"while simulaneously flipping this country's constitution and basic principles on their heads. "

That's the freedom I am talking about. If Iraq had been easy those lost freedoms would be permanent. As it is, things have been bungled so badly that all of that crap is now called into question. There's still a chance we can survive as a free semi-democracy.

Eddie, what we need is to get out and then have a large trial on the charges of treason.

NookieDreaming, I am glad your son came out of that ok. Its a tough deal over there, and i am constantly amazed at the quality of our soldiers, and their ability to go on with the missions. I do remember somewhat our reasons for going there in the first place. I would like to remind all that our senators and congressmen and women after hearing intelligence and such did vote to do this thing. Now its unpopular and a lot of them are changing their ways. If everyone would get out of the way, and let the military do their job, this would be over pretty soon, or may have already been over, right or wrong. Now if we don not get this behind us, and win also I might add, I think you all better start reading the Koran, because your life is going to change. Sorry, I guess I just like to finish what I start. I will pray for yours just like I have been praying for mine. I wish you well.


CPO RET USN

I am truly humbled by the amount of support I have recieved since I first posted. Thank you all, for me and my son. I truly believe that this "police action" in Iraq is only the precursor to more troubles which lie ahead. Someone pointed out that if WE had been invaded, that we would react the same way. Point taken. However, I believe that this conflict is only the beginning of a much larger conflagration. Christian VS Muslim war is going to be the next world war. I for one hope that I am on the winning side. If not for my sake, for the sake of my children and grandchildren. Islamofascism is the biggest threat to world peace since Nazi Germany. Let us pray that the rest of the world (especially Europe) comes to the same conclusion before it's too late. I don't want to have to send my sons and grandsons to liberate Europe again, as our fathers and grandfathers had to do.
The fate of our world hangs by a thread..

Don't forget about Christian fascism. IMO, what just happened in Gaza with Hamas taking control, which is now a Palestinian civil war, is more fuel on the fire. If it continues Israel will be drawn in and that will be the catalist.

fas·cism –noun 1. a governmental system led by a dictator having complete power, forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism, regimenting all industry, commerce, etc., and emphasizing an aggressive nationalism and often racism.

Some parts of this definition hit pretty close to home. I've never understood the pushing of the term "Islamofacism". It really only began being used as other phrases ran stale ("war on terror").

Stlhead, I don't think Israel wants anything to do with the fighting in Gaza right now. They have stated they won't interfere and I don't see why they would when their enemy is busy killing themselves off and making a Palestinian state less and less likely. I do think you are right though that Israel will be the catalyst to "the big fight", whenever that happens and whatever that turns out to be. I think our blind support of Israel has as much to do with the problem as anything though. How come the "lower taxes" crowd doesn't seem to moan about the $3 to $5 Billion American tax dollars given to Israel each year? It is especially nutty when you realize that much of our political support for Israel is based on fundamental Christian beliefs regarding the return of Jesus and the end of the world. To them, they believe that the Jews must beat the Muslims and be returned their land before the end of the world will come (at which point the Jews will be judged and sent to hell). To me, that is just as scary as the extremist Muslim wackos.

Sorry, I just realized I was starting to go off... apparently time to stop my caffeine consumption.

Yeah Israel would rather sit on the sidelines but that won't happen. Already the US and Israel are easing sanctions to prop up the Fatah against Hamas. Given that, IMO, in the near future Hamas is going to start trying to draw Israel into the conflict. But I am by no means an expert on the middle east and prefer it that way. I wish our government preferred it that way as well.

I couldn't agree more. If we didn't need their oil, we wouldn't even care about that chunk of the globe.

