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#609960 - 07/09/10 09:53 AM Ultimate All Star Game: Classic vs Modern Baseball
Mingo Offline
Three Time Spawner

Registered: 03/27/05
Posts: 1474
Loc: Kona, Hawaii
Baseball lovers unite! All Star time is here............imagine for a moment the Field Of Dreams is a real place. That Iowa cornfield just opened up a new wormhole to the past for a best-of-7 series between the Classic Baseball All Stars and the Modern All-Star Team of choice. If you love baseball as I do, imaginary contests like these make you drool. Imagine the Babe stepping in against CC Sabathia or Lefty Grove trimming the tip of Albert Pujol's nose like an eskimo with an ulu knife, then standing on the mound egging him to charge..............imagine Ty Cobb being interviewed by Bob Costas, and his reaction when Costas tells him we have a black president......rofl



I do not think modern players are pussies.............not even close. I think there are some truly awesome ballplayers in the game today, guys who would damn near kill themselves competing in a Classic All Star series against these titans of the past. But I also do not think the Classic players of the deadball and 1920s/30s era teams get their just due when it comes to matchup discussions against modern players. I think too much stock is placed on "modern training", weightlifting and "athleticism", whatever the hell that means. Being able to high jump 6 feet or dunk a basketball doesn't mean you can take Mariano Rivera downtown 450 feet…..and the old time ballplayers were one hell of a lot more athletic than they get credit for.



What is at stake? $1,000,000 in cash to each member of the winning team and bragging rights for eternity. Cash is still handy in the afterlife and Ruth will spend his on hookers and booze long before the cornfield beckons them back to heaven.

Series Format: Equalizers are in place to make this fun to watch and as fair as possible. Here are the equalizers:

Games 1 and 2 - Modern equipment and rules will be used. The Classic players can use their hunks-of-beef -jerkey gloves if they want, but I think someone like Honus Wagner will immediately see the benefit of a modern glove versus his hand-size piece of hide. Batting helmets are required. Yeah Babe, you gotta wear one. Dont' worry, you'll still look cool......and I’m sure you’ll get laid before and after every game. Modern clubhouses will be used, including Air Conditioning, massages and clean water. Just keep the Babe away from the sandwich platter until after the game! Fresh baseballs will be used constantly, just like usual. Imagine the Babe, Cobb, Sisler and Hornsby getting to swing at a WHITE baseball for a change! I wonder if that extra visibility will help them pick up the pitch? Modern pitching rules are in force- no spitballs, cutballs, shineballs allowed. Brushbacks will happen, but are so frowned upon now that a pitcher will be warned immediately and will likely get tossed by the ump. Grove will need to tone down his temper. Modern bats, batting gloves and body armor can be used. I wonder if Gehrig and Hack Wilson can generate some bat speed with a 28 oz ash whip like the ones McGwire used? The designated hitter rule is in effect.

Games 3 and 4 - Classic-era equipment and rules will be used. that's right. A-Rod and Jeter MUST to use a hand-size hunk of T-bone for a glove, just like Lajoie, Gehringer, Foxx, Ruth and Speaker had to use. Good luck guys.....Classic Clubhouses will be used. NO air conditioning. No plasma screen TVs. No "relaxation lounges". No batting cages. NO BATTING HELMETS! ARod gets to bat wearing just his hat. Just like they did in the Classic age. Yep, you might take one in the melon and end up in the morgue or with serious brain damage. Still want to do this Alex? Oh, and NO BATTING GLOVES! Oh, better watch that blister big fella! New baseballs will NOT be used every pitch. The ball will be used until it is so dirty brown it looks like a giant Milk Dud, just like the ones Mickey Cochran and Bill Dickey had to swing at and catch every game. NO BODY ARMOR. Woops........did the Big Train's sidearm heater get a little too close to your ribcage Ichiro? Are you gonna charge the mound? Are you gonna cry? no, he won't cry....like I said, the modern players are NOT pussies. I thnk they will do everything they can to win. But I wonder who will opt out of the series, fearing for their own safety and endorsement deals down the road?

