The following was taken from the current issue of Fishing and Hunting News:


Fishing and Hunting News has just published the first part of a two part conversation with state WDFW commissioners Cahill and R.P. Van Gytenbeek. In the first installment Cahill says: "The issue has been fermenting for years, I would call it a culture war between the catch and release fly fishermen, and people who want to take home a fish. It has been a pretty viscious war, They call each other names, yell at public hearings." The article says of Van Gytenbeek> " The proposal to ban wild retention was made by commissioner R.P. Van Gytenbeek of Seattle, an avid fly angler." " He initially proposed a permanent ban. When that failed to pass, however, a six year ban was proposed. When that failed, Commissioner Russ Cahill of Olympia proposed the two year program, which passed by a 5-3 vote." Cahill said of his decision to go along with the compromise: " I think a two year moratorium is a conservative approach, a deep breath, while the WDFW gets the science put together, Then the decision can be made again. That's why I voted for this particular version."

Comments from WDFW went like this: "While wild steelhead moratoriums have been in effect on rivers where steelhead runs are in danger, about a dozen streams on the Olympic Peninsula as well as King County's Green still allowed keeping wild fish. That's because runs on rivers such as the Hoh, Bogey, Calawah and others are at all-time highs, according to Bob Leland, steelhead program manager for WDFW., In fact, WDFW staffers seem to be surprised , if not shocked and dismayed, at the cecision by the commission. If these rivers are in such excellent steelhead shape why the ban? Moreso, why the ban now, when WDFW is still at work on a two -year steelhead stewardship management plan for these rivers?"

And the debate (and BS) goes on.......

I will tell you Grandpa that the WSC is not a flyfishing group. There are lots of gear guys(Todd and I included) and we believe that wild steelhead need more protection because the runs are in trouble.


"That's because runs on rivers such as the Hoh, Bogey, Calawah and others are at all-time highs, according to Bob Leland, steelhead program manager for WDFW., In fact, WDFW staffers seem to be surprised , if not shocked and dismayed, at the cecision by the commission. If these rivers are in such excellent steelhead shape why the ban? Moreso, why the ban now, when WDFW is still at work on a two -year steelhead stewardship management plan for these rivers?"

How can the Hoh be at an all time high when it won't make escapement this year? The Quillayute system is declining for the 6th year in a row and according to WDFW's own numbers are not at an all time high. Frankly I don't trust some of what I hear from Bob Leland and Bob Gibbons(they did speak at a WSC meeting), if steelhead numbers are declining under their management plans then maybe they are wrong.

JG..remember..I am gathering opinions from all over and posting them...not necessarily agreeing with them....

We will get a new governor but Gary GridLocke might appoint the next two commissioners before he leaves. We have high hopes that we will finally get a sports fishing advocate on the commission as the mandate that created it promised.

Grandpa: I do not know all the commissioners, but I do know Pete Van Gytenbeck (although I am not sure how to spell his name) Pete is a lifelong sports fishing enthusiast. I have fished with Pete several times and can tell you he is an honest, decent, concerned, sports fisherman. Let's not paint them all with the same brush. And yes I think Locke appointed him. While I am not at all happy with many of Locke’s actions or inactions, I fear a right wing, trickle down, free enterprise governor will pack the board with, small businessmen i.e. commercial fishermen.

I would think that if a commissioner's goal were to promote/support small business', he would want to maximize sport fishing.

In a way, each angler is a small business unto himself, not to mention all the small business' he supports in pursuit of his hobby.

Very Accurate. Short and to the point.

I do believe that most of the name calling, at least on the internet, has come from the mouths of the C&R zealots.

Couldnt agree with you more Plunker!

I just read this doing my morning thing.And I say HOG WASH PURE HOG WASH.

Yeah right - it's all selfish elitist C&R flyfishers behind WSR. Just like it's a bunch of ignorant redneck fishkillers against it.

If only the lines were so clear - Good and Evil, Progressive vs Antiquted. Seems both sides are a bit guilty of painting the opposition into convenient stereotypes.

And FYI - i'm for WSR but realize that there are good arguments against a statewide ban as well. There are thoughtful, concerned sportsmen on each side of this "Culture War".

And I'll bet the Commercial contingent is lovin this - one more issue causing hate and discontent among the sporties.

Something to think about - who (or what) is really the biggest threat to your fishery?

My .02,

Brian

Don't throw rocks if you live in a glass house.

Many of us are very passionate about our beliefs and people on both sides of the issue have resorted to name calling or cheap shots at one time or another. However some people choose to resort to the name calling and cheap shots more than others. Some people even seem to do it on a regular basis. Probably because they enjoy the controversy and just get a thrill out it.

Everyone needs to step back a take a deep breath before they decide to make personal attacks or take cheap shots.

C'mon, Plunk.

Dan you are one of the few that I haven't seen using such antics. I wasn't refering to anyone in particular. I've seen it on both sides and I've also been guilty at times. Sometimes its hard not to respond to attacks or cheap shots with attacks and cheap shots. Lets just leave it at that.

I don't know where all the stereotypes come from, but I certainly don't fit them.

1. I haven't gear/baitfished for steelhead in 17 years.

2. I flyfish single barbless for steelhead.

3. I have never in my life killed a wild steelhead.

4. I think blanket WSR is a very bad idea.

I certainly fall into the seattlite yuppy flyfishing camp judging 1-3, but I think WSR is a bad idea for many reasons (obviously this is a rehash):

A. Its going back to the stoneage as far as flexible managment is concerned. The precedent set by WSR for other fisheries managment issues is appalling.

B. It was justified by weak science. The data support habitat/marine conditions being the limiting factor on wild steelhead production not harvest for most WA rivers.

C. Its a resource opportunity grap by elitist flyfishers (like me) from fish bonkers. It is wrong for one group to run another off the river.

I'd sure would like to think that I'm in the no name calling camp.

,


Hmmmmmmmm.

Geoduck,

Either you and I are spies for "the other side", or Cahill's comment, which is echoed by many, many anti-WSR folks (not all, especially you), including the Mayor of Forks, is a load of BS.

I don't even flyfish for steelhead...and only about 20% or so for salmon.

I guess you and I, Geoduck, should just bow out of the discussions, clearly the only people who should be involved are the "urban elitists" and the "logger rednecks", as not only are they the only ones that have a stake in the argument, they're the only ones who ought to be in it at all.

Plunk,

I know that you're too smart, or maybe too savvy, to actually believe some of the stuff you say. I hope that your last comment is one of those. There are other folks who say BS like that and believe it, but I think you just like to stir the pot...especially after a discussion has been started.

I've posted three times as much as you on these topics lately, and I'm sure, without even looking too hard, that I could find at least two or three times more inflammatory things that you've said with no factual basis, and name calling, than I have.

And completely incorrect statements like this coming from the "steelhead program manager", of all people, doesn't make any of you wonder "what the hell is going on down there in Olympia", even a little?

I guess the controversial nature of WSR is pretty intrusive...it's managed to dominate almost every other topic lately.

Fish on...

Todd

Hairlip..........shhhhhhhh!

I admit.......I've been known to slip over the edge into the realm of insulting someone personally. But I try not to.......because when you resort to those tactics, people respond with hostility instead of listening to your point. I guess that should be expected.

Maybe I spoke to soon Dan. But I don't recall you throwing mud at me

Dan S. & Hairlip -