Israel has no oil. Why does the U.S. care about Israel? What do we get for our billions in foreign aid to them every year, except Israel's ememies become our enemies? Lousy deal by my accounting.

well we all know we are getting fed a bunch of [censored] aboutthe war...thing is...is there anything we can do. We've sacrificed so much freedom to be "protected" ...what do you do when you need protection from your [censored] government? Bush is an idiot...but i think he is smarter then he lets on.....but not in any way thats going to help the american people. i have this itch onthe back of my ballsack there is a huge issue behind why we are there and that its bigger than anything weve ever seen. I beleive we are seeing the beginning of the end folks.....look at the way this country has been going for the last 100 years.....look at where we might be in 20 years? its bleek at best. Some big changes are goign to happen in my lifetime.

that said....sorry for your sons...your daughters...but they do keep signing up....war is war....when you sign up for the army or even the reserve....it isnt patty cake your training for. i dont pretend to know anything about training for war or what they are going through. seems to me that they "entice "them to join...nevertheless it is free will.


still pretty gay what Curious George is making our country go through for something so simple....paper with a number printed on it.

i too have friends that are completely f&&&d in the head because of what they went through over there. its not good.

I agree 100%.

The Hamas won't have to draw Israel into a war to start Armageddon...

We'll invade Iran, and Iran will shoot missiles at Israel. China, who gets its oil from Iran, will fight us there. Don't be surprised if Russia, who also gets oil from Iran, is also not on our side.

The United States and Israel against Russia and China, fighting it out in Israel and in Iran...that is where it starts.

This happy message brough to you by the Apocolyptic loonies that by hook or by crook have actually been given the reins to drive our country's wagon.

Fish on...

Todd

I'm pretty sure Russia is already in the game. We Backed what became the Taliban against Russia and look what happened...bled Russia dry and no more super power. I'm thinking Iran isn't making the weapons they are supplying the "insurgency" with and they do have a very cozy relationship with Russia. [censored] for tat and no more super power. Unfortunately this world war we'll be the ones lacking in allies.
Merg, be glad that people enlist otherwise you'd have been drafted years ago.

Aunty, it's not about Islam, just like the war in Iraq, and in Afghanistan, is not about Islam.

They're about money, money and oil.

When we cut off China's supply of oil by attacking Iran, they'll be there in a flash...that's why Japan attacked us at Pearl Harbor, we cut off their oil supply...what else could China possibly do?

Here's one thing they could do...call us on our debt, thanks to Dumbya's folly in Iraq, that China owns...they own the paper on our "spend billions on war while cutting taxes" debt. That would plunge us into a depression that would be far worse than before.

China's thirst for oil is right up there with ours, and they have no love for us...they need the oil.

Fish on...

Todd

If there was a single person with a brain running the show, we'd partition Iraq and give the peices to the neighbors which lent a hand in it's destruction:

1/3 To Kuwait
1/3 to Saudi Arabia
1/3 to Turkey

Then we get out and turn a blind eye to Brutal Repression of Insurgency Eastern Style.

It all used to be Turkey anyway, and it was The UK's asinine partition of The Ottoman Empire that started all this for the most part, so I vote we give most back to Turkey, and say "Sorry about or British Friends back in 1918, They were Empire Happy. If we'd have known better we'd have sided with You and Germany and avoided alot of this heartache."

George W, the Commander in Chief, and Conduhleeza. Reminds me of Ted Danson and Whoopi.

Thanks Auntie, but I don't think it is straying too far from my original post. It seems it has had the desired effect in getting people to talk about it in depth. Everyones opinions are equally important(with the exception of the Merg's)..Snicker, just kidding. Anyways, I think this has been a sort of healing process for me, to read what others may think, be they conservative, liberal or otherwise. The Middle Eastern Countries hate Israel because it's almost like having a little USA in their own back yard. If they all rose up to try to destroy Israel, I'm sure that we would be compelled to assist them in any way our government felt was nessecary. It's about so much more than oil. It's a culture clash.

I couldn't agree more, Nookie. I certainly appreciate the opportunity to toss my ideas out there and hear what others have to say, even if I don't agree with everything I hear. It is also refreshing to see a bunch of fishing junkies that are able to have a civil conversation about something that stirs such passion.