Damn wouldn’t this be fun to watch! Here is the killer.......ONLY CLASSIC-ERA BATS WILL BE USED. No super-light modern whips.....plain old heavy hickory or other Classic-era wood will be the only bats allowed, with thinner barrels and thicker handles. I remember watching some modern All Stars a couple years ago try to hit using these ancient war clubs. It was pretty funny to watch, they did very poorly using them...it looked like a little kid trying to swing daddy's bat. Classic pitching rules are in force. Spitballs? Cool! Brushbacks? Hey, you missed him, try again! Oh, and no designated hitters allowed. Pitchers hit for themselves.

Game 5 - Modern Equipment and Rules

Game 6 - Classic Equipment and Rules

Game 7 - coin toss decides the rules


A couple key point to consider - do NOT rely on the tired and easy lines you hear so often, like "these guys couldn't even stand on the same field with Albert Pujols or Derek Jeter, today's players are so much better and more athletic" or "those guys never played against integrated teams, they would get killed in games against modern players" nonsense. Think about it first. The main reason a lot of people today think the ballplayers of yesterday sucked is because the actors that played them in the movies sucked. John Goodman is not Babe Ruth and Ray Liotta sure as hell ain't Shoeless Joe Jackson. As for the clowns trying to look like ballplayers in “8 Men Out” ???? what a joke…………..

Classic-age MLB stars did play lots of games against Negro League all stars. They beat those all-star teams and got beat by them in other games, but they did play against each other on a regular basis. Satchel Paige was in his early 20s when he gave up a 480 foot homer to Babe Ruth when Ruth was 42 and retired. Don't think for one second Paige was easing up on the Babe....not on your life. This Classic All Star Team is integrated anyway, to capture some of the prodigious talent of the Negro League stars of yesteryear.......heh!





The top pitchers of that time threw ridiculously hard. Paige and Johnson were both stated on good authority to have legit 100+ mph fastballs. Paige’s was witnessed by Buck O’Neill, a Negro League star and Paige teammate and frequent guest on baseball talk shows until his death a few years ago. Johnson’s fastball speed was verified not only by his opponents but was verified by several people including Clark Griffith, who witnessed Bob Feller's speed measurement using a police motorcycle and said “Bobby is quick, but Walter was faster”.

Ruth and Foxx were prodigious sluggers in a day when stadium configurations did not favor home runs and the rules were different. In their heyday, a homer that passed the foul pole in fair territory but hooked and landed in foul territory was a foul ball. By today's standards, Babe Ruth would have hit 106 dingers in 1926, with very few pitches in the strike zone to swing at.





To be considered for my Field of Dreams Classic All-Star Team, each player had to have started his Major or Negro League career no later than the 1930s. I trimmed and trimmed and limited it to a 26-man roster. I had to leave off some incredible talent to keep the roster this small.....people like Al Simmons, Frankie Frisch, Sam Crawford, Paul and Lloyd Waner and all the Delahanty brothers plus Dizzy Dean and many othersl got cut. The assumption is that all of the Classic All Star players arrive for the series at age 27, their physical prime. This seems fair given they are all dead and have to compete against young bucks who grew up with good medical care, innoculations from disease, toothpaste, anitbiotics, safe painkillers and vitamins.

Mingo's Classic All Star Team:

Manager: John McGraw (imagine the fireworks if he thinks the umps made a bad call against him!)

Outfielders: Ty Cobb, Tris Speaker , Joe Dimaggio, Ted Williams, Shoeless Joe Jackson, Cool Papa Bell, Oscar Charleston

SS- Honus Wagner - 'nuff said. He plays every inning of every game. Try and pull him out and you'll get a fat lip from those giant veiny arms!

1B- Lou Gehrig, George Sisler

3B- Jimmie Foxx, Mel Ott (Foxx played third at times and I want his bat in there!)

2B- Nap Lajoie, Rogers Hornsby , Charlie Gehringer (Gehringer or Hornsby could spell Wagner if he got hurt, but it would take a bullet to keep him out for the whole series)

C - Mickey Cochran, Bill Dickey , Josh Gibson (I predict some nasty collisions at the plate)

Designated Hitters- Babe Ruth, Hack Wilson

Starting Pitchers- Lefty Grove, Walter Johnson, Christy Mathewson , Cy Young

Relievers - Babe Ruth, Carl Hubbel, Satchel Paige

What about guys like Cobb? How would he do against the modern players? I'd sure like to see for myself. Imagine Ichiro at 6'1" with more power and the same superhero speed......and a VERY nasty disposition.

