one of those Alien anal probes?
_________________________
"You learn more from losing than you do from winning." Lou Pinella

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#268172 - 06/17/04 11:28 AM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Stew Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 10/31/02
Posts: 305
Loc: Extreme Left of Center
Theking do you ever fish? Or do you just come here and post stupid stuff?
I think grandpa even fishes once in awhile
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#268173 - 06/17/04 11:35 AM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Theking Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 4756
Loc: The right side of the line
Stew,

A second grade play ground challenge how unique.

Off your meds today? The guy in town that acts like you has started taking Librium you might give it a try I notice he paces and talks to himself less.
_________________________
Liberalism is a mental illness!

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#268174 - 06/17/04 02:35 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Stew Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 10/31/02
Posts: 305
Loc: Extreme Left of Center
Quote:
Originally posted by Theking:
Stew,

A second grade play ground challenge how unique.

Off your meds today? The guy in town that acts like you has started taking Librium you might give it a try I notice he paces and talks to himself less.
You just answered my question
What was that line that Forrest Gump used?
Oh yeah...stupid is as stupid does! TK you are and you do :p
_________________________
RELEASE WILD TROUT and STEELHEAD

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#268175 - 06/17/04 03:00 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Theking Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 4756
Loc: The right side of the line
Come on Stewie you can do better than that. At least call me a neocon or something
_________________________
Liberalism is a mental illness!

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#268177 - 06/17/04 03:18 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Stew Offline
Returning Adult

Registered: 10/31/02
Posts: 305
Loc: Extreme Left of Center
quote:
Originally posted by Theking:
Come on Stewie you can do better than that. At least call me a neocon or something
_________________________
RELEASE WILD TROUT and STEELHEAD

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#268178 - 06/17/04 03:25 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Pmartin Offline
Spawner

Registered: 09/24/01
Posts: 769
neoconservativism [n]

1) an approach to politics or theology that represents a return to a traditional point of view (in contrast to more liberal or radical schools of thought of the 1960s)
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This nation will remain the land of the free only so long as it is the home of the brave.
—Elmer Davis

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#268179 - 06/17/04 04:22 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Theking Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 4756
Loc: The right side of the line
AM,

Coming from a lib it's a dig. Kinda like a white guy using the N word when it's a term of endearment between the Brahs
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Liberalism is a mental illness!

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#268181 - 06/17/04 05:10 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
goharley Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/27/02
Posts: 3188
Loc: U.S. Army
Quote:
Originally posted by Pmartin:
... a return to a traditional point of view
That would also be regression and stagnation. Is that what you really want for our country?

And how far back for that "traditional point of view?" Segregation? Women's Sufferage? Prohibition?
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Tent makers for Christie, 2016.

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#268182 - 06/17/04 05:18 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Theking Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 4756
Loc: The right side of the line
Well AM I have never fit into a box.

I am hawkish in all aspects of my life not just Foreign policy.

I am isolationist only in terms of reserving the right to do the right thing for the US once negotiations have gone as far as they can go.

I am a constitutionalist. I want less federal Govt and then only to oversee defense.


I believe social issues are best handled within a community not by the Federal govt.

I believe in a hand up not a hand out.

I hold people accountable for their actions.

I think the death penalty is for cowards who abdicate murder to the state. I think prison should be hell on earth appropriate to the crime.
_________________________
Liberalism is a mental illness!

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#268183 - 06/17/04 05:23 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
eddie Offline
Carcass

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 2384
Loc: Valencia, Negros Oriental, Phi...
TK, there are a number of your desires that I agree with - however - the devil is always in the details.
_________________________
"You're not a g*dda*n looney Martini, you're a fisherman"

R.P. McMurphy - One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest

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#268184 - 06/17/04 05:56 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Theking Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 4756
Loc: The right side of the line
Not if you live by a set of standards that is a basis for society and stick to them.
_________________________
Liberalism is a mental illness!

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#268185 - 06/17/04 06:12 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
eddie Offline
Carcass

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 2384
Loc: Valencia, Negros Oriental, Phi...
TK - the issue is that there is not one set of societal standards that we all agree on.
_________________________
"You're not a g*dda*n looney Martini, you're a fisherman"

R.P. McMurphy - One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest

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#268186 - 06/17/04 07:21 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Theking Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 4756
Loc: The right side of the line
Does not matter . We need to pick the majorities and deal with it. Trying to meet everyones needs you meet no ones. Even when I did not believe in God( I needed proof first) I realized that the basic principles of the bible where designed to help a large group of people with different minds live together.
_________________________
Liberalism is a mental illness!

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#268187 - 06/17/04 07:36 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
jeff'e'd Offline
Spawner

Registered: 07/10/00
Posts: 948
Loc: Snohomish, WA USA
Now I'm confused.... I thought the Bush admin was neocon, not in line with the true conservatives of the Republican party who don't believe in driving large deficits and mucking up the constitution with frivilous amendments, like the one on gay marriage.

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#268189 - 06/17/04 07:47 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
eddie Offline
Carcass

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 2384
Loc: Valencia, Negros Oriental, Phi...
TK - Let me play devils advocate for a moment on your let's pick the majorities standards and go with that. Our founders, whom I greatly admire and respect, chose a form of government and governing laws that specifically protect the minority. I am not predisposed to accept the logic, rightness, or inevitably of what the majority believes. After all, the majority in this country (at one point) believed in slavery, the majority (at one point)said Women can't vote. The tyranny of the majority is something that the US Constitution specifically protects us from. And I like it that way.
_________________________
"You're not a g*dda*n looney Martini, you're a fisherman"

R.P. McMurphy - One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest

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#268190 - 06/17/04 08:02 PM Re: Help for the libs after Nov.
Theking Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 10/10/03
Posts: 4756
Loc: The right side of the line
Eddie,

You are right on! pick any point of discussion and lets see if we can balance everyones needs fairly. I will start off with one that the right over complicates. Gay rights. No such thing! We all have the same rights to life liberty and the pursuit of happy faces.
_________________________
Liberalism is a mental illness!

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