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#540283 - 09/23/09 02:27 PM Its not a tax!
willametteriveroutlaw Offline
Spawner

Registered: 10/26/02
Posts: 908
Loc: Idaho
Who does he think he is kidding? Gotta love our "celebrity" President.

BTW KK and Todd, this did come from Fox news so its an obivious mistruth.


A proposed requirement that all Americans buy health insurance does in fact include a "tax" increase, according to the Senate -- even though President Obama insisted Sunday that it "absolutely" does not.

Obama gave ABC News' George Stephanopoulos a stern talking-to Sunday for suggesting that the mandate to buy health insurance would amount to a tax. He even taunted the host for citing the dictionary definition of "tax" to make his point.

"The fact that you looked up Merriam's Dictionary, the definition of tax increase, indicates to me that you're stretching a little bit right now," Obama said.

But the language of the health care reform plan proposed by Sen. Max Baucus, D-Mont., explicitly labels the penalty attached to the mandate as an "excise tax."

Penalties for failing to obtain coverage would range from $750 to $3,800 under the plan. This is addressed in a section labeled: "Excise Tax."

"The excise tax would apply for any period for which the individual is not covered by a health insurance plan with the minimum required benefit," the Baucus plan says.

Republican strategist Brad Blakeman said Obama just got busted.

"The president cannot orate himself out of this one. If it feels like a tax, it says it's a tax -- Mr. President, it's a tax," Blakeman said.

House Minority Whip Eric Cantor, R-Va., said Monday at a forum in Richmond that the House treats the penalty the same way.

"The president was on TV last night or yesterday morning saying 'no no no, it's not new taxes,' whereas in this bill and in the Senate bill both, it calls what they are charging employers and individuals a tax. It's an IRS section of our bill," he said.

The Baucus plan does not describe the requirement itself as a tax -- just the penalty.

But Julian Epstein, former Democratic counsel to the House Judiciary Committee, said the requirement is no different from requirements to obtain auto insurance.

"It's called personally responsibility," he said.

Obama and Stephanopoulos got in a testy exchange over the matter Sunday on "This Week."

"Under this mandate, the government is forcing people to spend money, fining you if you don't. How is that not a tax?" the host asked.

Obama argued that the government would be providing tax credits for those who have trouble affording coverage, and that Americans who have insurance are already paying hundreds extra in premiums to cover uncompensated care.

"That may be, but it's still a tax increase," Stephanopoulos said.

"No. That's not true," Obama said. "I absolutely reject that notion."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YFxomW3RqYY


Edited by willametteriveroutlaw (09/23/09 02:36 PM)
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#540286 - 09/23/09 02:29 PM Re: Its not a tax! [Re: willametteriveroutlaw]
Todd Offline
Dick Nipples

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 27838
Loc: Seattle, Washington USA
Looks to me like it's a "tax" if you don't get covered...not a tax increase for coverage...talking apples and oranges...

That's like going out and buying a car, paying the sales tax, and then claiming you have now suffered a tax increase.

Fish on...

Todd
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#540290 - 09/23/09 02:44 PM Re: Its not a tax! [Re: Todd]
willametteriveroutlaw Offline
Spawner

Registered: 10/26/02
Posts: 908
Loc: Idaho
Todd,

By your logic, is a cigarette tax a tax? What about an alchahol tax?

If goverment forcing someone to purchase something, or taxing them if they dont.. How the fuk is that not a tax?

Main Entry: 2tax
Function: noun
Usage: often attributive
Date: 14th century
1 a : a charge usually of money imposed by authority on persons or property for public purposes b : a sum levied on members of an organization to defray expenses

Hmm, reminds me of "sexual relations" from Clinton. Bush was too dumb to come up with this kind of rhetoric.
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#540292 - 09/23/09 02:56 PM Re: Its not a tax! [Re: willametteriveroutlaw]
Todd Offline
Dick Nipples

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 27838
Loc: Seattle, Washington USA
Two different things...

He said requiring someone to buy health insurance is not a tax.

Being penalized with an excise tax for not buying health insurance does not somehow turning buying health insurance into a tax.

Fish on...

Todd

P.S. Lots of things in both state and federal government are penalties that are defined as "excise taxes" because taxes can't be discharged in bankruptcy, too.
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#540296 - 09/23/09 03:11 PM Re: Its not a tax! [Re: willametteriveroutlaw]
goharley Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 03/27/02
Posts: 3188
Loc: U.S. Army
Sounds to me like law abiding citizens won't get taxed.
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#540313 - 09/23/09 04:22 PM Re: Its not a tax! [Re: goharley]
AP a.k.a. Kaiser D Offline
Hippie

Registered: 01/31/02
Posts: 4450
Loc: B'ham
The Baucus plan is junk.

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#540321 - 09/23/09 04:56 PM Re: Its not a tax! [Re: AP a.k.a. Kaiser D]
Todd Offline
Dick Nipples

Registered: 03/08/99
Posts: 27838
Loc: Seattle, Washington USA
Originally Posted By: Kaiser D.
The Baucus plan is junk.


+234,356

Fish on...

Todd
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#540322 - 09/23/09 05:09 PM Re: Its not a tax! [Re: Todd]
Mikespike Offline
MPD

Registered: 01/02/08
Posts: 2544
Loc: Santa Rosa, CA
SeaStrike says he heard the fish are biting.... wink

in before the slugfest smile
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"Holy hell son, you're about as useful as a cock flavored lollipop."

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#540518 - 09/24/09 09:16 AM Re: Its not a tax! [Re: ]
ParaLeaks Offline
WINNER

Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 10363
Loc: Olypen
Can you tell me why the opposite of PROgress is CONgress?

Interesting, isn't it? smile
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Agendas kill truth.
If it's a crop, plant it.




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#540519 - 09/24/09 09:20 AM Re: Its not a tax! [Re: ParaLeaks]
ParaLeaks Offline
WINNER

Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 10363
Loc: Olypen
The CONgressive party......hmmmmm.
_________________________
Agendas kill truth.
If it's a crop, plant it.




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#540782 - 09/24/09 11:09 PM Re: Its not a tax! [Re: Todd]
Timber Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 05/27/00
Posts: 2447
Loc: Stumpy Acres
Originally Posted By: Todd
because taxes can't be discharged in bankruptcy, too.


Really?? and I thought you were a lawyer (jobless of course)

I am not and know that yes unless it is a tax that is withheld from an employee it is possible to bankrupt on..My understanding is that Fed. tax is 3 years and state is 10 and state is only if there have not been any leins placed for said amount for that period...GOOGLE it T

Back to the law books for you T
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