Think of the other awesome events planned for the Classic vs Modern Series:

Bud Selig gives Cy Young a………. Cy Young award

Babe Ruth and David Ortiz compete in a "who has the widest face" contest

Babe Ruth takes on everyone in beer guzzling and hot dot eating

Jimmie Foxx and Albert Pujols in bench press and barrel-of-nails lifting contests

Ichiro and Cool Papa Bell in a 100-meter sprint

And just imagine the home running hitting contest..............good lord that would be entertaining.

Okay................put your team together and share your opinions. You get to choose any players who started their careers in the 1980s or later. Anyone you want. Who wins? Do the Classic players of old even stand a chance?
_________________________
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Bankers are twats that have been hated throughout history - Dan S.

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#610017 - 07/09/10 04:40 PM Re: Ultimate All Star Game: Classic vs Modern Baseball [Re: ]
Castingpearls Offline
Repeat Spawner

Registered: 03/26/08
Posts: 1240
Loc: The Rock
I might put together a lineup later but I know for a fact that it would have to have Willie Mays in center.

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#610023 - 07/09/10 05:06 PM Re: Ultimate All Star Game: Classic vs Modern Baseball [Re: Castingpearls]
Irie Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/26/06
Posts: 4317
Loc: South Sound
It would be interesting to watch as a modern 2nd baseman gets a good ole-fashioned set of file-sharpened cleat-spikes in the face from Ty Cobb during a slide-in tag out.

I'd also like to see the old timer's reaction to the modern regs against tobacco.


Edited by Irie (07/10/10 03:07 AM)

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#610105 - 07/10/10 01:53 AM Re: Ultimate All Star Game: Classic vs Modern Baseball [Re: Irie]
Carcassman Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7657
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
That skips the in-between group that might be the best of the lot, the 40s-60s.
Outfield? Mickey, Willie, The Duke of Flastbush, Henry, Roberto; you are close to 2,000 homers there.
Infield? Stan, Brooksie could anchor the corners; need some guys up the middle.

At catcher you could go to Yogi or Bench.

Then, moving to the mound you could trot out Koufax, Drysdale, Gibby, Whitey, Spahnie; there's probably 1,000 wins there and then you could Wynn, Seaver, Ryan, Carlton.

I like the idea of sending the modern guys up there without all that gear; juust teh bat.

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#610128 - 07/10/10 11:18 AM Re: Ultimate All Star Game: Classic vs Modern Baseball [Re: Carcassman]
Mingo Offline
Three Time Spawner

Registered: 03/27/05
Posts: 1474
Loc: Kona, Hawaii
Originally Posted By: Carcassman
That skips the in-between group that might be the best of the lot, the 40s-60s.
Outfield? Mickey, Willie, The Duke of Flastbush, Henry, Roberto; you are close to 2,000 homers there.
Infield? Stan, Brooksie could anchor the corners; need some guys up the middle.

At catcher you could go to Yogi or Bench.

Then, moving to the mound you could trot out Koufax, Drysdale, Gibby, Whitey, Spahnie; there's probably 1,000 wins there and then you could Wynn, Seaver, Ryan, Carlton.

I like the idea of sending the modern guys up there without all that gear; juust teh bat.


True dat! that generation of guys who played from the 50s through the 70s were some TOUGH sumbitches. Put a team together from that era , how do you think they'd do against the Classic All Stars? your outfield is ridiculously talented.....what a team that would be. Willie and Clemente almost ended up in the same outfield!

I agree it would be awesome to not only see modern players play without all the armour and other crap, but I think it would be cool to see who among the crop of guys playing today would have the BALLS to even step into the batter's box wearing nothing on their head but their baseball cap!
_________________________
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Bankers are twats that have been hated throughout history - Dan S.

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#610182 - 07/10/10 03:36 PM Re: Ultimate All Star Game: Classic vs Modern Baseball [Re: Mingo]
Carcassman Offline
River Nutrients

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 7657
Loc: Olema,California,Planet Earth
Yeah. No helmet, digging in, and Big D, Wynn, or Gibby on the mound. They'd spend the whole at-bat looking up from their backside.

I think one thing the earlier (pre-90s anyway) players had is that they were more complete. Everybody batted. Shoot, Drysdale let the Dodgers in hitting one year. Everybody could bunt, well.

The game has gotten too specialized, I think.

That would be a super series to watch.

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